Would you sell your M3/M4 for a Porsche?

[RIP1981]

I did so too. Still own the F80 but it will be either given back to BMW or sold.

I bought a 991.1 4S and love it.

Interior quality is similar, a bit more luxury stuff and final touch in the 911, but the entertainment/navigation is more modern in the F80.

Exterior ... the 911 is gorgeous, just beautiful. A timeless, elegant sports car. And everyone can see the beauty ... women, men ... no matter if a car person or not.
The BMW is just another BMW. Some enthusiasts notice it as the factory tuned M3 setup. For most people it is just a 3 series with in some variations a strange color (mine was also Yas Marina Blue ... and I liked it)
Some will give you thumps up, others will laugh about it and see some kid in it (mentally). They also tune their bimmer ...
Most people don't know that this one really has power

It is somewhat more honest, while the 911 also stands for luxury, financial power. Some people own it just for its reputation without being real car guys.

The main difference is driving experience/feel. The 911 gives so much more feedback, you sit lower and the car is somewhat an extension of your body.

The M3 is just a sedan/coupe. A good one, but it feels heavy, numb, artifical. It isn't also that much more comfortable. Just a tiny bit softer and a bit less noisy.
The 911 sounds better, has much better traction and therfore is much quicker in low speed acceleration or out of very narrow corners. Later on in higher speeds the S models are about as fast as the M3. No real difference.

But to really see the difference you have to go to the track as both are to fast for public traffic.
And there you will notice that the M3 is just a sedan and can't cope with the stress ... the break pads will make the breaking pedal longer and longer fading away.
You really have to modify the M3 to get a real track car.

The 911 on the other hand can cope with quite some laps before having any problems at all. A lot of people can use it stock on the track.

It is quicker mid corner and out of corner most of the time and puts down generally quicker lap times on most tracks in the world. Especially after 2 or 3 laps, when the M3/M4 get slower and slower ... at least if they are stock and have those daily driver qualities, they should have.
You can also make hardcore track tools out of them, but then you lose the daily driver smoothness.

So the only real reason going for the M3/M4 is price and space. It isn't really anything else in daily driving.
The 911 also is comfortable, it is also quite easy on long trips ... it is even a bit smaller for narrow parking places or roads. And the trunk isn't that bad. You can even put someone in the back in emergency situations, though not for long trips
And the 4 variants with AWD also get to points where the M3/M4 will have problems.

Ah and if you like to kill rear tyres and drift a lot ... the M3/M4 are better suited for this. They have a lot less traction and a better general setup for this kind of driving (50/50 weight distribution and a lot to much power for the chassis).

[Bimmer6]

Boys these are all expensive toys, and what you buy depends on your tollerence level on the coin you want to drop. Worst thing to ever do is to justify the price of a toy. This same problem exist with watches, shoes, and clothing. My mom asked me why did I drop 30k on a watch, and I simply said why did you spend 20k on earrings? Case closed no reason other than we purchased what we wanted. The same for all the folks on this board had the option of buying a car 50% of the value, but all chose not too. My message here enjoy what you have, and never put yourself in a situation saying why did you spend that much coin on a car? Trust me people are saying that about all on this board ......it's all relative. Enjoy life, and be safe.

My model for toys it should come after savings, investing for the future, kids college, and what's left have some freaking fun!

[Xtabi]

No time soon for me. Love my M3!

[///F80M3]

Originally Posted by sdshah

If I wanted a Porsche I would have to be able to afford one... that's the better answer for most people. And rightfully so. M3/4 are an amazing value and spending all that money on a Porsche 991 or XYZ might not make sense.

If you wanted ANY car you would have to afford it.

Obviously lol

[Powerslide]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

Certain things can be quantified, others cannot. Performance is a world of diminishing returns.

