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      12-22-2012, 04:50 PM   #1
FormulaMMM
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6MT F10 M5 turbo lag + auto rev match

Quick review by EVO. Suspect the 6MT F80 will have similar characteristics.

I had not previously heard about the auto blipper, rev matcher, what have you.

http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/evoc...al_review.html
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      12-22-2012, 09:44 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post
Quick review by EVO. Suspect the 6MT F80 will have similar characteristics. ]
Hope not!
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      12-22-2012, 10:00 PM   #3
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S85 in the E60 M5 came first, S65 in the E9X M3 followed with very similar engine characteristics.

F10 --> F80? We shall see.
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      12-25-2012, 06:08 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM
S85 in the E60 M5 came first, S65 in the E9X M3 followed with very similar engine characteristics.

F10 --> F80? We shall see.
I don't think so. The S85 and the S65 had similar characteristics, because the S65 was basically the S85 with two less cylinders. Obviously there were other differences, but the blocks were extremely similar.

I don't think we can use the past to predict what the new engine will be like. I think it will either be crap and ruin the character of the M3, or it will be the best thing since sliced bread. I don't think there will be gray area.
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      12-27-2012, 05:27 PM   #5
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No! The new Porsche C4S has this same function. Taking away the option for the driver to toe heel on manual downshift is heresy. Soon there wont be a point to sticking to a manual transmission.
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      12-28-2012, 12:07 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01 View Post
No! The new Porsche C4S has this same function. Taking away the option for the driver to toe heel on manual downshift is heresy. Soon there wont be a point to sticking to a manual transmission.
Don't know why heel-toe wouldn't work, it just won't require any skill. Any heel contact to the gas should do it.

I don't like it either.
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      12-29-2012, 01:58 PM   #7
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The auto rev match in the F10 M5 works only in Sport Mode, so you can still show your heel-toe skills in Sport+ mode.


Best regards,
south
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      12-29-2012, 04:52 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight
The auto rev match in the F10 M5 works only in Sport Mode, so you can still show your heel-toe skills in Sport+ mode.


Best regards,
south
That's cool
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      12-29-2012, 04:56 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01 View Post
No! The new Porsche C4S has this same function. Taking away the option for the driver to toe heel on manual downshift is heresy. Soon there wont be a point to sticking to a manual transmission.
On the 991 the auto rev match is only active when sport plus is enabled. Also, although it was introduced with the C4S launch it is included on all 2013 991s with MT and sport chrono.
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      12-29-2012, 11:42 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by attbimmer View Post
On the 991 the auto rev match is only active when sport plus is enabled. Also, although it was introduced with the C4S launch it is included on all 2013 991s with MT and sport chrono.
Is this new function advantageous to the driving experience? I understand that driver aids as this will promote a heightened driving experience to "less talented" drivers but what does it foundamentally mean as the future of what we can expect from sports cars and the standard of what driving is? Adding aids as these dilute the actual experience of becoming a better driver. Having to combine various physical and mental coordination to manipulate the vehicle to perform to the optimum performance is the actual exstasy of drving. This is what we have at least once experienced and repeat time and time again to repeat this pleasure. If these challenges are taken away and mearly given, then what is the point of driving at all??
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      12-30-2012, 10:53 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RingMeister01 View Post
Is this new function advantageous to the driving experience? I understand that driver aids as this will promote a heightened driving experience to "less talented" drivers but what does it foundamentally mean as the future of what we can expect from sports cars and the standard of what driving is? Adding aids as these dilute the actual experience of becoming a better driver. Having to combine various physical and mental coordination to manipulate the vehicle to perform to the optimum performance is the actual exstasy of drving. This is what we have at least once experienced and repeat time and time again to repeat this pleasure. If these challenges are taken away and mearly given, then what is the point of driving at all??
I don't necessarily care if the auto rev match feature exists as long as it can be turned off. Perhaps those that can't heal-toe will like it. I haven't got my car yet, so haven't tried it myself, but doubt I will use it much. I've been heal-toe down shifting for so many years now, I do it without thinking about.

