Is anyone having issues with front tires at the track?

[M4_GTS]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I believe this is an inherent weak point of the PSC2. Due to the rather wide and deep longitudinal grooves (to make the tire acceptable in the wet), the tread blocks are not wide and stiff enough and thus deform significantly under load. The one time I tried PSC2, I had the same experience (I also disliked them because I found they heat cycled out rather fast).

As for front tires wearing faster than rears, I think this is something that cannot be avoided when running a staggered setup. The F8X remains a nose heavy chassis meaning that the front tires need to work harder than the rears. Going with a square setup to be able to rotate the tires means giving up the ability to put down the power coming out of corners. After having tried both, I decided to live with the compromise of a staggered setup.

The challenge with the GTS is finding suitable track tires in the 19"-20" stock sizes, options are rather limited. The RE71R is not a bad tire, but it remains a street tire and will not be able to exploit the full potential of the GTS IMO. The Pirelli Trofeo-R in 265/35R19-295/30R20 could be an interesting option for keeping the stock wheels IMO since it is a true R-compound.

Another option is going with 19" wheels all around, which opens more options from other tire manufacturers.

The GTS is not a track only car, so owners will be driving it on the street as well. There are a few GT4 owners running on the track with the RE71r and their responses been pretty good and I've seen one of them mentioned its a faster tire than the cup2.

The Trofeo-R would be a great tire choice if street driving is limited and maybe even if the owner got 2 sets of wheels.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by M4_GTS

The GTS is not a track only car, so owners will be driving it on the street as well. There are a few GT4 owners running on the track with the RE71r and their responses been pretty good and I've seen one of them mentioned its a faster tire than the cup2.

The Trofeo-R would be a great tire choice if street driving is limited and maybe even if the owner got 2 sets of wheels.

Agreed. I shared the track rat perspective .

If someone desires to use the GTS regularly on both street and track, I think having a dedicated set of wheels and tires for each application is the best approach.

[M4_GTS]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Agreed. I shared the track rat perspective .

If someone desires to use the GTS regularly on both street and track, I think having a dedicated set of wheels and tires for each application is the best approach.

I think those Trofeo-R would work for the street if the owner only drives on the street in the dry and also likes to push hard. sounds like it might work for me.

[ilGalante]

I'm planning to run the Trofeo-R's on a dedicated set of track wheels. I've been nothing but happy with that tire at the track, and they are pretty darn tolerable on the street in dry weather.

[MRakete]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I believe this is an inherent weak point of the PSC2. Due to the rather wide and deep longitudinal grooves (to make the tire acceptable in the wet), the tread blocks are not wide and stiff enough and thus deform significantly under load. The one time I tried PSC2, I had the same experience (I also disliked them because I found they heat cycled out rather fast).

As for front tires wearing faster than rears, I think this is something that cannot be avoided when running a staggered setup. The F8X remains a nose heavy chassis meaning that the front tires need to work harder than the rears. Going with a square setup to be able to rotate the tires means giving up the ability to put down the power coming out of corners. After having tried both, I decided to live with the compromise of a staggered setup.

The challenge with the GTS is finding suitable track tires in the 19"-20" stock sizes, options are rather limited. The RE71R is not a bad tire, but it remains a street tire and will not be able to exploit the full potential of the GTS IMO. The Pirelli Trofeo-R in 265/35R19-295/30R20 could be an interesting option for keeping the stock wheels IMO since it is a true R-compound.

Another option is going with 19" wheels all around, which opens more options from other tire manufacturers.

I am not a huge fan of the Trofeo R. Tracked with them for year. They have their issues.

It's not a camber issues. I have a set of GC camber plates with the correct amount of camber. It might be a toe thing.

I am getting a set of re71r. If that doesn't work, I will go with a square 19 set up.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by MRakete

I am not a huge fan of the Trofeo R. Tracked with them for year. They have their issues.

It's not a camber issues. I have a set of GC camber plates with the correct amount of camber. It might be a toe thing.

I am getting a set of re71r. If that doesn't work, I will go with a square 19 set up.

Why not staggered with 19" front and rear?

A square setup will limit the tire width you can put in the rear. I would go with 19X10 front with 19X11 rears with matching tires.

[MRakete]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Why not staggered with 19" front and rear?

A square setup will limit the tire width you can put in the rear. I would go with 19X10 front with 19X11 rears with matching tires.

