Is anyone having issues with front tires at the track?

[BarryB]

Originally Posted by VCP

Stock camber?

Yup aligned to BMW specs THEN dealer lowered to track settings. bass ackwards, I know, but how it's supposed to be done

[Captain Unknown GT4]

I did just check what camber my car got in stock low BMW M track setting. Its - 2 degrees rear and ap -2 front. Like left front was -2 and right front ap -1.65 degrees. I have never check before but I would have guess somthing like this in low track setting. Did not have time to set new alignment and as car feels very god on track I let It stay. But Importent I think to check that nothing has moved from the track drivning I done. Its solid and thats Sweet.

[MRakete]

I am going to swap front and rear springs. Makes no sense to have softer springs in front.

This could be a game changer.

More coming soon.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by MRakete

I am going to swap front and rear springs. Makes no sense to have softer springs in front.

This could be a game changer.

More coming soon.

Not sure what you mean by this ?

Are you going by absolute spring rate alone? If so, you cannot do this since the suspension geometry is significantly different front and rear, which means ratio between the rate of the spring itself and the effective spring rate at the wheel is quite different front and rear.

[MRakete]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Not sure what you mean by this ?

Are you going by absolute spring rate alone? If so, you cannot do this since the suspension geometry is significantly different front and rear, which means ratio between the rate of the spring itself and the effective spring rate at the wheel is quite different front and rear.

Not my first rodeo, amigo. More coming soon.

[Captain Unknown GT4]

Not bad this, a streetcar that got ca. -2 degrees negative camber all around.

[schnell325]

I went to Area 27 in Oliver BC on Monday with the GTS. Did a couple of recognizance sessions to learn the track and learn the car. Thereafter, ran 3x20 minute sessions at 9/10ths.

Started at 26f25r and temps rose to 34f33r with peak temp never getting past 85C. Coupled with my Ground Control front camber plates, wear was near perfect on the front 275/35 19" PSCup2s. Was unfortunately not able to get to do an alignment prior, but was roughly 1 degree more negative than a stock GTS.



I think for ANYONE who tracks their GTS, GC plates are a must.

[redrumm3]

Originally Posted by schnell325

I went to Area 27 in Oliver BC on Monday with the GTS. Did a couple of recognizance sessions to learn the track and learn the car. Thereafter, ran 3x20 minute sessions at 9/10ths.

Started at 26f25r and temps rose to 34f33r with peak temp never getting past 85C. Coupled with my Ground Control front camber plates, wear was near perfect on the front 275/35 19" PSCup2s. Was unfortunately not able to get to do an alignment prior, but was roughly 1 degree more negative than a stock GTS.

Attachment 1664203

I think for ANYONE who tracks their GTS, GC plates are a must.

Tire wear looks great.

[schnell325]

Originally Posted by redrumm3

Tire wear looks great.

Tire wear is phenomenal with the Ground Control plates!!!

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by MRakete

I am going to swap front and rear springs. Makes no sense to have softer springs in front.

This could be a game changer.

More coming soon.

This should be, ummm, eventful. Game changers always are. Bonus points for additional flair when critical thinking is omitted from the start.

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Not sure what you mean by this ?

Are you going by absolute spring rate alone? If so, you cannot do this since the suspension geometry is significantly different front and rear, which means ratio between the rate of the spring itself and the effective spring rate at the wheel is quite different front and rear.

Ever witness an E36 Compact perform acrobatics? Reversing the ratios and geometry deltas on this car would definitely not go unnoticed.

Originally Posted by MRakete

Not my first rodeo, amigo. More coming soon.

In that case...

[johnr265]

Originally Posted by schnell325

I went to Area 27 in Oliver BC on Monday with the GTS. Did a couple of recognizance sessions to learn the track and learn the car. Thereafter, ran 3x20 minute sessions at 9/10ths.

