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      09-18-2012, 07:10 PM   #287
FogCityM3
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That would put power to weight in the low 7s / high 6s, vs 7.6 - 7.7 for the M5. Given how composed the new chassis would be coupled with the ride quality enhancements (as seen in F30), there would be some serious cannibalization of M5 sales


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According to a wellinformed source, there will be a 480 hp twinturbo motor with a DCT tranny, the differential will be the same as the F10 M5.
it will be 120kg lighter then the e92.
If it is thrue i will order one as soon as it possible to do so
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      09-18-2012, 09:36 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by Carl Lassiter View Post
Yes it is. You're either hopelessly misinformed or trolling.
Not trolling. E53 X5 as early as 2000. 4.4L V8, 4.6L and 4.8L VEE 8!
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      09-19-2012, 05:45 AM   #289
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.......this NA vs. I6 vs. Turbo vs. V8 thing is getting boring, especially as the same fanboi's seem to cling so dearly to their beloved V8 NA's, and come out with stupid reasons as to why the new M3 is no longer a 'true' M car.

I always make the mistake that fanboi's are all at an age where closed mindedness prevails.....i.e. under the age of 16......sad that the main contenders are significantly beyond this age.
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      09-19-2012, 05:58 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by Hoosiers View Post
Maybe it's the pilot in me constantly needing system data, but considering the diverse automotive backgrounds of the members here I'm surprised I haven't seen more conversations regarding instrumentation. If you've ever owned a GTR, Porsche, or Corvette you understand. I miss the Z06 instrumentation such oil temp, coolant temp, transmission fluid temp, and oil pressure. Give me that and boost px for both turbos.
It is in the works M is said to be developing a system in iDrive for all of these measures and may even make it to the HUD....
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      09-19-2012, 09:52 AM   #291
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Yes,they lifted the 2700 units cap yet they still sold about 60 baby m's a month in the US,compare that to about 750 M3's sold a month in the US. People voted with their wallets which M cars they like best.
Oh, so the Camry is even better than the M3? More people buy Cayennes than 911's, so what your point?
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      09-19-2012, 10:15 AM   #292
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Oh, so the Camry is even better than the M3? More people buy Cayennes than 911's, so what your point?
That's not really a fair rebuttal. Your examples use cars that are cheaper outselling more expensive cars. That's typical. What's not is the more expensive M3 outselling the cheaper 1M. A more accurate scenario would be if M6 sales were destroying M3 sales.
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      09-19-2012, 10:28 AM   #293
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It is in the works M is said to be developing a system in iDrive for all of these measures and may even make it to the HUD....
Don't tease me.
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      09-19-2012, 10:33 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by Hoosiers View Post
That's not really a fair rebuttal. Your examples use cars that are cheaper outselling more expensive cars. That's typical. What's not is the more expensive M3 outselling the cheaper 1M. A more accurate scenario would be if M6 sales were destroying M3 sales.
So a newer, but more expensive car (M6 vs M3) is probably outselling the old, soon to be replaced car.

Cayennes and 911's are roughly priced the same, my point with the Camry was just bait, the Porsche example was meant to be big, fat SUV apples to iconic sports car apples.
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      09-19-2012, 11:17 AM   #295
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So a newer, but more expensive car (M6 vs M3) is probably outselling the old, soon to be replaced car.

Cayennes and 911's are roughly priced the same, my point with the Camry was just bait, the Porsche example was meant to be big, fat SUV apples to iconic sports car apples.
The newer M6 may be outselling the old M3 (not seeing that data though), but the 1M was newer than the M3, so your logic still doesn't work. Also how are Cayennes priced the same as 911's? There's over 30k difference between the vehicles at every trim level i.e. base vs base, S vs S, turbo vs turbo.
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      09-19-2012, 11:41 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by albertabahn View Post
Not trolling. E53 X5 as early as 2000. 4.4L V8, 4.6L and 4.8L VEE 8!
i think you're missing the point...the V8 we're talking about is the S65 found in the e9x M3...
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      09-19-2012, 11:47 AM   #297
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Am I reading this right? Just because BMW didn't sell a gazillion 1M's that is proof that people preferred the M3 V8 to a 1M Turbo I6?

On that basis the best engine in the world is a Toyota Corolla 4 pot NA

Who cares, the new M3 is having inline 6 Turbo engine, it will be better than the outgoing model, both in economy and outright performance. What's not to like?
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      09-19-2012, 11:53 AM   #298
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Originally Posted by NISFAN View Post
Who cares, the new M3 is having inline 6 Turbo engine, it will be better than the outgoing model, both in economy and outright performance. What's not to like?
Stop trying to make sense. The S65 E9x is the greatest car ever and anything before, after or just different sucks.
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      09-19-2012, 12:12 PM   #299
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Originally Posted by NISFAN View Post
Am I reading this right? Just because BMW didn't sell a gazillion 1M's that is proof that people preferred the M3 V8 to a 1M Turbo I6?

