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      05-01-2012, 02:21 PM   #67
PostModernHero
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PKumarM3 View Post
definitely not aggressive enough for me.
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Originally Posted by BMWI6 View Post
NOT aggressive enough
Huh?!? What is this "aggressive" anyway? Do you want to convey the image of wanting to run someone over in the street?? You want your car to have a pissed off look as you cut someone off???

This is a rediculous trend and it has to stop somewhere, people. When you have Acura or whatever commercials sporting (in the stuffiest drawl possible) phrases like, "Aggressiuwwon... in it's most elegant form" and generic Hyundais now running around that look like angry june beetles... the trend is OVER!!!
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      05-01-2012, 02:34 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PostModernHero
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Originally Posted by PKumarM3 View Post
definitely not aggressive enough for me.
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Originally Posted by BMWI6 View Post
NOT aggressive enough
Huh?!? What is this "aggressive" anyway? Do you want to convey the image of wanting to run someone over in the street?? You want your car to have a pissed off look as you cut someone off???

This is a rediculous trend and it has to stop somewhere, people. When you have Acura or whatever commercials sporting (in the stuffiest drawl possible) phrases like, "Aggressiuwwon... in it's most elegant form" and generic Hyundais now running around that look like angry june beetles... the trend is OVER!!!
Post of the day!! And I agree.
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      05-01-2012, 02:51 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by PostModernHero View Post
Huh?!? What is this "aggressive" anyway? Do you want to convey the image of wanting to run someone over in the street?? You want your car to have a pissed off look as you cut someone off???

This is a rediculous trend and it has to stop somewhere, people. When you have Acura or whatever commercials sporting (in the stuffiest drawl possible) phrases like, "Aggressiuwwon...... in it's most elegant form" and generic Hyundais now running around that look like angry june beetles... the trend is OVER!!!
Does not compute! Invalid input! ERROR! ERROR! System shutting down!
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      05-01-2012, 03:03 PM   #70
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Also glad BMW isn't jumping on the crazy LED light bandwagon. Fercrissakes, cars are starting to look like Christmas trees! I think if they were making the movie Vacation today, the family truckster would most definitely have LED lights all over it.
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      05-01-2012, 03:40 PM   #71
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Hmmm, next time Jason or someone interviews an M manager ,we should try to confirm the exact reasons for the different model designation, I would not think that choice of materials would drive such a difference, rather a difference in size/platform such as in the past with the e65/e66 7ers to differentiate the longer wheelbase... but you never know.
With the F10 M5 over 85% of the components were changed out completely or modified. With that much difference from the base model it is really no longer developmentally appropriate to utilize the same F code. With the F80 M3 even more of the components will be differing from the base car so the decision was made to move to an M F code rather than F30M.

It is not for the general population or enthusiasts it is more for internal documentation, supplier part numbering and testing. The basic underpinnings of the 5/6/7 are essentially the same as are the 1/3 just scaled differently. It is the other bits that are what makes it all so different.

This also allows the M variants to have different life cycles and be developed alongside the base car rather than after it. If you have noticed the M cars can now be completed more rapidly- the early involvement of M allows this. Instead of M waiting for the AG engineers to finalize something they can do there own thing (using the basic chassis in white) as they now have that ability.

The new 1 Series 3 door hatch is a prime example of this- M will be launching their version alongside the base version. In reality the F80 is not that far off but there are marketing reasons for its developmental pace to launch.

I talked with Dr. Nitschke on Sunday- he said that the technology they are using (F80) will be surprising and that should be the focus of attention rather than cylinder count or if "i" or "v". The car will surpass the E90 in every way possible- performance, efficiency and at the scales. He was more interested to discuss the US fascination with manuals in the M5 and M6.... (hint at the latter).
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      05-01-2012, 04:05 PM   #72
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Please shop out the chrome grill and make black. Thanks
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      05-01-2012, 04:49 PM   #73
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it's nice but not aggressive enough
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      05-01-2012, 05:01 PM   #74
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it's nice but not aggressive enough
LOL
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      05-01-2012, 05:29 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
With the F10 M5 over 85% of the components were changed out completely or modified. With that much difference from the base model it is really no longer developmentally appropriate to utilize the same F code. With the F80 M3 even more of the components will be differing from the base car so the decision was made to move to an M F code rather than F30M.

It is not for the general population or enthusiasts it is more for internal documentation, supplier part numbering and testing. The basic underpinnings of the 5/6/7 are essentially the same as are the 1/3 just scaled differently. It is the other bits that are what makes it all so different.

This also allows the M variants to have different life cycles and be developed alongside the base car rather than after it. If you have noticed the M cars can now be completed more rapidly- the early involvement of M allows this. Instead of M waiting for the AG engineers to finalize something they can do there own thing (using the basic chassis in white) as they now have that ability.

The new 1 Series 3 door hatch is a prime example of this- M will be launching their version alongside the base version. In reality the F80 is not that far off but there are marketing reasons for its developmental pace to launch.

