Tesla Model 3 Performance: 3.5s 0-60, 155MPH top speed, 310mi range, $78k

[AndreyATC]

https://electrek.co/2018/05/20/tesla...ance-versions/

Should be interesting to see the comparo with other performance sedans

The performance version features the same motors (AC in the front and permanent magnet in the rear) as the dual version, but they are picking the highest rated ones with double the burn-in process to make sure they can handle a higher output.

Musk also said that the performance version will feature a carbon fiber spoiler, 20” Performance wheels, and black and white interior options. He claimed it will be 15% quicker than the BMW M3 and with better handling, and “will beat anything in its class on the track.”

Here are the other details of the Model 3 performance version:

Range: 310 miles
0 to 60 mph acceleration: 3.5 seconds
Top speed: 155 mph
Price: $78,000 (without autopilot)

[duky]

https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/20/...or-tesla-musk/

Well if you believe this guy, the new AWD Model 3 will be better than an M3! To be specific: "15% quicker and with better handling". Ok, I don't even know where to start with this comparison. If the pricepoint was $50k it might be a worthwhile discussion, but the Model 3 offers so much less starting from the cookie-cutter design to virtually everything else. Will look forward to the reviews when this hits the street.

If they truly were aiming at the M3, it is a little comical given that the current gen M3 is at its EOL and still handily beats this Model 3. Better luck next time, Tesla.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by ndukyh

https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/20/...or-tesla-musk/

Well if you believe this guy, the new AWD Model 3 will be better than an M3! To be specific: "15% quicker and with better handling". Ok, I don't even know where to start with this comparison.

I agree that comparing performance to the current M3 is misguided since, by the time the Model 3 “PD” is readily available, the F80 will be long gone and the G80 will be imminent. That said, performance wise, ~3.5s for the G80 is probably a reasonable guess, although if it has M xDrive, it could be closer to 3.0s (especially in Competition form). At the same time, there is no info on insane/ludicrous mode for the Model 3 yet. So they may at least be on roughly equal footing in that area.

The $78k pricetag is definitely eye watering. It does at least include the $9000 long range battery (hence the 310mi range) and $5000 Premium Upgrade Package. So in the future, they can lower the base price by $5k if they choose, but they probably won’t ever allow the performance model to be ordered without the long range battery.

[WestRace]

It's an electric car and although it may have impressive straight line speed, it's not a track car. I can see after a few corners, the brakes will probably suffer from overheat, the batteries will get pretty hot too.

[guess2098]

Their car has cheap interior for the price range...

[Germanauto]

Musk taking shots at the BMW ///M3 on Twitter.

Too cute.

[alex2364]

Elon Musk is claiming the Model 3 performance model will be 15% faster than the M3 and will beat anything in it's class on the track. I highly doubt it can consistently do it lap after lap without cooking it's brakes. Thoughts? Anyone interested in a Model 3 if it's faster than a M3?

https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/20/...or-tesla-musk/

[Aaaaaaaaa]

Originally Posted by alex2364

Elon Musk is claiming the Model 3 performance model will be 15% faster than the M3 and will beat anything in it's class on the track. I highly doubt it can consistently do it lap after lap without cooking it's brakes. Thoughts? Anyone interested in a Model 3 if it's faster than a M3?

https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/20/...or-tesla-musk/

Nope

[Captain Dang]

All of the Tesla models benefit from having instant on torque and in general very quick acceleration. Also with less moving parts, I would guess the result of running hard, much more reliable. But, the model 3 was not designed for track days. I bet with some bigger brakes and suspension though, the Tesla would probably have the advantage. I like the idea and the future of companies investing in electric designs, but still feel for the time being, there is more of a appliance feel than actual road connection like you can get with a M4 or something more sport based that runs on petrol. This is based off of what I've read.... Self admittedly, I have never driven one. I do wonder if the long term affects on battery production and disposal will also have negative consequences on the environment as these designs continue to take off. It also will be interesting to see the replacement cost of the battery cells. Either way, it seems electric vehicles are here to stay and from what I can tell, the market and overall interest in "sports" cars is quickly disappearing.

