Originally Posted by jaehshim
you totally misunderstood what I meant.
I said "TURBO M" is not in my formula. Yes the trend is changing, for more power, more torque, better efficiency.
But M should NOT have gone "turbo" like EVERY manufacturer is going, they made a big mistake.
It's sad to see these sports cars going for turbo, JUST for more power all the time, which isn't THE recipe for a true sports car but a "good" recipe for selling more cars.
Kinda funny to say this when i'm owning a 420 horsepower M car, I do think this is well more than enough power for me to enjoy the motor and the car itself both on the road and track. I do believe E46 M3 was a proper, well powered,perfectly engineerd sports car. Naturally aspirated with precise engineering of individual throttle body into mass production vehicle, this was the beauty of M. And this recipe of M continued until the E9xs...
Have you seen the geometry of the new M5 turbo? the turbines are right in the middle between the cylinders, it already smells trouble, over-heat (even with all the cooling they established), highly expected problems in the future.
Every sports car boasts something more than just hp number and look; it's a character.
STi, Evo boasts their awd traction and large amount of horsepower out of an ordinary 4 cylinder.
GTR also boasts its 4wd traction, but with a crazy amount of hp that matches supercar performance.
Mercedes has presented (through highly engineered sports cars and AMG lines) huge engine, stable ride control on motorways. That's why they did not advertise a porsche-collaborated built 500E as the fastest car on the track. Rather, they said it was the fastest car on the autobahn at the time, faster than any BMW or Porsche on highway cruising. Besides the 190E evo, they still boast this recipe for a sports car. Huge engine, rear wheel drive, crazy amount of hp and torque, stable at motorway cruise.
911 turbo has been the huge benchmark of supercar performance with everyday 911 look since the 993 days.
M3 has been a race car (quite literally a race engine...where else can you find a factory mass production engines with individual throttle bodies?) for everyday use. And this is well enough reason to say that 1M is never an M to my knowledge. It's just business marketed, tuned 135i.
Audi has been a turbo beast you take it on Autobahn for long cruise if not a race track (began with 100 and 200, but really with RS2 with porsche collaborated turbo engine and further RS lines until now).
Now, a turbo into M3? It is already losing its heritage. Sure it will be fast as hell, it will have all the torque we always wanted. But will it be a true M? don't take it too cheesy, I think i explained well enough to say that it is highly qestionable about the validity of M recipe in the future M3.
And people will start comparing as it shows on the floor. And honestly I would, too. If I were to choose a turbo car, I'd go used GTR or used 911 Turbo rather than a brand new M car with turbo.
M needs to hit a 20% efficiency gain or the BMW AG board will not approve anything- EFFICIENT DYNAMICS and going green are the way to the pockets of people with money. The new EPA stuff kicks in soon and every brand is working on turbos- even Ferrari, nothing will be immune.
They have tried with NA motors to get the efficiency but it is not possible at the price point of M cars- plain and simple. They didn't want to go turbo for the torque or any other reason it is getting cleaner and more efficient as per world wide regulations- there game has changed. And I hate to bring this all back to Brabham but M built that turbo..