The way things are going, I'm just glad I can still get a car with a manual trans. I don't think that will be the case for much longer, so I will enjoy it while I can. Hopefully by the time I am forced into a PDK/DCT trans I will be ready for the change. So far, despite trying many times, I'm not there yet.
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      12-31-2012, 12:07 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
The auto rev match in the F10 M5 works only in Sport Mode, so you can still show your heel-toe skills in Sport+ mode.


Best regards,
south
Thats sounds reassuring.
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      12-31-2012, 12:39 AM   #13
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Tried this feature on a 370Z and thought it was pretty cool. Surprised it took so long for other car makers to pick up on this.

But yes it should be defeatable....hopefully via a button by the gear knob so as not to be forced to go through idrive or use the M button to turn it off.
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      12-31-2012, 11:49 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by attbimmer View Post
The way things are going, I'm just glad I can still get a car with a manual trans. I don't think that will be the case for much longer, so I will enjoy it while I can. Hopefully by the time I am forced into a PDK/DCT trans I will be ready for the change. So far, despite trying many times, I'm not there yet.
+1

I fear that the new CAFE standards combined with the low "take rate" for manuals will force the manufacturer's hand and automatic will be the only choice. I tried the 6AT in my 2007 E90 335 - a good transmission, but I've since gone back to MT on both subsequent 335.

The 8AT from ZF has gotten many positive reviews, and appears to be the new BMW "standard".
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      01-01-2013, 01:05 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sensi09 View Post
Tried this feature on a 370Z and thought it was pretty cool. Surprised it took so long for other car makers to pick up on this.

But yes it should be defeatable....hopefully via a button by the gear knob so as not to be forced to go through idrive or use the M button to turn it off.
I too tried it on the 370Z and I think it's an excellent feature.
I've been driving manuals for decades, so rev matching is something any manual driver with some years of driving experience knows about.
Most MT drivers have varying degrees of how well they execute it, and more so, how often they actually employ it.

I don't rev match all the time as it's not necessary to do so all the time every time especially since the advent of syncro's many decades ago.
Realistically it's one of those things you need to learn how to do if you want to drive as smoothly as possible. But it comes from necessity because there was no other way to do it.

After trying it in the 370Z I think it's fantastic as it will assist with rev matching every time, and do it better than most drivers, even experienced ones. Does it take away some "skill"? Sure, ok, you can look at it that way.
Or, you can look at it like the additions of syncro's, which helped improve over all shifting, an removed the need for double clutching.
Heck, there are still some manual drivers who insist that double clutching is still a necessity and "skill".

I do agree it should be something that can be shut off.
I still think that ABS should be able to be disabled, especially for snow/winter driving, but I won't win that argument.
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      01-01-2013, 01:08 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sensi09 View Post
Tried this feature on a 370Z and thought it was pretty cool. Surprised it took so long for other car makers to pick up on this.

But yes it should be defeatable....hopefully via a button by the gear knob so as not to be forced to go through idrive or use the M button to turn it off.
I too tried it on the 370Z and I think it's an excellent feature.
I've been driving manuals for decades, so rev matching is something any manual driver with some years of driving experience knows about.
Most MT drivers have varying degrees of how well they execute it, and more so, how often they actually employ it.

I don't rev match all the time as it's not necessary to do so all the time every time especially since the advent of synchro's many decades ago.
Realistically it's one of those things you need to learn how to do if you want to drive as smoothly as possible. But it comes from necessity because there was no other way to do it.

After trying the auto rev match in the 370Z I think it's fantastic as it will assist with rev matching every time, and do it more accurately and more consistently than most drivers, even experienced ones.
Does it take away some "skill"? Sure, ok, you can look at it that way.
Or, you can look at it like the addition of synchro's, which helped improve over all shifting, and removed the need for double clutching.
Heck, there are still some manual drivers who insist that double clutching is still a necessity and "skill".

I do agree it should be something that can be shut off.
I still think that ABS should be able to be disabled, especially for snow/winter driving, but I won't win that argument.
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