How reliable is the M3/M4?

[SD ///M4]

Originally Posted by Biorin

I thought I was told that I had until 10k miles to purchase the 4th year of warranty, but I haven't really dug into this so may be wrong.

Originally Posted by Wingman335

Isn't 4th year (or 50k miles) included in the factory warranty?

Originally Posted by Biorin

Not for 2017 onward

Common mistake, confusing the 4 year/50,000 mile warranty with the 3 year/36,000 mile free maintenance period.

Yes, the free maintenance period changed from 4 year/50,000 miles to 3 years/36,000 miles starting with MY 2017, but the warranty period remains the same 4 year/50,000 miles.

And you can buy an extended warranty up to the end of the 4 year/50,000 mile warranty. Not sure about the extended maintenance, but most people think that's not worth it.

[backagain]

No issue for 9 months / 10k miles, except the rear differential replacement (which was a production issue).

If you are thinking about extended warrantee, I would suggest Geico's Mechanical Breakdown Insurance (~$100/year), far cheaper than any 3rd-party or dealer offer.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by Wingman335

I'm coming from a E92 335i- I've held it on for 8 years, but it's coming to a point where the repairs are getting frequent and expensive.

I'd be more worried about the reliability of an F3x than an F8x

[Biorin]

Originally Posted by SD ///M4

Common mistake, confusing the 4 year/50,000 mile warranty with the 3 year/36,000 mile free maintenance period.

Yes, the free maintenance period changed from 4 year/50,000 miles to 3 years/36,000 miles starting with MY 2017, but the warranty period remains the same 4 year/50,000 miles.

And you can buy an extended warranty up to the end of the 4 year/50,000 mile warranty. Not sure about the extended maintenance, but most people think that's not worth it.

Ah, thank you very much for clarifying!

[Wingman335]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

I'd be more worried about the reliability of an F3x than an F8x

Really? I figured F8x is going to be less reliable due to very new/complex technologies and materials being used, compared to F3x. Granted, this was not based on any scientific study, but just a hunch.

[Carl L]

Zero issues with my 2 1/2 year old M3 bought in late 2014. Touch wood it continues.

Any individual car can give you issues, I needed a new gearbox on my 911 under warranty but I'd never call them unreliable just because of that.

Still relatively early but the F8x series looks to be a reliable high performance car.

[hanszilla]

I'd buy the warranty if you're going to keep it for a long time; looking at your track record of keeping your current vehicle for 6+ years, I'd say that you would get your money's worth with the warranty. I think the warranty for 7/80k is 4k? In that regards, you're essentially paying a little over 13 cents per mile driven after your warranty expires. There are other intangible factors too; such as the peace of mind that you will have when you drive your car hard and run that transmission/engine hard.

[hatepotholez]

Originally Posted by mercedesc63

I've had many issues with mine..

Had to...
-Replace a radiator due to something hitting it
-replace high pressure fuel pump
-ac stopped working TWICE
-navi kept freezing
-kick-truck release was opening for no reason
-rocks kept getting stuck in between the dust shield
-belt shredded for no apparent reason


I really got my money's worth out of my warranty with countless loaner cars. Keep this in mind my E93 had a warranty and had less issues. My E46 however was most similar and they are the biggest most notorious money pits.

SIB513016 "Tailgate accidentally opens" should take care of your trunk opening on it's own.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by Wingman335

Really? I figured F8x is going to be less reliable due to very new/complex technologies and materials being used, compared to F3x. Granted, this was not based on any scientific study, but just a hunch.

I don't think anything is super complex or new in an F8x ... basically everything is just heavier duty for ... heavy duty, i.e., track duty. Maybe one thing would be more radiators making a puncture or leak more possible, but of course you also get the added benefit of more cooling power.

But intercoolers, turbos, etc none of that is new, the software is unique but not new, the chassis is different but nothing experimental.

In short, I don't think there's anything that's more risky by design other than more cooling, but then you also get benefits like you would with any option you order.

