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      05-19-2011, 05:10 PM   #67
iwannabimmer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
BMW has a LONG history of I6 engines. A V6 is not acceptable to BMW people.
Were turbos acceptable on M cars for BMW people? Well, now we have turbocharged M cars and SAVs (with automatic transmission, no less!).

Progress may require traditions to be broken. It wont be the first traditions BMW would be breaking....

A 3.5 bi-turbo V6 may be the future engine.
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      05-19-2011, 05:12 PM   #68
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I hope I'm wrong, but I think it is going to be a cut-down version of the S63.

We've been hearing rumors for quite a while now that the next M3 may have a V6 with turbos. Using a cut-down S63 would be consistent with that rumor. It would also be consistent with how the S62 came about -- as a cut-down version of the V10. There also is a good business case for this approach because of the ability to use most of the M-specific components in the motor across a wider variety of models. Finally, as someone has pointed out already, a V6 would have packaging advantages, which would boost handling.

The cynic in me thinks if it is not a cut-down S63, then it will be a variant of the N54/55 motor.

We've been fortunate to see the golden age of M engineering, but I fear that age will end when the E9X M stops production.
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      05-19-2011, 05:13 PM   #69
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I respectfully disagree. With weight increases and turbos, M no longer stands for motorsport.
I disagree. BMW is dominating the motorsport world, they just finished a 1 2 or 1 3 victory in the Le Mans series in california in M3s up against 911 GT3 etc.

I agree that M cars have become overweight, but this is BMW catering to American sized people and a thirst for HP - bigger engines simply weigh more and require more counter balancing.

If BMW were to build the M cars that they want to build, the pure die-hard M cars, the general public wouldn't buy them (or be able to afford the lightweight parts), and BMW M wouldn't have the profits to continue its existence.
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      05-19-2011, 05:14 PM   #70
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For me the only car that has a sporty future is a 1 serie ///M car. Whatever engine they put in the new m3 it will be a smaller M5. If that s youre thing the new M3 will be for you.
For me, 1 series look so ugly! plus a real M car should have its own engine, not an engine from another car! Also 1M has way lower red line. S65's red line is 8400 RPM.
If the next M3 has V8 and its red line is around 8000 RPM, I will upgrade my e92 to the new F32 model.
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      05-19-2011, 05:23 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prince_of_Persia View Post
For me, 1 series look so ugly! plus a real M car should have its own engine, not an engine from another car! Also 1M has way lower red line. S65's red line is 8400 RPM.
If the next M3 has V8 and its red line is around 8000 RPM, I will upgrade my e92 to the new F32 model.
have you been reading this thread? All the 4 options of the new M3 engine are ported or derived from existing BMW engines (135, 1M, M3, M5)!

if the source is true, BMW is exploring a new way to develop M cars - save money on the engine development and focus on the handling and (hopefully) weight savings.
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      05-19-2011, 05:32 PM   #72
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i'll take 1 or 3
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      05-19-2011, 05:45 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
I hope I'm wrong, but I think it is going to be a cut-down version of the S63.

We've been hearing rumors for quite a while now that the next M3 may have a V6 with turbos. Using a cut-down S63 would be consistent with that rumor. It would also be consistent with how the S62 came about -- as a cut-down version of the V10. There also is a good business case for this approach because of the ability to use most of the M-specific components in the motor across a wider variety of models. Finally, as someone has pointed out already, a V6 would have packaging advantages, which would boost handling.

The cynic in me thinks if it is not a cut-down S63, then it will be a variant of the N54/55 motor.

We've been fortunate to see the golden age of M engineering, but I fear that age will end when the E9X M stops production.
I also think it might be some sort of s63 configuration with 2 less cylinders to get a 3.3l v6 twin turbo with the turbos placed up on top like the current s63
Imo, tuning potential will be crazy.
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      05-19-2011, 05:58 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
I disagree. BMW is dominating the motorsport world, they just finished a 1 2 or 1 3 victory in the Le Mans series in california in M3s up against 911 GT3 etc.

I agree that M cars have become overweight, but this is BMW catering to American sized people and a thirst for HP - bigger engines simply weigh more and require more counter balancing.

