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09-25-2013, 10:25 AM | #89 |
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Sounds like BMW has listened to its customers and fans feedback. I say a 'Thank You' is in order. At least on this preliminary information.
So here's mine. Thank you BMW AG. I cannot wait for the M3 / M4 to hit the streets. Note to the competition, 'Check!'
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09-25-2013, 10:31 AM | #90 | |
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09-25-2013, 10:34 AM | #91 |
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Sounds like they are using 'good ol fashioned' 'street' anti lag. Retarded ignition more fuel air. The fact they don't use this continuously points very much in that direction. A shame really as they clearly have no 'sequential turbo' set up, just a cheap twin turbo system.
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09-25-2013, 10:36 AM | #92 | |
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Outside the context of the current M3 the effort and resulting weight of the car is quite impressive and highly appreciated. Also these days it seems that we need to celebrate anything outside of power that isn't getting worse and here is something that at least on paper is getting better. |
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09-25-2013, 10:39 AM | #93 | |
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If Wikipedia is to be trusted, looks like the average person in Europe is 156lbs (71kg) and North America is 178lbs (81kg) but those helpful Asians drop the world figure since they come in at a wonderful 127lbs (58kg). Looks like the 'world' average of the adult population's weight is 136lbs (62kg) (Sheesh, the average Female in the US weighs more than the average male in South Korea..BY 12 lbs!. ) |
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09-25-2013, 10:51 AM | #95 |
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like everyone else has posted - i just cannot believe the weight savings on this. more than makes up for any sort of power numbers...
All this CFRP sounds awesome, but expensive. 50% different content than a standard F30, which is disappointing - i thought usually it was about 75%??? plus it's going to be underrated - but looks like it will spec similar to Caddy's new V6TT that will likely power the ATS-V. Of course caddy usually overrates and BMW usually underrates.
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09-25-2013, 11:20 AM | #96 | |
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this method was employed on the N54T in the 1M via the " M button", along with different throttle maps. |
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09-25-2013, 11:39 AM | #98 | |
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And I don't get the obsession with power besides as a "simple and easy to understand number". If you keep the power but loose weight, you will feel that while accelerating just the same way you would if you kept the weight and added power... So would people rather have a higher HP number but kept the weight??? Lower weight also has the added bonus of handling and braking improvements And don't forget the MAJOR increase in torque. Why doesn't as many comment on that? And in the context of the E92 M3: The E92 M3 GAINED 65kg extra over the 335i, The F80/82 LOOSES 10kg over the F30 335i (source is the EU spec brochures from BMW.de) That takes quite an effort to achieve, as adding all the M stuff adds weight to the car and means that weight saving has to negate all that extra componentry that is added to the car. |
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09-25-2013, 11:41 AM | #99 | |
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Power only works when on WOT. Weight works everywhere EDIT: Sorry, just occurred to me that power also works at the pub, and therefore is a major buying factor by some Last edited by NISFAN; 09-25-2013 at 11:50 AM.. |
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09-25-2013, 11:47 AM | #100 | ||
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If we were to race on foot (or carriage), and i start with 10 horses and the subsequent torque they will bring, and you start with 8 horses, and then add 2 more horses a couple seconds later (btw how long does it take to lasso in a horse onto a carriage lol?), the change acceleration for you will feel like its pulling harder of course, but wouldnt i still be ahead of you since we are both being lugged by ten horses now except i started with ten from the get go? Assuming we both have the same type of horse - not a short legged mongolian horse, a little pony, or a unicorn. Unicorn would be cheating. |
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09-25-2013, 11:57 AM | #101 | |
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On a side note, previous Ms were differentiated by 75-80% new parts in the M vs their regular model counterpart. Looks like that number has significantly dropped being on 50% differentiation now. Either way, amongst my well derseved criticisms, I am excited about the car. Last edited by Wolfinwolfsclothing; 09-25-2013 at 12:05 PM.. |
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09-25-2013, 12:04 PM | #103 | |
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I also applaud BMW for making the weight saving efforts, but touting misleading weight figures (naked cars, no driver included etc.) doesn't earn them my appreciation. I'm sure the new M3/M4 will be a great car, and I'll certainly consider it as a replacement for my current ride. But even with the reduced weight the power figures are on the low side, at least IMO. Once we can get to 500hp at the crank with downpipes and a remap I'm all for it, but 430hp is rather underwhelming. Alpina_B3_Lux
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09-25-2013, 12:07 PM | #104 | |
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Where do you get the weight info from? The weight is with fluids and 90% fuel (as per EU legislation) and without driver. The new car is 80kg lighter than the old. Where is the "etc" and "naked" part? |
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09-25-2013, 12:08 PM | #105 | |
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Alpina_B3_Lux
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09-25-2013, 12:14 PM | #106 | |
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Official EU weights of driver and luggage is 68kg and 7kg respectively. As BMW is a German manufacturer, I don't find it marketing BS to use official EU type approval numbers as given by EU governments... |
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09-25-2013, 12:15 PM | #107 | |
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Using a configuration that nobody would buy: no extras (no satnav, no upgraded audio, no other options that 99% of M3 / M4 drivers would choose), smaller rims (18", most would go for 19"), manual transmission (I believe more than 80% of the E9x M3 were DCT), ceramic brakes (expensive option)...only if you combine all this, which is not realistic at all, will you have a chance of reaching the figure BMW is advertising. And then there's still no one in the car to drive it. Don't get me wrong, the efforts to save weight are laudable. It's just that the figures touted in the presentation are misleading as no one in their right mind would configure a car that way. If you configure a car in a more realistic fashion, the weight savings compared to an F30 335i or the E90 M3 will not be very substantial. Alpina_B3_Lux
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09-25-2013, 12:15 PM | #108 | |
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09-25-2013, 12:21 PM | #109 | ||
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First of all, the quoted curb weight figure is allways the base version of any car. Nothing new there. Second of all, they say that the new car will be 80kg lighter than a comparable E9X M3. Add the same equipment to both cars and the new will still be 80kg lighter. ------------------- And, the EU weight doesn't have to include the driver. According to EU directive 92/21/EC (which governs masses and dimensions of M1 cars) it is clearly stated in the Appendix to Annex II: Quote:
Last edited by Boss330; 09-25-2013 at 12:30 PM.. |
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09-25-2013, 12:24 PM | #110 |
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The difference is 80kg(176 lbs) to the current car, period. Use whatever standard you want when comparing to the current car or the competition and then deduct 80kg(176 lbs) from the current car to get the F80/F82 weight.
There is a LOT of misleading figures and weight comparisons in these threads. Make sure you get it right if this is important to you. |
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