Oh, and I would add that given the way most people use these cars (starbucks runs) they're WAY over-engineered, thus I'd be more concerned about mean-time-failure of a 335 which has less expensive components

[KevinM]

My direct answer to your question is 0 times for mechanical issues and once for rattles (that were not fixed). However, I've had the car for less than one year. The real question is reliability after 4 years (or 6 if you extend the warranty). My opinion is that these new cars (not just from BMW) are almost designed to be disposable. They are so complex - both in their electronics and mechanics (twin turbos, dual clutch autos, etc.) - that they are going to be quite expensive to fix vs. their value as they age. I cringe at the thought of the third owner of a 10 year old F8X bringing the car in for a transmission failure or an iDrive failure.

I think the days of my long-term ownership of new cars is done. I've had my E39 M5 since 2004 and a Z4M coupe since 2007. I'll definitely be keeping those. I or my mechanic do all the maintenance for those cars at my house. My plan for the F80 and other new cars is, at the moment, to keep them for 3-4 years, enjoy them without worry, and move on.

[Wingman335]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

I don't think anything is super complex or new in an F8x ... basically everything is just heavier duty for ... heavy duty, i.e., track duty. Maybe one thing would be more radiators making a puncture or leak more possible, but of course you also get the added benefit of more cooling power.

But intercoolers, turbos, etc none of that is new, the software is unique but not new, the chassis is different but nothing experimental.

In short, I don't think there's anything that's more risky by design other than more cooling, but then you also get benefits like you would with any option you order.

Oh, and I would add that given the way most people use these cars (starbucks runs) they're WAY over-engineered, thus I'd be more concerned about mean-time-failure of a 335 which has less expensive components

Thanks for the insight- yeah- your last line makes sense... Probably thats why a lot of E92 335i's were unreliable compared to E93 M3s.

[Wingman335]

Originally Posted by KevinM

My direct answer to your question is 0 times for mechanical issues and once for rattles (that were not fixed). However, I've had the car for less than one year. The real question is reliability after 4 years (or 6 if you extend the warranty). My opinion is that these new cars (not just from BMW) are almost designed to be disposable. They are so complex - both in their electronics and mechanics (twin turbos, dual clutch autos, etc.) - that they are going to be quite expensive to fix vs. their value as they age. I cringe at the thought of the third owner of a 10 year old F8X bringing the car in for a transmission failure or an iDrive failure.

I think the days of my long-term ownership of new cars is done. I've had my E39 M5 since 2004 and a Z4M coupe since 2007. I'll definitely be keeping those. I or my mechanic do all the maintenance for those cars at my house. My plan for the F80 and other new cars is, at the moment, to keep them for 3-4 years, enjoy them without worry, and move on.

Yeah, I think my wife and I need to get out of our mindset of buying a brand new car and driving it till the wheels fall off- these days it doesn't seem that would work.

[neilum]

Originally Posted by KevinM

My direct answer to your question is 0 times for mechanical issues and once for rattles (that were not fixed). However, I've had the car for less than one year. The real question is reliability after 4 years (or 6 if you extend the warranty). My opinion is that these new cars (not just from BMW) are almost designed to be disposable. They are so complex - both in their electronics and mechanics (twin turbos, dual clutch autos, etc.) - that they are going to be quite expensive to fix vs. their value as they age. I cringe at the thought of the third owner of a 10 year old F8X bringing the car in for a transmission failure or an iDrive failure.

I think the days of my long-term ownership of new cars is done. I've had my E39 M5 since 2004 and a Z4M coupe since 2007. I'll definitely be keeping those. I or my mechanic do all the maintenance for those cars at my house. My plan for the F80 and other new cars is, at the moment, to keep them for 3-4 years, enjoy them without worry, and move on.

I am thinking along these lines, but I am confident this platform will be fine up to about 8 - 10 years old. These cars are very well built and the platform in general is proving to be reliable.

I brought my M3 in for scheduled service last week and the SA said he doesn't see many issues with the F80 M3's and that's usually a good sign for longterm aging.


After 8 - 10 years the things that do break will be so expensive it won't be worth it.


To the OP these cars are pretty solid, I wouldn't really worry too much if 7-8 years is your ownership target.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by KevinM

They are so complex - both in their electronics and mechanics (twin turbos, dual clutch autos, etc.) - that they are going to be quite expensive to fix vs. their value as they age.

