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      09-01-2014, 11:49 AM   #23
karbonphiber
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanuck View Post
In Canada, Shell V-Power 91 is the only one with no ethanol, if that matters to you.
It does... I want to keep my car on a diet of fuel made 100% from dead dinosaurs
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      09-01-2014, 12:06 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
Well, depends on options.

Coop gas in western canada is also ethanol free (so alberta and saskat can get 91 octane sans booze)
Sorry, I should have said of national brands available in most places across the country.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nex View Post
I think I the gas lid door, it says up to 10% ethanol.
This is true, and that's a good thing since most Canadian gasoline has 10% ethanol.

My understanding is you are best to buy your E10 gasoline from high volume stations where there is less chance of water in it. Also, if your car is going to sit for a long time, better to have gasoline with no ethanol in it.

Since gasoline has more energy per litre than ethanol, my uninformed understanding is the Shell V-Power 91 should actually give better mileage than Petro-Canada Ultra 94, and you don't have to worry about possible ethanol problems. But, I really have no idea. Organic chemistry was one of my worst subjects in school!
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      09-01-2014, 03:50 PM   #25
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Shell 91 should give better mileage. But in my experience with my S4, I was getting slightly better mileage with Ultra 94. Was the minimal increase in mileage worth the increase in price? I'm not too sure.
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      09-01-2014, 11:07 PM   #26
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Asked the dealer here in Vic - Chevron apparently has 94 but haven't checked to verify and confirm that ethanol < 10%
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      09-02-2014, 09:25 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanuck View Post
In Canada, Shell V-Power 91 is the only one with no ethanol, if that matters to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by karbonphiber View Post
It does... I want to keep my car on a diet of fuel made 100% from dead dinosaurs
Hey guys, are you sure Shell's gasoline does not have ethanol? I think this is still dependent on the province. I found the following Ontario requirement that all fuel be blended with minimum of 5% ethanol...

http://www.ontario.ca/environment-an...hanol-gasoline



Hmmm, took a second look and it said "all fuel at your location combined". Therefore, I guess if the lower grades are E10, then by volume Shell's V-91 can be ethanol free... hmmm
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      09-02-2014, 09:56 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by egalley View Post
Shell 91 should give better mileage. But in my experience with my S4, I was getting slightly better mileage with Ultra 94. Was the minimal increase in mileage worth the increase in price? I'm not too sure.
I notice a slight improvement of about 5% in milege using Shell 91 over Ultra 94 in my E92 M3.These days it is easy to keep track as I am driving 6-800 kms per week.
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      09-02-2014, 10:32 AM   #29
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wow, so confused. Which is better??

1) 91 octane with no ethanol
OR
2) 94 octane with ethanol

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      09-02-2014, 10:41 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyboy View Post
wow, so confused. Which is better??

1) 91 octane with no ethanol
OR
2) 94 octane with ethanol

well, that is the whole debate right there.

In theory, 94 Octane should be better.

but as any amount of internet research will tell you, the risk of ethanol is that the alcohol can collect water condensate, which (to get technical) is very bad for your car's insides. So many drivers avoid ethanol like death.

In reality, ethanol is probably not the best thing and it has risks, but like most things a 'risk' means that, most of the time, you will be fine. Lots of non-premium gas has ethanol and most people likely fill up their regular cars with that gas all the time.

However, sometimes the odds work against you.

I tend to avoid ethanol (I use either Coop premium in Calgary or Shell V-Power if on the road, both 91 octane, both ethanol free) but that is largely out of loyalty/points collection issues. If in a jam, I will use the odd tank of Esso or whatever.
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      09-02-2014, 10:49 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
well, that is the whole debate right there.

In theory, 94 Octane should be better.

but as any amount of internet research will tell you, the risk of ethanol is that the alcohol can collect water condensate, which (to get technical) is very bad for your car's insides. So many drivers avoid ethanol like death.

In reality, ethanol is probably not the best thing and it has risks, but like most things a 'risk' means that, most of the time, you will be fine. Lots of non-premium gas has ethanol and most people likely fill up their regular cars with that gas all the time.

However, sometimes the odds work against you.

I tend to avoid ethanol (I use either Coop premium in Calgary or Shell V-Power if on the road, both 91 octane, both ethanol free) but that is largely out of loyalty/points collection issues. If in a jam, I will use the odd tank of Esso or whatever.
I see... that's the thing for me as well, I have petro points and the 5cents discount. So, I usually get the Petro 91. But I was thinking to go with Ultra94 for my M4. I haven't had any issue with my 335i and 535i on petro-can yet.

Also, the actual octane would depend on the amount of ethanol right? If they mix 5% ethanol, then you would be down to 89.3% octane (0.94 * 0.95)? So, would that not make Shell better, but then I lose my 5 cents saving
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      09-02-2014, 11:25 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyboy View Post
I see... that's the thing for me as well, I have petro points and the 5cents discount. So, I usually get the Petro 91. But I was thinking to go with Ultra94 for my M4. I haven't had any issue with my 335i and 535i on petro-can yet.

