Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2
360 hp sounds reasonable and that makes the 1M about 5% lower power to weight than the M3 and that is ENTIRELY consistent with the way the cars perform. The light weight of the 1M can give it a win on slower/tighter tracks.
What is your better sources? "A bunch of European tests" or whatever you said?
Why do you think there is so much discussion on both 1M vs. M3 and the new M3/4. BMW is dropping their hallmark, long term, pervasive engine philosophy in favor of the cheapest approach. Is that something to be proud of? I still think the M3/4 is likely to be a class leader, but competitors are absolutely catching or exceeding BMW (even with solid rear axles!). They are drastically improving handling and continuing the hp war. The M5 really is not the hands down class leader any longer and that is unfortunately. Let's hope the M3/4 can do better.
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In a perfect world I would like to have every kind of option; powerful NA cars, torquey turbo cars and even efficient diesels. There is a reason for all of them. But there is also a reason why BMW is dropping its trademark as you put it because BMW and M thinks that real good M cars are about the chassis not about the engine. Engines follow the global patterns, trends in economy, in politics, in everything and they change because of that. I am not saying and will never say that turbo is superior to NA, or N54 superior to S65, never. Facts are facts and people need to just get used to certain facts better before than after.
Not many people seem to understand that the competition is catching up on BMW because of the chassis, weight, size and feel not because they all have better engines now.
One point I need to say that it is not only BMW every brand is going with the FI engines. Don't be surprised if Formula 1 allows the turbos again one day and this time with different rules, why not? People associate NA and high rev engines with being sporty and racecar like but this is just a point in history, it can and will change.
Your arguements are well educated but you keep on taking the official numbers about the two cars which cloud your results. The delta between 1M and M3 in hp is much smaller than it looks on factory provided papers and the torque delta is even bigger, combine this with less weight you have extremely close performing cars, not one dominating the other. But this is the least of my points anyway.
And a small note; 1M has a N54T engine not an N55.