Call me nuts but I'm not seeing this "complex" argument.

There's nothing here mechanically that hasn't been around for 30 years (even a dual clutch is ... well, a clutch gear box with sychros, etc), save the electronics and sensors - that's the new question, but only for cars, as that's been around for 30 years in other settings / applications.

Good long-term maintenance will require an ability to troubleshoot electronic parts and sensors as well as interrogating software and systems to find faults and set behavior. Not saying that's easy, but I don't see how it means the cars are disposable either, nor is electronic and sensor maintenance new, maybe just new to gearheads.

What makes all combustion engine conveyences disposable is they're giant expensive hunks of metal, powered by explosions from mined and refined dinosaur juice, that consume 50% of land to move on and sit in driveways idle 90% of the time.

That's not exactly sensibly efficient and therefore archaic and therefore tracking to an expiration date. In short, I wouldnt plan on much driving for inner-city or even suburb/exurb transportation out past 10 or 15 years.

[Wingman335]

Originally Posted by neilum

I am thinking along these lines, but I am confident this platform will be fine up to about 8 - 10 years old. These cars are very well built and the platform in general is proving to be reliable.

I brought my M3 in for scheduled service last week and the SA said he doesn't see many issues with the F80 M3's and that's usually a good sign for longterm aging.


After 8 - 10 years the things that do break will be so expensive it won't be worth it.


To the OP these cars are pretty solid, I wouldn't really worry too much if 7-8 years is your ownership target.

I'm hoping that's the case. I definitely want a fun car that's last long, but also something that won't be in the shop every other month.

[FirstF80InSpace]

Originally Posted by Biorin

Not for 2017 onward

In Canada, you still get 4 years of warranty for 2017. However, unlike in the States, we did not get included active suspension.

[katit]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Call me nuts but I'm not seeing this "complex" argument.

There's nothing here mechanically that hasn't been around for 30 years (even a dual clutch is ... well, a clutch gear box with sychros, etc), save the electronics and sensors - that's the new question, but only for cars, as that's been around for 30 years in other settings / applications.

Good long-term maintenance will require an ability to troubleshoot electronic parts and sensors as well as interrogating software and systems to find faults and ...

+1
I owned E39 540i 2004-2014 and it was same story people were saying. Lots of electronics, not giving up on out E34s, etc. with time Bentley manual came out, public knowledge came out, cheap diagnostic computers became available.

Right now F8x seems complex but give it time and it will be OK

[Jim B]

No issues in 2-1/2 years and 18,000 miles on my M4.

[dkhm3]

rock solid 25k miles. 2.5 years.

[ruley74]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

I'd be more worried about the reliability of an F3x than an F8x

There's part of me that would like to buy off in this idea. I have my F30 328 for just under 2yrs and did 56000kms in it, it was flawless, and I bought it as a 1.5yr old car.

[SD ///M4]

Originally Posted by KevinM

My direct answer to your question is 0 times for mechanical issues and once for rattles (that were not fixed). However, I've had the car for less than one year. The real question is reliability after 4 years (or 6 if you extend the warranty). My opinion is that these new cars (not just from BMW) are almost designed to be disposable. They are so complex - both in their electronics and mechanics (twin turbos, dual clutch autos, etc.) - that they are going to be quite expensive to fix vs. their value as they age. I cringe at the thought of the third owner of a 10 year old F8X bringing the car in for a transmission failure or an iDrive failure.

I think the days of my long-term ownership of new cars is done. I've had my E39 M5 since 2004 and a Z4M coupe since 2007. I'll definitely be keeping those. I or my mechanic do all the maintenance for those cars at my house. My plan for the F80 and other new cars is, at the moment, to keep them for 3-4 years, enjoy them without worry, and move on.

My strategy for my Z4 M Roadster for sure! I'll probably extend the warranty on the M4 to 7 yr./100,000 miles. My wife's 2011 335is will be replaced at the end of her 7/100,00 extended warranty in May 2018.

[badbimmer]

Originally Posted by Biorin

Not for 2017 onward

This is not correct t. Free service is now only 3 years. Warranty remains at 4.