[guess2098]

Originally Posted by alex2364

Elon Musk is claiming the Model 3 performance model will be 15% faster than the M3 and will beat anything in it's class on the track. I highly doubt it can consistently do it lap after lap without cooking it's brakes. Thoughts? Anyone interested in a Model 3 if it's faster than a M3?

https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/20/...or-tesla-musk/

Anything is possible but at least show us some prototype. To me, it's fun to modify a car. Tesla does not have too many part to mod at this point. Won't consider it until more parts can be modified

[Darth One]

i'm keeping an open mind. let's see if he can back up his talk.

sadly, the one thing he won't be able to fix for this generation of Model 3 are the godawful looks.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Darth One

i'm keeping an open mind. let's see if he can back up his talk.

sadly, the one thing he won't be able to fix for this generation of Model 3 are the godawful looks.

I saw a well optioned one in blue the other day and it looked really nice.

But the horrendous interior and Musk's big mouth keep me from being a fan.

[Aaaaaaaaa]

Originally Posted by Darth One

i'm keeping an open mind. let's see if he can back up his talk.

sadly, the one thing he won't be able to fix for this generation of Model 3 are the godawful looks.

Maybe BMW can lend Tesla their Active Sound Design expertise and make it sound like a N55 M2. I mean best sounding BMW ever right

[Who's on first]

He's right.

Read his words.

"In its class".

Name me another car that's all electric, that size and that price range.

It's a class of exactly 1.

[theroadrunner]

Sedan Wars. Musk thinks big, it's no surprise he wants to build an M3 competitor. Straight line speed is one thing but great track handling is a different beast.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Captain Dang

All of the Tesla models benefit from having instant on torque and in general very quick acceleration. Also with less moving parts, I would guess the result of running hard, much more reliable. But, the model 3 was not designed for track days. I bet with some bigger brakes and suspension though, the Tesla would probably have the advantage. I like the idea and the future of companies investing in electric designs, but still feel for the time being, there is more of a appliance feel than actual road connection like you can get with a M4 or something more sport based that runs on petrol. This is based off of what I've read.... Self admittedly, I have never driven one. I do wonder if the long term affects on battery production and disposal will also have negative consequences on the environment as these designs continue to take off. It also will be interesting to see the replacement cost of the battery cells. Either way, it seems electric vehicles are here to stay and from what I can tell, the market and overall interest in "sports" cars is quickly disappearing.

The weight is always going to be tough for electric cars at a road course, until battery tech gets much more power sense.

If you can only have 1 car to do it all, m3 is my pick due to the ability to track it.

But if you can have 2 cars, I think these fast electrics paired with an all out gas sports car is the way to go.

My dream setup is a self driving electric SUV that can self drive me to the track with a race car in tow, so I can catch some zzzzz, outsource the 4hr drive to some tracks, and minimize staying at the crap hotels at said tracks (in favor of car camping in the paddock using said SUV)

Anyway, I'm super interested in these performance electrics. It will be way easier to blast through slow moving traffic under the radar without the exhaust noise or tire squealing drama of launching a high power rwd gas car at stop lights

[AndreyATC]

Originally Posted by WestRace

It's an electric car and although it may have impressive straight line speed, it's not a track car. I can see after a few corners, the brakes will probably suffer from overheat, the batteries will get pretty hot too.

I doubt this statement is accurate.
Most Teslas use Brembo brakes. This Perf Model 3 will most likely have the same. Battery wasn't the weakest link either. Motor housing was.
Regen from dual motor will offset the brake use.
Low COG + AWD will make this car a bullet on the track.

I bet Musk took current M3 and ran it against Model 3. He's probably aware of the outcome, so he tweets

[Tacoma]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

I agree that comparing performance to the current M3 is misguided since, by the time the Model 3 “PD” is readily available, the F80 will be long gone and the G80 will be imminent. That said, performance wise, ~3.5s for the G80 is probably a reasonable guess, although if it has M xDrive, it could be closer to 3.0s (especially in Competition form). At the same time, there is no info on insane/ludicrous mode for the Model 3 yet. So they may at least be on roughly equal footing in that area.

Let's be fair here... we are talking today and Model 3's are in production as are the F8x, so that's the competition today. The G8x is at least 3 years away. You can't compare against the next gen M3 that doesn't yet exist.

Also... so the Model 3 may be 3.5s in 2018 but by the time the first G8x rolls of the production line in 2021, the Model 3 AWD Performance model may have shaved it's 0-60 down to the low 3's in which case the G8x likely still lags and in "ludicrous mode" it may be no contest.