I like square set up best for the track. Works perfect with my M2.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by MRakete

I like square set up best for the track. Works perfect with my M2.

I also ran and preferred a square setup on my E46 and E92, so I originally tried a 275 square setup on my F82. The thing is, the S55 has so much mid-RPM grunt that I could not fully leverage that power coming out of corners with the square setup. So I decided to go with rear 305s on 11" wide wheels. Ideally, I'd run 305 square, but the 305 dont fit up front (at least without modifications). And the GTS has even more mid range power than a civic M4...

[ilGalante]

To start I'm thinking I'll run the Trofeo-R's in 19" (265mm and 305mm). I'm not sure, as stated, you could get too much wider up front without modification - or am I wrong? Do tell if so!!!

[MRakete]

Originally Posted by ilGalante

To start I'm thinking I'll run the Trofeo-R's in 19" (265mm and 305mm). I'm not sure, as stated, you could get too much wider up front without modification - or am I wrong? Do tell if so!!!

Pretty easy to run 285 in front.

I run 275,s square on my M2. Love it.

[MRakete]

Here s a pic of it with fresh Hoosiers

[johnr265]

FYI, the Trofeo R on the street is super sticky (in warm weather anyway) and peppers the car with rocks (I had on my z28 and it would throw rocks in my driver window sometimes when open!)

Agree with others, wear in the center is tire tread issue and not too little camber or too much pressure (at least in this case).

Great thoughts so far. Please keep the feedback up as folks try different combos so we can find the best solutions. 19" rims seems a no brainier for cost, weight, and tire selection. Square setup nice for tire rotation and making a set last longer but agree probably better to get max grip in the rear as well. I like the sound of 285f/305R.

Would love to hear seat solutions too as people replace stock seats.

[jml]

Welcome to driving a fast car....4 days from a set of tires is par for a new driver, and 2 days for quick driver. There is this annoying thing called physics. Pretty universal. Some cars you really have to work to explore the level of grip to destroy tires, some cars my grandma can do it in 20min.


But but but....my buddy with a spec miata gets a season out of a set of all seasons......

[dawgdog]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I believe this is an inherent weak point of the PSC2. Due to the rather wide and deep longitudinal grooves (to make the tire acceptable in the wet), the tread blocks are not wide and stiff enough and thus deform significantly under load. The one time I tried PSC2, I had the same experience (I also disliked them because I found they heat cycled out rather fast).

As for front tires wearing faster than rears, I think this is something that cannot be avoided when running a staggered setup. The F8X remains a nose heavy chassis meaning that the front tires need to work harder than the rears. Going with a square setup to be able to rotate the tires means giving up the ability to put down the power coming out of corners. After having tried both, I decided to live with the compromise of a staggered setup.

The challenge with the GTS is finding suitable track tires in the 19"-20" stock sizes, options are rather limited. The RE71R is not a bad tire, but it remains a street tire and will not be able to exploit the full potential of the GTS IMO. The Pirelli Trofeo-R in 265/35R19-295/30R20 could be an interesting option for keeping the stock wheels IMO since it is a true R-compound.

Another option is going with 19" wheels all around, which opens more options from other tire manufacturers.

I agree about the heat cycling of the PSC2. My fronts on my GT3 heat cycled out with plenty of tread left. So about the same grip as NT01s at twice the cost with half the life.

[Rasya]

Originally Posted by MRakete

Pretty easy to run 285 in front.

I run 275,s square on my M2. Love it.

So, when my stock tires are gone on my GTS I might try with Trofeo R 285/35 F and 305/30 R on stock rims (9,5 and 10,5). Would that fit in the front? Rear should be okay I guess.. Seems to me like an ideal replacement for some more grip.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Rasya

So, when my stock tires are gone on my GTS I might try with Trofeo R 285/35 F and 305/30 R on stock rims (9,5 and 10,5). Would that fit in the front? Rear should be okay I guess.. Seems to me like an ideal replacement for some more grip.

It might get tight with 285/35R19 upfront. I ran the rear 275/35R19 in front on my car for some time and there was barely any clearance left with the fender liner when the wheels were steered. According to TireRack, the 285/35R19 Trofeo-R have a tread that is a full 1" wider than the 275/35R19(*), combined with the taller sidewall, I have to assume they will rub. It might be different on the GTS due to the different geometry of the front suspension, so you could chance it and try it out.