If BMW were to build the M cars that they want to build, the pure die-hard M cars, the general public wouldn't buy them (or be able to afford the lightweight parts), and BMW M wouldn't have the profits to continue its existence.
Again, I respectfully disagree. Dominate is definitely too strong of a word. BMW may have won a few races recently, but Porsche ultimately has the highest number of wins.

M cars are not bigger because Americans are overweight. M cars are getting bigger in size and thus weight more. Plus, they keep adding a lot of luxury features that weight down the car.

M cars cost 60-120k. That is a good grip of change. For that money, I am sure they can include more weight saving items if they really wanted to without increase the prices sky high. Besides, they already are saving R & D money by sharing the platform with the regular series.
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      05-19-2011, 06:02 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by crackberry View Post
Plus, they keep adding a lot of luxury features that weight down the car.
Yes but people want these luxury features. For 60K people want to show they have a top performing, but also gadget-full car.

I don't think it is that BMW wants to add useless luxury, they are innovating suspension tuning from in the car and providing the buyer what they want - it is all supply and demand. there is only so much demand BMW can drum up for the bare-bones raw street race car.
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      05-19-2011, 06:05 PM   #76
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That would suck to go from 8 cylinder down to 6...can't beat the sound of an 8 cylinder
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      05-19-2011, 06:08 PM   #77
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lmao~!!!!!!!!
M with V6...go to hell..!!!
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      05-19-2011, 06:09 PM   #78
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lmao~!!!!!!!!
M with V6...go to hell..!!!
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      05-19-2011, 06:10 PM   #79
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for once i actually read the entire thread. .... very interesting. S65 Biturbo.. i think im sticking to M3 then.
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      05-19-2011, 06:18 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antzcrashing View Post
Yes but people want these luxury features. For 60K people want to show they have a top performing, but also gadget-full car.

I don't think it is that BMW wants to add useless luxury, they are innovating suspension tuning from in the car and providing the buyer what they want - it is all supply and demand. there is only so much demand BMW can drum up for the bare-bones raw street race car.
There is a market for people who do not want all that electronic gadgetry. Porsche is a fine example of that with the GT3 line up.

And Porsche is adding things like adaptive cruise control and KERS all while reducing the weight and keeping the price from blowing sky high. Plus, the price range is comparable to M5s and M6s. BMW is getting lazy and greedy imho.
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      05-19-2011, 06:21 PM   #81
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i say straight six , no turbo bullshit .
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      05-19-2011, 06:36 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoosyJoos View Post
I'm actually betting on the v6 bi or tri turbo. Fan boys will cry then they'll drive it and thus the story continues... Just like the v8 haters 5 years ago.
this.
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      05-19-2011, 07:47 PM   #83
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about the X3 M, I personally like the idea of all BMW cars having an M version - gives even the SUV crowd something to shoot for.

I have always wanted an M7 in the lineup.

if you look at the reviews for X5M and X6M they are all raves, so why not?
I agree on the X3M although I am not at all fond of SUVs but because the X3 is already such a good package, to take it that one step further seems to be a natural progression. I think they're going to do it and it's going to be a hit. I'd like to see the M7 too and I don't like big cars. Here again, it'd just be completing the circle.
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      05-19-2011, 07:51 PM   #84
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See! Around 1 year go I said next M3 will keep the V8 but no one believed me. Now here we go!!!!
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      05-19-2011, 07:54 PM   #85
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First choice S65 bi-turbo, second choice detuned S63, third choice V6 turbo, hopefully we never get to choice four.
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      05-19-2011, 07:58 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crackberry View Post
There is a market for people who do not want all that electronic gadgetry. Porsche is a fine example of that with the GT3 line up.

And Porsche is adding things like adaptive cruise control and KERS all while reducing the weight and keeping the price from blowing sky high. Plus, the price range is comparable to M5s and M6s. BMW is getting lazy and greedy imho.
Those that have a gt3/gt2 also have a luxury car. The M3 has not been a track focused car since the e30 and arguably the e36. BMW makes a semi luxurious car and makes it handle and perform well. Porsche makes a car that handles and performs well then makes it daily drivable.
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      05-19-2011, 08:14 PM   #87
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S65 bi-turbo would be the best!
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      05-19-2011, 08:52 PM   #88
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I'll take one no matter what engine. I have no doubt it'll be a great car.
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