Started at 26f25r and temps rose to 34f33r with peak temp never getting past 85C. Coupled with my Ground Control front camber plates, wear was near perfect on the front 275/35 19" PSCup2s. Was unfortunately not able to get to do an alignment prior, but was roughly 1 degree more negative than a stock GTS.

Attachment 1664203

I think for ANYONE who tracks their GTS, GC plates are a must.

That's fantastic. Thanks for the update. Could you feel a handling difference as well?

[schnell325]

Originally Posted by johnr265

That's fantastic. Thanks for the update. Could you feel a handling difference as well?

Absolutely yes! I hadn't drive Area 27 before but can talk about my little local time attack track. Prior to the GC plates on my GTS my best lap time was 54.3. After the GC plates, and switching to 275/35 19's on the front (that I had no time to break in / heat cycle), my lap record feel to 53.4. The turn in versus stock was significantly improved. The first couple of laps was a learning curve to say the least. The increased cornering speed and lack of understeer was down right amazing!!

Can't say enough about the Ground Control front camber plates

[rr_m]

Track day at Sonoma yesterday running GC camber plates at -3 and the MO1 Mercedes version of the PSC2. Much better wear on the tires, but it sounds like possibly the tire change may not be necessary. In any case, I was very happy with the results. It's been a couple months since I was on the stock setup, but the car felt great and I don't think there was a noticeable difference in the grip on these tires. We were running a slightly different layout, so I can't compare the times directly.

Pics from previous session and yesterday's session.

[schnell325]

Originally Posted by rr_m

Track day at Sonoma yesterday running GC camber plates at -3 and the MO1 Mercedes version of the PSC2. Much better wear on the tires, but it sounds like possibly the tire change may not be necessary. In any case, I was very happy with the results. It's been a couple months since I was on the stock setup, but the car felt great and I don't think there was a noticeable difference in the grip on these tires. We were running a slightly different layout, so I can't compare the times directly.

Pics from previous session and yesterday's session.

Those GC plates are a God send ✔️✔️✔️✔️

[joergm3]

I have the plates also ordered

Originally Posted by rr_m

Track day at Sonoma yesterday running GC camber plates at -3 and the MO1 Mercedes version of the PSC2. Much better wear on the tires, but it sounds like possibly the tire change may not be necessary. In any case, I was very happy with the results. It's been a couple months since I was on the stock setup, but the car felt great and I don't think there was a noticeable difference in the grip on these tires. We were running a slightly different layout, so I can't compare the times directly.

Pics from previous session and yesterday's session.

[johnr265]

So hearing 275 front and 295 front/square setup. Is there rubbing with 295 square? 295/30/19 or 295/35/19. Would love to get more updates on what is working for folks. GC plates sound like a no brainer.

Also as speeds are going up, what seat solution (including sub plate and mount) are folks doing. Don't think that car with a 295 square setup on Hoosiers should be run without 6 point and Hans. Thx.

[Captain Unknown GT4]

Brand new CUP2 for Bmw M4 GTS (star mark) did 3 trackdays, and outer edge Is worn out now, and also the section of tire 5cm In from outer edge, this part

as always Inreaced abrasion, and It effect steering precision and effect laptime. I am not sure 3 trackdays Is that bad, considering stock car/camber and Its a porkey car. For sure camber plates Is to recomend If tracking alot.
Its really a challenge to set a fast lap In M4 GTS, as you only got one chance in stock car, and thats 1 outlap on cold tires to get some heat then one must set the fast lap. You will not make the fastest lap on lap 3. Its much more easy to set a ultimate fast lap In the 130-140kg lighter GT3 as you got several laps to set It(not that porkey)