I talked with Dr. Nitschke on Sunday- he said that the technology they are using (F80) will be surprising and that should be the focus of attention rather than cylinder count or if "i" or "v". The car will surpass the E90 in every way possible- performance, efficiency and at the scales. He was more interested to discuss the US fascination with manuals in the M5 and M6.... (hint at the latter).
Very interesting insight, thanks for the useful details.

If I had a single request that you impress upon Dr Nitschke for the upcoming M3 / M4 / M4GC, please, I implore ///M, please no bs active sound technology, Id rather no sound at all than to live knowing that BMW couldn't take the time to make a proper engine tune for the future ///Ms.
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      05-01-2012, 07:30 PM   #76
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He was more interested to discuss the US fascination with manuals in the M5 and M6.... (hint at the latter).
Yea it better get a proper stick shift..
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      05-01-2012, 08:00 PM   #77
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Interesting. When one thinks about it logically, in all likelihood, the new M3 performance gains will probably be more incremental. We know what the new 1M and M5/6 can do performance wise in a straight line and on a track, so the new M3's performance will be most likely between the current model M3/1M and the M5/6. Larger car, more fuel efficiency, slightly less weight, new technology that will most likely try to "mimic" the linear power delivery characteristics of the S65 but with more torque. We already know what a ~450 hp NA M3 can do with less weight and superior race-like suspension (the current M3 GTS and CRT). We have seen that chassis and driving dynamics wise, the new 3-series essentially is slightly better vs. the old. Also, if the old E60 M5 had the new M5's clutch, think there would be more debate as to which car is "better" driving experience wise. Seems pretty unlikely we'll see a quantum leap in performance, but ultimately, we'll see what happens!


Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
With the F10 M5 over 85% of the components were changed out completely or modified. With that much difference from the base model it is really no longer developmentally appropriate to utilize the same F code. With the F80 M3 even more of the components will be differing from the base car so the decision was made to move to an M F code rather than F30M.

It is not for the general population or enthusiasts it is more for internal documentation, supplier part numbering and testing. The basic underpinnings of the 5/6/7 are essentially the same as are the 1/3 just scaled differently. It is the other bits that are what makes it all so different.

This also allows the M variants to have different life cycles and be developed alongside the base car rather than after it. If you have noticed the M cars can now be completed more rapidly- the early involvement of M allows this. Instead of M waiting for the AG engineers to finalize something they can do there own thing (using the basic chassis in white) as they now have that ability.

The new 1 Series 3 door hatch is a prime example of this- M will be launching their version alongside the base version. In reality the F80 is not that far off but there are marketing reasons for its developmental pace to launch.

I talked with Dr. Nitschke on Sunday- he said that the technology they are using (F80) will be surprising and that should be the focus of attention rather than cylinder count or if "i" or "v". The car will surpass the E90 in every way possible- performance, efficiency and at the scales. He was more interested to discuss the US fascination with manuals in the M5 and M6.... (hint at the latter).

Last edited by FogCityM3; 05-01-2012 at 08:10 PM. Reason: misspelling and additional point
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      05-01-2012, 08:59 PM   #78
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Our current M3 looks way better..this is a clean design, but very boring. Granted, if the power dome and hood intakes re-appear then it might be interesting...
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      05-02-2012, 12:59 AM   #79
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It's ride height is way to high in those resets compared to the spy shots! This maybe what people think is missing
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      05-02-2012, 04:42 AM   #80
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Our current M3 looks way better..this is a clean design, but very boring. Granted, if the power dome and hood intakes re-appear then it might be interesting...
No it doesn't. You people are saying that because you have the current M3. You wait and this new M3 will pwn the E9X M3's ass. Besides, the E9X M3 was such a failure when it followed the E46.

This M3 is going to be way better than the guzzling E9X and it will depreciate the shit out of the E9X when it's released.
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      05-02-2012, 04:43 AM   #81
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Nice rendering.

It looks like a 335 with Sport package. Not good.
True but still looks much much better than the E9X.
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      05-02-2012, 04:45 AM   #82
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Love the vid and the best part is the roar of that e92
sounds like it's coming from the F80
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      05-02-2012, 04:46 AM   #83
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boring
but better than the E9x
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      05-02-2012, 09:38 AM   #84
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I talked with Dr. Nitschke on Sunday- he said that the technology they are using (F80) will be surprising and that should be the focus of attention rather than cylinder count or if "i" or "v". The car will surpass the E90 in every way possible- performance, efficiency and at the scales. He was more interested to discuss the US fascination with manuals in the M5 and M6.... (hint at the latter).
OK ... I think that the new F80M3 would be an great improvement over all previous M3s and we would get an really great sportscar !

BUT Dr.Nischke isn´t right when he stated that the engine desision shouldn´t count or none should put this desision in the focus of attention.

