09-16-2012, 02:11 PM | #243 | |
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09-16-2012, 02:43 PM | #244 | |
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Pop the hood and three turbos and an a2w staring at you. |
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09-16-2012, 02:44 PM | #245 |
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09-16-2012, 04:10 PM | #247 | |
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And you're not even driving one (Alfa says your info). So go and hang out at the Alfa forum, or the Porsche forum (NA) ? |
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09-16-2012, 06:46 PM | #248 | |
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it's like comparing the iphone 5 to an android, and your argument why the iphone is not great is because it was derived from the 4S. |
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09-16-2012, 08:59 PM | #249 |
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Looking at pictures, it looks like the new turbo engine has two air boxes. The one in the right of pictures gets air from front of car and feeds it to the air box on the turbo side. is this correct?
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09-17-2012, 12:14 AM | #250 |
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I would say that the MT version will be for north american market only, just like the F10 M5. There was a link posted somewhere in the M5 section on an interview with one of the F10 M5 lead engineers indicating that they would prefer to spend the money into a more useful area elsewhere than developing an MT version for F10 M5... or something to that effect...
Last edited by lmaleke; 09-17-2012 at 05:44 AM.. |
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09-17-2012, 04:43 AM | #251 |
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The main reason because the decision was made for this engine are to get more (as much as possible!) profit out of every sold M3/M4. This firstly ruled out the great and unique but expensive to produce S65 ... not its low mpg rates. Thats the real truth !!! The rest is great BMW marketing !
And also according to all infos from inside the M-GmbH the N55 derivate engine was only chosen because off cost reasons and also its an fact that there exists also an better (turbo)alternative - prefered from most M-GmbH members and technicans ... an V6 BiTurbo derivate from the S63Tü - but the BMW AG ordered the M-GmbH to go with the cheaper and not with the better engine to increase the cars profitability further. Its quoted that the real difference between both turbo engines was below 1.000 Euro per unit. But BMW (the AG) decided that its better to increase the debit over this Euros and the cheaper but (slightly?) inferior engine is enough to make the new F8x better than its predecessors. But in my opinion this is the wrong decision because the M-Spirt is worth more than € 1.000 per car ... just for the future of the brand. Its hard to know that the M3/M4 would have been an even better car as it will be ... only if the M-Spirit fraction (M-GmbH) had won over the cost reduction and profit maximization fraction (BMW AG) !!! Greets Uli_HH Last edited by Uli_HH; 09-17-2012 at 04:49 AM.. |
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09-17-2012, 08:55 AM | #252 | |
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09-17-2012, 10:11 AM | #253 | |
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Well put. The fact that they will be using the M-badge on all "sport" models going forward is a corroborating indicator that BMW is in "M Monetization mode", ie harvesting the cash flow from actual M cars and the M badge/brand. The prior regime of "there will never be a FI M-Car, because that is cheating" is gone and BMW corporate is calling the shots management wise (who runs the M division) and product wise. No one bothers to think about what are the implications of the M division losing their autonomy...but every action BMW has taken thus far is totally consistent with Corporate calling the shots and emphasizing 1) market share expansion; 2) profit maximization per vehicle.
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09-17-2012, 10:22 AM | #254 |
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Some good posts. The S65 is a masterpiece, from response to sound to exclusivity. However, the engine is only one part of an M-car and, for me, certainly lags behind what they do with the chassis and how this thing handles. I anticipate it will be great along with minimal lag and hopefully a 7500-7700rpm redline.
No doubt, I love high revving NA engines and can understand frustration that BMW have not at least bored out the I6 to 3.2 liters. Maybe they will argue there was no point, and maybe that is true, but it does seem like it could well be cost cutting to use the same displacement. For those who live in europe the mpg boost is essential, for others in america it's welcome but not as necessary. I signed up looking for info on the F82 but I may well end up ordering another E92M. It's not that I doubt that the F82 will be great (and it will certainly be faster), it's just that other than Porsche the NA reign looks to be coming to an end. |
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09-17-2012, 11:33 AM | #255 |
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... my hopes remain that BMW will develop a similar division to the "Black" at MB but with a devoted GTS / CL philosophy ~Frost
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09-17-2012, 12:02 PM | #256 | |
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In town, the mpg of the S65 and a tuned 450 hp N55/54 are almost the same. |
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09-17-2012, 02:13 PM | #257 | |
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Mercedes new 5.5 liter V8 returns more than 30mpg in the SLK. True, all of these figures will drop when driven hard but a TTI6 doesn't need to be driven above at least 3k at all times like our S65s. Again, I'm a huge S65 lover but I don't think it can be denied the new one is almost certain to be far more efficient. |
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09-17-2012, 02:45 PM | #258 | |
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And it is NA and makes +500 Nm and is as light as N54. |
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09-17-2012, 02:54 PM | #259 |
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09-17-2012, 02:57 PM | #260 |
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I referenced Euro gallons which are larger than a US gallon. The point stands, newer cars are making more power yet delivering improved economy.
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09-17-2012, 03:45 PM | #261 |
Track? What Track? I was just riding along . . .
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09-17-2012, 06:43 PM | #262 |
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Refrain from what if's until the final product is delivered, NA or turbocharged, to me it doesn't really matter as long as it delivers an all overall great driving experience from an M car. Which means to me, that an M car can be driven on a daily basis comfortably then also taken to the track as the owner chose on the weekends.
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09-17-2012, 07:53 PM | #264 |
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I can understand profits but could have the thought the fan base wanted the I6 and the power bump too? And least a manual for the us..
I do wish they kept the S65 but at least the x55 block isn't that bad: http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...1&d=1303136356 It's not like the c63 or exclusive rs5 are cheap or light years beyond M. And if the f8x isn't popular BMW will be forced to bring the s65enstein back to life. |
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