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      01-09-2016, 04:14 PM   #23
CanAutM3
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Originally Posted by aboulfad View Post
Thanks for this info CanAutM3 ! So one could artificially up the price by up to 5% and negotiate down if the price is reasonable and acceptable for the buyer to account for part or all the GST. I will ask when the time comes and if, what fee the dealer charges. Did your dealer charge any fees for this "accommodation sale" CanAutM3 ?

So the dealer handles the transaction with the buyer, charges him both taxes, and I get the credit towards my new car? So let's do a fictitious example with rough approximation:

Sales price of used car: 100k
Tax credit: 15k

New car from same dealer: 50K
Tax on new car: 7.5k
Accommodation sales fee:1k

So would I get back a cheque from the dealer of (100+15-50-7.5-1)= 56.5k. That as bobblehead said I go and spend it all in Vegas
I've never had a dealer charge me any additional fees for the 4 accommodation sales I have done.

I don't think you can "pocket" the tax credit. The way it works is that they deduce the value of the "trade-in" from the purchase of your new car and you pay tax on the remaining value. So in your fictive scenario, you would just have no tax to pay. In theory, you would get a 50k check from the dealer. I never heard of a scenario where the car trade-in value is greater than the purchase so not sure how that would work out...

Note, that if you are trading your 1 year old M4 for a 340i, you will likely be the one writting the check .
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      01-09-2016, 05:14 PM   #24
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If a one year old M4 is less value than a 340, then there's something wrong here. Even at 1k per month devaluation, an M sold privately would surely net more than 60k with an original value of 100k !!!

The car surely doesn't devaluate 40% the first year!!!
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      01-09-2016, 09:14 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by aboulfad View Post
If a one year old M4 is less value than a 340, then there's something wrong here. Even at 1k per month devaluation, an M sold privately would surely net more than 60k with an original value of 100k !!!

The car surely doesn't devaluate 40% the first year!!!
Are you sure your M4 was $100k before tax? It would need $25k of options to hit that price point, and I don't recall yours to be loaded (no CCB, no LEDs, no full leather, etc).

Further, 1st year depreciation is the worst, I am pretty sure it will be way way more than $1000/month. On a 24 month lease with 20k km/year, BMW figures a 54% residual, hence 46% depreciation over 2 years. Another point to consider is that options devaluate extremely fast; on some options, you don't recuperate any cost at all.

It also depends how you option your 340i, a loaded 340i hits $70k.
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      01-10-2016, 06:59 AM   #26
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Ok I listed a fictitious value of an M, not my M. It seems there's no data for resale for a one year old M, as it's rare that owners would sell the first year. However the residual value (RV) you list is the one that BMW decides if you want to buy back the car, but if they resell it themselves they mark up. See bobblehead 's first post. So the market value is not necessarily same as RV.

So in "theory", a one year old M could sell privately for more than a residual value, depending on options, conditions and demand! And yes depending on the price of my M before taxes, and a highly optioned 340, you "could" be right that I have to write the cheque I haven't done the math yet, still have few months to see if I change my mind...

OT, Btw, how long have you been driving a coupe? And if you drove a sedan before, did you find the change difficult? I wanted to post a thread in general about that but I am weary of the responses... Just need some confirmation that it's a phase that I may overcome. Merci et bonne année en passant!
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      01-10-2016, 07:40 AM   #27
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In the best case situation, for trading in purpose illustration as an typical example -

After full 12 months of depreciation, dealer may offer you : 80% of the MSRP of the car, as this would be considered as being top end mark. Therefore, if I am to use $95,000 MSRP from my earlier example. Dealer will probably offer you around $76,000 (which equates to about $1583 depreciation per month on average). Dealer will turn around and list it for in the high $80K's.

From month 13 - 24 of depreciation, the worst of the depreciation has start to level off, per se. Such that, after 24 months of use, the dealer may offer you around 70% of MSRP will would be around $65,000. Therefore, the average monthly depreciation for month 13-24 would be around $790 per month.

On a grand scale of averages, full two years of depreciation (from the dealer trade in appraisal perspective offering), your car has gone from $95K MSRP to $65K, which represents about $30K in depreciation, or an overall average of $1250 per month.

My example is not perfect and most accurate depiction on what the dealer will be doing but it's a general indication this may happen in a likely case. Therefore, do take this as just an illustration of example.
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      01-10-2016, 07:50 AM   #28
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I agree. RV will never be the same as retail market value. In between this number is the factor of demand & supply, condition of vehicle, markup by the dealer and other economic factors. After all, the RV is just a "made up" number for leasing purpose which is affected by the interest rate as well. Car manuf. can lower the RV to make the person pay more during the lease term and then with such a low RV, it has the mirage of telling the person leasing the car that at end of lease, you are getting a super cheap price for buying it out compared to the used car market value at the time.