Also, the actual octane would depend on the amount of ethanol right? If they mix 5% ethanol, then you would be down to 89.3% octane (0.94 * 0.95)? So, would that not make Shell better, but then I lose my 5 cents saving
I think the Ethanol actually does boost the octane (booze burns, right? they have alcohol fueled dragsters) though I know I have read some people saying it doesn't really count (though I haven't dug far enough to know why not).
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      09-02-2014, 11:57 AM   #33
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I think the paranoia about Ethanol was caused by all the fuel pump issues that the N54 engine had that may have been related. Anyway, they should have fixed the problem by now and there should not be any concern about using 10% ethanol gas. I never had any problems (fuel pump or otherwise) running higher octane gas with ethanol in my tuned 335, so I am going to stick with my practice of running Husky 94 (the only HO pump fuel available in these parts) in the summer and Shell 91 in the winter.
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      09-02-2014, 01:13 PM   #34
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When I purchased my '14 Cayenne GTS they told me that the issue with the ethanol is that the fuel with it burns hotter. This can negatively affect seals in the engine. I am good with teeth, not so hot with engine components. Having said that, I was told that Porsche had cleared their vehicles for ethanol use, but AFAIK, BMW has not.

Not sure what to make of this, as I ran my e46 M3 exclusively on Petro Canada 91 for 75K km without an ounce of problems. However, not sure that I would do it again. I figure if Shell V Gold is good enough for Ferrari, it's good enough for me.
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      09-03-2014, 04:50 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunnyboy View Post
Hey guys, are you sure Shell's gasoline does not have ethanol? I think this is still dependent on the province. I found the following Ontario requirement that all fuel be blended with minimum of 5% ethanol...

http://www.ontario.ca/environment-an...hanol-gasoline



Hmmm, took a second look and it said "all fuel at your location combined". Therefore, I guess if the lower grades are E10, then by volume Shell's V-91 can be ethanol free... hmmm

For me Shell V power, I save my gas receipts... hoarder.
See FAQ 2, bullet 3:
•Shell V-Power premium gasoline in Canada does not contain ethanol.

http://www.shell.ca/en/products-serv...power/faq.html

Bronze 10, V power 0, Silver is a mix yielding 5%. Most by bronze so easy to meet 5% rule.

Also, the pumps that I go to in GTA is written on the pump, Vpower NO ethanol.

I am happy, so far.
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      09-04-2014, 09:53 AM   #36
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I'd be interested to see how negligible the difference would be (whp wise) in terms of Shell 91 (no eth) vs. Petro 94 (10% eth).
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      09-04-2014, 10:00 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCsquared View Post
I'd be interested to see how negligible the difference would be (whp wise) in terms of Shell 91 (no eth) vs. Petro 94 (10% eth).
Well we would need 2 of the same cars, with the same transmission also past the 2000km service and have one with 94 petro can and the other with 91 shell, one dyno on the same day.

I am going to dyno soon, so we have a M4 6spd manual that will have 94 in it.

So we just need another.
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      09-04-2014, 10:01 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by farbmw View Post
Well we would need 2 of the same cars, with the same transmission also past the 2000km service and have one with 94 petro can and the other with 91 shell, one dyno on the same day.

I am going to dyno soon, so we have a M4 6spd manual that will have 94 in it.

So we just need another.
I would do it, but I'm also staying on the 94 as of right now. I used 91 V-Power for the last 2 years on my previous vehicle and made the switch this time around.
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      09-04-2014, 10:11 AM   #39
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I'm less worried about condensation, and more about detonation. Ethanol or not, BMW recommends 93 to avoid detonation and hence ignition timing retardation. So I'm going above that.
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      09-04-2014, 11:51 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCsquared View Post
I would do it, but I'm also staying on the 94 as of right now. I used 91 V-Power for the last 2 years on my previous vehicle and made the switch this time around.
Ditto to that. I have been with Petro Canada long time and planning to stay... Come on Shell guys...
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      09-13-2014, 04:53 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
I think the Ethanol actually does boost the octane (booze burns, right? they have alcohol fueled dragsters) though I know I have read some people saying it doesn't really count (though I haven't dug far enough to know why not).
Ethanol burns hotter (not good), holds moisture (not good). Just because it burns does not mean it increases octane. Actually, the higher the octane, the LOWER the combustibility. The reason is to allow the mixture to compress WITHOUT igniting due to heat created by compression. You want it to ignite with the spark plug only. Otherwise you get preignition, or pinging and knocking... and much less power and potential damage.
Ethanol is supposedly in the fuel mixture to create a cleaner exhaust by ensuring everything is burnt. But in reality, not necessary, and perhaps we should ask the corn grower government lobbyists to explain why they need to put ethanol in our fuel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanuck View Post
In Canada, Shell V-Power 91 is the only one with no ethanol, if that matters to you.
Not here in BC.
Chevron has a 94 octane without ethanol. Plus, it uses a separate hose, so we don't get 2 litres of "whatever octane+ethanol" the previous purchaser pumped. Big consideration if you have a motorbike... less so on a bigger tank.
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      09-15-2014, 07:57 PM   #42
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Useful site: http://pure-gas.org

Can search by province too
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      09-15-2014, 08:24 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myzmak View Post
Useful site: http://pure-gas.org

Can search by province too
Cool. Thanks for sharing this!
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      09-15-2014, 08:33 PM   #44
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Cool. Thanks for sharing this!
No worries. Saw it posted over in the NW regional forum...
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