[johnr265]

May also depend if you are running camber plates as more negative camber might give you more clearance (unless it throws off the castor &#128527. It's rarely simple at first but we'll get there collectively.

[Rasya]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

It might get tight with 285/35R19 upfront. I ran the rear 275/35R19 in front on my car for some time and there was barely any clearance left with the fender liner when the wheels were steered. According to TireRack, the 285/35R19 Trofeo-R have a tread that is a full 1" wider than the 275/35R19(*), combined with the taller sidewall, I have to assume they will rub. It might be different on the GTS due to the different geometry of the front suspension, so you could chance it and try it out.

They don't sell 275/35 r19 (anymore?). That would my choice otherwise.

[ilGalante]

Originally Posted by johnr265

May also depend if you are running camber plates as more negative camber might give you more clearance (unless it throws off the castor &#128527. It's rarely simple at first but we'll get there collectively.

I think the collective effort is what its going to take - and one of us to bite the bullet and try!!!

285/305 in the Trofeo-R does seem pretty ideal if you're trying to avoid the MPSC-2 and stay DOT. The other option would be the new Toyo R888-R but it skips from 265mm up to 295mm in 19".

My thought was a set of HRE R101 LW's in 19x10 and 19x11 with the Trofeo-R's 285 and 305mm. I'll have to wait for the car to arrive, then get it up air, install some camber plates and start fiddling with my fingers crossed LOL!

[johnr265]

Originally Posted by ilGalante

I think the collective effort is what its going to take - and one of us to bite the bullet and try!!!

285/305 in the Trofeo-R does seem pretty ideal if you're trying to avoid the MPSC-2 and stay DOT. The other option would be the new Toyo R888-R but it skips from 265mm up to 295mm in 19".

My thought was a set of HRE R101 LW's in 19x10 and 19x11 with the Trofeo-R's 285 and 305mm. I'll have to wait for the car to arrive, then get it up air, install some camber plates and start fiddling with my fingers crossed LOL!

Not a fan of R888. Very peaky tire with grip falling off quickly. I like the Trofeo R on the track but it is a pretty ridiculous street tire. If you plan to change to a different combo for the street, should be a nice option.

I think if I were going a dedicated set of rims, I'd do Hoosiers. How about 265/35/19F and then for rear choices are:

295/30/19 (-2.6% diameter)
315/30/19 (-1.1% diameter) huge but rear is sometimes more flexible
295/35/19 (+1.5% diameter)

[Captain Unknown GT4]

Here is my left front tire. Car is now don 4500km on these tire. First 2000km easy street. Then ap. 12 laps on mid city street circuit. And ca. 1500km drive to Nurburgring then 4 laps at ca. 7.30 btg speed and 6 laps 8+min btg speed in plenty traffic. Then 20 wet laps on SPA and 20 dry laps SPA. (2.45-2.50min laps dry)

Total cars is 4500km now and most street driving then.
Looking outer edge I see I could use more negative camber as outer edge is wearing out. Still I must say wear is pretty even, I also get that section in middle to wear out. Still compared to my GT4 Porsche the tire is gipping much better front and I feel no understeer in GTS on them tracks. Also tire wear out much faster on my Porsche GT4 at nurburg as I feel much understeer there in GT4. No understeer in GTS on Nur or SPA.

I would recomend to not driving wrong tire pressure as It will wear out tire even faster. Front hot 2.3bar rear hot 2.1bar is sweetspoot, also sport auto drove that pressure on long fast nurburing and short GP layout hockenheim.
Also keep within 70-90 degrees temp inside tire, see car navi display as this is importent. Cup 2 optimal driving range on track is between 70-90 degrees. You kill tire if way past that, hence abuse understeer or wrong tire pressure will cause that its hard to stay between 70-90 degrees. Stop driving if shoting to much heat to tire due to abuse understeer drivingstyle or wrong pressure. Tire will get killed and you will not drive fast laps if 100+ temp. Also it only take a few laps on wrong temp and pressure to destroy a tire.

I always drive whit screen display tire inside temp and pressure, very importent as this car is porky. If bits and pice fall off cup 2 tire, then you did wrong, not the car or the tire.

As porky car its importent to in between laps on track pick a few cooldown laps. (Very much depending on what speed one have in the first place)

[Captain Unknown GT4]

Right tire is as always much better. Hence on GT4 i always Swift left to ringt and right to left to get a fraction more out of tire. But GTS I thought it Held up fairly ok.