Even If the downfall In ulitimale lap time Is slower In the 3 lap and 4 lap vs 2 lap In M4 GTS the drop Is not that big. But to be apart of a time attack competition In M4 GTS one must Instant adapt and find Max speed In the second lap I guess. (If stock)
If you get them camberplates I am sure you can go several laps In a row without overheat tire, Hence more easy to then set fast laps on time attack.
With plates not only we can use cup tire outer edge better(that where gripp Is), but also Importent, there will be no Inreaced abrasion 5-7cm in to tire(mesured from outer edge), Hence the steering will not suffer as It do when stock(as that part wear off pretty Instant when stock)

Also now my track summer Is ending, but Hope some one here also drop car down even more. I post pics of my 3 trackday tire later( short mickey mouse tracks)

Left front tire after 3 trackdays, 3.1km track, 2km track, and 2.3km track. What I want to say Is that these shorter tracks wear tires more, still not all bad considering 100% stock car. As all see, I never overheat tire. If thats done big bits will just fall of the tire frame. If big bits fall of a more or less brand new tire, then people are overdriving abuse understeer the car. Sure when very little rubber left on frame and tire Is very used, normal to fall of bit. Same whit brake pads. Less material to take care of termal load and It will also fall out bits.

Left front tire after 3 trackdays on short mickey mouse tracks, wear much more tire than longer faster tracks. Where the key Is, that part wear of fast and also the outer edge. But still not overheat Issue here, Hence rubber Is not falling of my tire frame. If driving Correct tire pressure and Inside tire temp It will not fall of rubber from frame.

But sure If no rubber left on frame and then driving a very worn tire rubber will fall off frame. My personal saying on this matter Is, If I see a more or less new or slightly used cup tire with alot of thread left, well If rubber fall out of that tire Its abuse understeer and driver related Issue to blame. And fore sure drivers are wrong pressure and go past 90 degrees Inside tire temp and destroy cup tires.


But if no thread left, (no rubber material) left on tire frame Its normal bits fall off, same way If only mm of the brake pads left, It will fall out bits. But new cup tire If bits and rubber fall out Its driver who destroy tire and one should not blame the car.

[Captain Unknown GT4]

right front tire

[johnr265]

OK, ground control plates are in (they are gorgeous by the way). Here is my final alignment with them. Heading to the track tomorrow but I expect good things.

For what it's worth, max camber with the GC plates in front was -3.2 on driver side and -3.0 on the passenger side without cutting into the aluminum strut top brace so I back off and evened it up. It is worth noting again the assymetry between the driver and passenger side. I know I am not the first to notice that with the stock alignment and interesting to see it persists with the camber plates. Note I did ballast the driver seat but that is the side that had more camber anyway so not relevant.

Anyway, thanks to all so far for their input.

[VCP]

Originally Posted by johnr265

OK, ground control plates are in (they are gorgeous by the way). Here is my final alignment with them. Heading to the track tomorrow but I expect good things.

For what it's worth, max camber with the GC plates in front was -3.2 on driver side and -3.0 on the passenger side without cutting into the aluminum strut top brace so I back off and evened it up. It is worth noting again the assymetry between the driver and passenger side. I know I am not the first to notice that with the stock alignment and interesting to see it persists with the camber plates. Note I did ballast the driver seat but that is the side that had more camber anyway so not relevant.

Anyway, thanks to all so far for their input.

So did you see a symmetrical final setting on top of GC plates to get -3 both sides? (Are both driver and passenger sitting at exact position relative to dots on plates?)

[Captain Unknown GT4]

Its very common that left front tire got slightly more camber than right side. The way we drive tracks here In euro anyway is always the most wear to left front tire. Aswell at nur they often set left front slightly more camber as I recall from the past. And It seems also GTS Is set like that. Left front slightly more negative camber than right front.

[VCP]

Originally Posted by Captain Unknown GT4

Its very common that left front tire got slightly more camber than right side. The way we drive tracks here In euro anyway is always the most wear to left front tire. Aswell at nur they often set left front slightly more camber as I recall from the past. And It seems also GTS Is set like that. Left front slightly more negative camber than right front.

Yes I believe it is designed into the beautiful billet spindle.