Its right in the hp point of view, if the F80M3 would ~200kg lighter as the ongoing M3, none should be afraid of the coming hp-numbers ... 450 to 460hp would be great ... on the other hand also 420 to 430hp should be enough - but that doesn´t meen, that they could simply choose thís AG-engine, which is the cheapest to fulfil their hp-predictions. The M in BMW and more the M in M-GmbH stands for Motor/engine and therefor all previous M3 has one common property - the unique and M-specific engine that only remotely are based on an AG-engine ... in N/A times AG-engines must be strongly modified to become an powerfull M-engine and the peak of development was the great and totally unique S65 V8 ... sadly in turbo times its much more simple to get more hp out of an standard engine - make it stronger so that it would withstand the higher pressure and put an better (greater!) turbosystem on it to achieve the needed hp-numbers - but an pimped N55 with an stronger crankcase and an TriTurbosystem would never be an M worthy engine ... the same is the case if the new M engine would be based in the same manner on an N55 successor (N56?) !!!

Thats meen, that - because the great S65 is sadly ruled out, because its an really expensive engine ... and the engine must be based on an existing engine layout from the cost reduction point of view - the only M worthy engine would be the developed V6, because only this engine fulfil the previously sacred requirement of an unique, innovative and M specific engine !


An M3 with an cheap AG-based engine could be an great performer but thats meet not that it would be automatically an great M3 ... an lightweight M3 with an unique engine wuod be an great performer an an real great M-car ... also all rumors say the F80M3 with the AG I6 would be great, but the F80M3 with the V6 would be greater/faster/better in all respects !!!

Greats Uli_HH

Last edited by Uli_HH; 05-02-2012 at 10:03 AM.
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      05-02-2012, 10:59 AM   #85
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Highly unlikely to be the case. When you look at it objectively all the components are in place for the opposite to be more likely, ie the current M3, especially the E90 due to its rarity, should hold its value well and potentially acheive collector status. Even today, try to buy a used E90 for a significant discount--the actual depreciation is not where it should be. In high income/high demand locales, you are already seeing used low mile E9x M3's being priced not very far from new ones and E90s being unbuyable.

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Originally Posted by Calmwinds View Post
No it doesn't. You people are saying that because you have the current M3. You wait and this new M3 will pwn the E9X M3's ass. Besides, the E9X M3 was such a failure when it followed the E46.

This M3 is going to be way better than the guzzling E9X and it will depreciate the shit out of the E9X when it's released.
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      05-02-2012, 01:16 PM   #86
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Highly unlikely to be the case. When you look at it objectively all the components are in place for the opposite to be more likely, ie the current M3, especially the E90 due to its rarity, should hold its value well and potentially acheive collector status. Even today, try to buy a used E90 for a significant discount--the actual depreciation is not where it should be. In high income/high demand locales, you are already seeing used low mile E9x M3's being priced not very far from new ones and E90s being unbuyable.
I for one would never buy an M3 sedan, it has the be the coupe. Kind of defeats the purpose. It doesn't have the carbon fiber roof and just doesn't look good at all. Might as well get a 335i sedan.

Sorry but if we're talking M3, we're talking E92....

ALso, the e90 m3 is much more rare because it's not the way to go when purchasing an M3. People buy the M3 coupe because it's better. It will not hold it's value and will be far from being a collector's car. If you're talking collectors, maybe the 1 series M but definitely not an E90 M3 lol
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      05-02-2012, 01:44 PM   #87
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I for one would never buy an M3 sedan, it has the be the coupe. Kind of defeats the purpose. It doesn't have the carbon fiber roof.
oh no, here we go again...
marketing is such a wonderful instrument for automotive companies...

Do you really think that a E92 M3 is any better than any other E9X M3, just because it has a carbon fibre roof ?

Well, that's what marketing wants to believe you, yes.
If you're Michael Schumacher or one of the likes, the carbon roof might save you 1/10th of a second per lap. For all other mortals, it doesn't mean sh*t, except for the looks.
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      05-02-2012, 02:00 PM   #88
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It's about what the marketplace should be telling you and at least so far, the marketplace is saying something about both versions of the E9x M3s. Opinions are relevant inasmuch as they form a consensus relative to actual supply--any one person's opinion is irrelevant when taken outside of a consensus. So for one person who would only consider the 2-door may also be looking at 911 (which incidentally do hold their value more, because of consensus, ie a 911 is more highly demanded relative to supply than an M3). Ultimately the question as to the status of the current gen M3 will be answered in the next 5-10 yrs and after the new one comes out. If I'm wrong and the next gen will be some quantum leap, for any current gen M3 owner, don't think it matters much if their old gen is deemed as inferior, as they probably have the means/resources to buy the new one and move on.

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I for one would never buy an M3 sedan, it has the be the coupe. Kind of defeats the purpose. It doesn't have the carbon fiber roof and just doesn't look good at all. Might as well get a 335i sedan.

Sorry but if we're talking M3, we're talking E92....

ALso, the e90 m3 is much more rare because it's not the way to go when purchasing an M3. People buy the M3 coupe because it's better. It will not hold it's value and will be far from being a collector's car. If you're talking collectors, maybe the 1 series M but definitely not an E90 M3 lol
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