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Originally Posted by aboulfad View Post
Ok I listed a fictitious value of an M, not my M. It seems there's no data for resale for a one year old M, as it's rare that owners would sell the first year. However the residual value (RV) you list is the one that BMW decides if you want to buy back the car, but if they resell it themselves they mark up. See bobblehead 's first post. So the market value is not necessarily same as RV.

So in "theory", a one year old M could sell privately for more than a residual value, depending on options, conditions and demand! And yes depending on the price of my M before taxes, and a highly optioned 340, you "could" be right that I have to write the cheque I haven't done the math yet, still have few months to see if I change my mind...

OT, Btw, how long have you been driving a coupe? And if you drove a sedan before, did you find the change difficult? I wanted to post a thread in general about that but I am weary of the responses... Just need some confirmation that it's a phase that I may overcome. Merci et bonne année en passant!
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      01-10-2016, 07:50 AM   #29
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Thanks @bobblehead, so do I read that from a dealer trade in/sale it's best to trade it in at 2 years if my payments to my LOC (given I bought it) were equal/close to that 2 yr avg payment,Given that first yr the depreciation is much higher?

Of course this all could be different with a private sale but a good guiding principle of what to look for as a minimum for a private sale.
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      01-10-2016, 08:02 AM   #30
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1st year selling the car, no matter what brands of car would be very horrible (unless your desire to get a new car overrides your bank account).

My sweet selling time would be about 2.5 to 3 yrs time. You enjoyed the car long enough and may be bored now while there is still factory warranty left to command a slight premium asking price
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      01-10-2016, 01:33 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboulfad View Post
Ok I listed a fictitious value of an M, not my M. It seems there's no data for resale for a one year old M, as it's rare that owners would sell the first year. However the residual value (RV) you list is the one that BMW decides if you want to buy back the car, but if they resell it themselves they mark up. See bobblehead 's first post. So the market value is not necessarily same as RV.

So in "theory", a one year old M could sell privately for more than a residual value, depending on options, conditions and demand! And yes depending on the price of my M before taxes, and a highly optioned 340, you "could" be right that I have to write the cheque I haven't done the math yet, still have few months to see if I change my mind...

OT, Btw, how long have you been driving a coupe? And if you drove a sedan before, did you find the change difficult? I wanted to post a thread in general about that but I am weary of the responses... Just need some confirmation that it's a phase that I may overcome. Merci et bonne année en passant!
Just keep your ///M

I have only owned one 4-door in the nine cars I have owned over my lifetime. The other 8 were all 2-doors including my 3 ///Ms. I don't find much inconvenience with coupes.

Bonne année à toi aussi , beaucoup de santé!!
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      01-10-2016, 01:53 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Just keep your ///M

I have only owned one 4-door in the nine cars I have owned over my lifetime. The other 8 were all 2-doors including my 3 ///Ms. I don't find much inconvenience with coupes.

Bonne année Ã* toi aussi , beaucoup de santé!!
Oh wow! So you're a good opposite of me. This is the first coupe that I own. I only owned 3 cars since the age of 30 (e46 320, e46 325, F82) in total including this one. So you can definitely help me be more accepting of a coupe. But I recall from our get together, you are a super easy going guy and not difficult at all so maybe things don't bother you. You also had your kid with you in the back and I remember you saying it's no trouble at all!

You see we go out a lot me and wife, shopping, movies, restaurants ... Almost on a daily basis, and the parking and putting in stuff in winter in the car is a chore and headache! That is my biggest issue... It almost became a stress that I hesitate taking the coupe.

For parking, even that I park underground or in malls, most spots are not that wide for an F8x, and coupled with the coupe door makes it hard to get in and out (I have easy entry coded). So I have to be creative every time and look for an ok/safe spot. My wife makes fun of me all the time because she has a new Golf and can fit anywhere!

For grocery/shopping bags/food, ... You almost always have to put it in the trunk. if my wife hands me a bag when she gets in, I can't freakin put in the back because of the high seat headrests.

I admitted earlier I think I made a mistake choosing a coupe, I just never knew that these things would bug me that much. Maybe I need help and this way I keep the coupe. BTW, I really appreciate your help and patience, both yours and bobblehead
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