On that basis the best engine in the world is a Toyota Corolla 4 pot NA

Who cares, the new M3 is having inline 6 Turbo engine, it will be better than the outgoing model, both in economy and outright performance. What's not to like?
Well apparently fuel economy and horsepower number are all that matter right? corvettes, mustangs, audi rs5, mb c63, lexus IF all put out better hp and fuel economy.
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      09-19-2012, 12:34 PM   #300
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Some here are dreaming,they think a 450hp 3.0 twin turbo will have the same mpg of a 300hp 3.0 twin turbo engine.
The 480hp 3.8 twin turbo v6 gtr engine gets about 16/23 mpg.
The 444hp 5.0 NA V8 found in the Boss 302 17/26 mpg.
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      09-19-2012, 01:24 PM   #301
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Originally Posted by US///M3 View Post
Some here are dreaming,they think a 450hp 3.0 twin turbo will have the same mpg of a 300hp 3.0 twin turbo engine.
The 480hp 3.8 twin turbo v6 gtr engine gets about 16/23 mpg.
The 444hp 5.0 NA V8 found in the Boss 302 17/26 mpg.
Agreed, and real world mileage for the N54/N55 is often much lower than EPA numbers. My wife managed to consistently get 15 mpg with her N54 135i.
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      09-19-2012, 01:28 PM   #302
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True, but remember, while the same block, this will be a modified engine with newer tech. Higher horsepower does not have to equal lower mpg, AMG are proving this.

It's funny how partisan people are in this thread. Guys are either ripping on the S65 or on the I6....there's pluses and minuses to both but at the end of the day I'd bet the house on the fact they'll both go down as worthy M engines.
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      09-19-2012, 01:29 PM   #303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US///M3 View Post
Some here are dreaming,they think a 450hp 3.0 twin turbo will have the same mpg of a 300hp 3.0 twin turbo engine.
The 480hp 3.8 twin turbo v6 gtr engine gets about 16/23 mpg.
The 444hp 5.0 NA V8 found in the Boss 302 17/26 mpg.
The target was a 20% bump in economy over the V8 (IIRC). 6th in the manual is expected to be taller as well as 7 in the DCT as those are rarely if ever used on a track.

I have also heard that this engine is M's first take on using the Valvetronic system to basically emulate cylinder deactivation to improve MPG.

25 mpg on the highway is a round number and seems like it can be done.

My E90 M3 yields a max mpg of 20 when I have a tail wind going down hill and in the city maybe at best snake eyes as I do not have stop/start. It drinks gas like I drink bier

I welcome the fuel economy improvement and while it may not offset the loss of the soundtrack it will be easier on the wallet which unless you print money or have a money tree is always a good thing
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      09-19-2012, 01:48 PM   #304
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Agreed, and real world mileage for the N54/N55 is often much lower than EPA numbers. My wife managed to consistently get 15 mpg with her N54 135i.
True. I actually average 19.8 mpg in my M3 with DCT. 22 mile commute mostly highway with lots of traffic plus weekend driving.
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      09-19-2012, 02:12 PM   #305
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Just as the M3/M4 features a heavily reworked N55 it also carries over the latest M-DCT from the M5/M6 allbeit in a re-altered form in order to be more compatable with the M3/M4 so that quicker shifts suit the more performance orientated M3/M4. A manual will be available also.

The same package will feature on the X4M model but a manual transmission will not be available as there is no market for a manual M SAV.

The 1M was not a volume model as the M3 it was exclusive. ignore the fact that more M3 were sold than 1M because it did not matter the 1M was an exclusive option you either wanted or you didn't and 7,000 global customers wanted one.

The 1M promised everything that was expected of it and the lucky ones that got behind the wheel (including myself) still enjoy that overall character and that the car was an M and of course well received than it's nearest rival the Audi RS 3 which promised much but like all Audi's failed in the most important factors.

For those that say the car was not a true M. Have never got behind the wheel because myself and 7,000 others say differently.
FYI in most of BMW M's markets the M3 is even outsold by the X6M.
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      09-19-2012, 02:21 PM   #306
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Well apparently fuel economy and horsepower number are all that matter right? corvettes, mustangs, audi rs5, mb c63, lexus IF all put out better hp and fuel economy.
Nope who said horsepower?
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      09-19-2012, 02:23 PM   #307
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Originally Posted by Carl Lassiter View Post
True, but remember, while the same block, this will be a modified engine with newer tech. Higher horsepower does not have to equal lower mpg, AMG are proving this.

It's funny how partisan people are in this thread. Guys are either ripping on the S65 or on the I6....there's pluses and minuses to both but at the end of the day I'd bet the house on the fact there'll both go down as worthy M engines.
Well said
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      09-19-2012, 02:28 PM   #308
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Stop trying to make sense. The S65 E9x is the greatest car ever and anything before, after or just different sucks.
My sincere apologies.....I am going to sit on a mountain top and cane myself with some birch until I come round to this fact.
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