So Musk is not "misguided." On the contrary, I think what he's doing is great. He's forcing BMW/MB to up their game. Frankly, I think it'll be tough for the base G8x to beat 3.5s, especially without AWD. We'll see but Musk is putting the pressure on and more competition is good for consumers.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Tacoma

Let's be fair here... we are talking today and Model 3's are in production as are the F8x, so that's the competition today.

The Performance Model 3, which is the one that we are talking about in this thread, is not yet in production.

However, we can say for the sake of argument that it will be in production sometime this year (supposed to be July - we shall see). But that’s not the same as being “readily available”, which is what I said. Unless you are on the wait list already, it will not be readily available to you this year.

The G8x is at least 3 years away. You can't compare against the next gen M3 that doesn't yet exist.

Check that. It is at *most* three years away. It is at least two years away, though, sure.

Also... so the Model 3 may be 3.5s in 2018 but by the time the first G8x rolls of the production line in 2021, the Model 3 AWD Performance model may have shaved it's 0-60 down to the low 3's in which case the G8x likely still lags and in "ludicrous mode" it may be no contest.

See, there you go. So, in fact, clearly you can compare to “the next gen M3 that doesn’t yet exist” - you just did it there. All it takes is some educated speculation and a little imagination. That said, I don’t agree with your “no contest” prediction, but that’s okay, we can have different opinions. There’s no point in arguing about it now - we’ll know once both cars hit the market and comparison tests can be conducted.

So Musk is not "misguided." On the contrary, I think what he's doing is great. He's forcing BMW/MB to up their game. Frankly, I think it'll be tough for the base G8x to beat 3.5s, especially without AWD. We'll see but Musk is putting the pressure on and more competition is good for consumers.

The comparison against a car at its end of life is not very persuasive for those in the know, and performance car enthusiasts typically are. That’s why I called it misguided. Perhaps there are better words to use, but I maintain that the current M3 isn’t ultimately what the Model 3 PD will be measured against. If we assume a lifespan for the Model 3 that is similar to Model S, the G80 and Model 3 Performance will be market place competitors for the entire life of the former. The F80 M3, by contrast, will compete for buyers against the Tesla for exactly zero days of its life.

Also, I absolutely agree that what Musk is doing is ultimately a good thing. I am a fan of electric vehicles and will definitely buy one sometime in the next 15 years. Could be sooner than later, who knows? I don’t think much of the fact that Elon makes promises about availability timelines that he isn’t consistently able to keep, but whatever. I don’t have to like the guy’s approach to appreciate the results.

[WestRace]

Originally Posted by AndreyATC

I doubt this statement is accurate.
Most Teslas use Brembo brakes. This Perf Model 3 will most likely have the same. Battery wasn't the weakest link either. Motor housing was.
Regen from dual motor will offset the brake use.
Low COG + AWD will make this car a bullet on the track.

I bet Musk took current M3 and ran it against Model 3. He's probably aware of the outcome, so he tweets

I think it was either Road and Track or Cars and Drivers took the highest performance Model S and ran it on VIR and if I remember correctly it had heating problem, but either way they are not typical brakes. The batteries are prone to heating if running at high current. I mean running the track is very demanding and even the M3/M4 may even have problem if running on track continuously.

[AndreyATC]

Originally Posted by WestRace

I think it was either Road and Track or Cars and Drivers took the highest performance Model S and ran it on VIR and if I remember correctly it had heating problem, but either way they are not typical brakes. The batteries are prone to heating if running at high current. I mean running the track is very demanding and even the M3/M4 may even have problem if running on track continuously.

If you read my post, the issue was the motor housing on Model S
It was never meant for the track, seems stupid to run 5000lb car in that environment. But it doesnt have issues with brakes
Model 3, regular, was just tested by a few owners. No motor or battery concerns, just crappy brakes on non-performance car. Perf. Model 3 should hold its own. But we shall see when it comes out. If it's advertised as a trackable car, that sounds promising, that's all

[antzcrashing]

Dear BMW and M3 owners, Tesla is throwing shade at the M3 saying that the performance version of Model 3 will be faster, better handling, and in price range. How do you respond? Sometimes its best when you dont validate claims which are false/exaggerated, etc, but is this one worth BMW going back at? Certainly would make things interesting

Here is Elon's statement:

Cost of all options, wheels, paint, etc is included (apart from Autopilot). Cost is $78k. About same as BMW M3, but 15% quicker & with better handling. Will beat anything in its class on the track.