One could easily use your argument meant to say an M4 GTS isn't worth more than twice the premium of an m3/4, especially considering its not nearly twice as fast or twice as fast in the track either. I could also say the M4 GTS isn't worth the money because a 991.2S which is 2/3 of the price embarassss it around the track. It depends on what you value. I don't think you need 2X the performance or track time for a car to be worth double. In my opinion the things you cannot quantify are the ones you can't put a price tag on. And after all, those cars that are 2 or 3 times the cost, will still sell at any price the manufacturer decides to sell them for. Porsche will still sell GT3 RS' and Mclaren the 675LT for 3-5 times the price of a Z06 even though the z06 is comparable in performance because they offer more than just the performance.

Ok. One thing nobody disagrees with here is that the 991 911 is a great car - from base model on up (so is the new 718). Nobody disagrees that from a purely-performance standpoint - it is more capable that the F8x (for how much more expensive it is, and given it is a no-compromise rear-biased 2-seat layout with no accomodation for a 4-seat sedan, 4-seat coupe, 4-seat convertible or station wagon - with a front-engine and RWD - I would sure hope so..The 991.2 version really takes it to another level...

But seriously - your constant Porsche-a$$ licking on this forum every chance you get is getting really old here. There is not one positive thing anyone can say on here about the F8x without you constantly "one-upping" it with yet another Porsche accolade. You're like the guy who everyone here has met at some point in his or her life, where whenever someone tells a story, you always have a "bigger and better" version of the same story, no matter the circumstances.

So - in all seriousness - why do you constantly feel the need to "one up" BMW or other performance makes (Corvette) with yet another "Porsche's better" post? Then when the Z06, Corvette GS or some other make outdoes your beloved Porsche, you always have some flimsy excuse for it?? Remember that the base F8x put up very similar lap times (and is much faster in a straight line) than the 991.1 base model, and it wasn't until the 991.2 that Porsche really surpassed its performance in base-level trim (several years later) and without anywhere near the level of versatility...

You're probably a nice guy who loves cars just like the rest of us - which is cool. But please - you're on a BMW forum. It's weird that you come on to a BMW forum to talk about nothing other than Porsche literally nonstop...(dont' they have Porsche forums)???? Just imagine every time you're at work, at a family function or in some other social event and the same exact person keeps showing up at each and every such event and is looking for every single opportunity to "one-up" each and every single story you tell - annoying right? Guess what - you're that guy... Go back and check your posting history if you have any doubt.

Nothing wrong with you mentioning Porsche on a BMW forum - just try to take it down a notch or two...

[sdshah]

Originally Posted by ///F80M3

If you wanted ANY car you would have to afford it.

Obviously lol

Well if you can then you should. Not even a close comparison. BMW customer service and car performance are not even close to Porsche.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by Powerslide

Ok. One thing nobody disagrees with here is that the 991 911 is a great car - from base model on up (so is the new 718). Nobody disagrees that from a purely-performance standpoint - it is more capable that the F8x (for how much more expensive it is, and given it is a no-compromise rear-biased 2-seat layout with no accomodation for a 4-seat sedan, 4-seat coupe, 4-seat convertible or station wagon - with a front-engine and RWD - I would sure hope so..The 991.2 version really takes it to another level...

But seriously - your constant Porsche-a$$ licking on this forum every chance you get is getting really old here. There is not one positive thing anyone can say on here about the F8x without you constantly "one-upping" it with yet another Porsche accolade. You're like the guy who everyone here has met at some point in his or her life, where whenever someone tells a story, you always have a "bigger and better" version of the same story, no matter the circumstances.

So - in all seriousness - why do you constantly feel the need to "one up" BMW or other performance makes (Corvette) with yet another "Porsche's better" post? Then when the Z06, Corvette GS or some other make outdoes your beloved Porsche, you always have some flimsy excuse for it?? Remember that the base F8x put up very similar lap times (and is much faster in a straight line) than the 991.1 base model, and it wasn't until the 991.2 that Porsche really surpassed its performance in base-level trim (several years later) and without anywhere near the level of versatility...

You're probably a nice guy who loves cars just like the rest of us - which is cool. But please - you're on a BMW forum. It's weird that you come on to a BMW forum to talk about nothing other than Porsche literally nonstop...(dont' they have Porsche forums)???? Just imagine every time you're at work, at a family function or in some other social event and the same exact person keeps showing up at each and every such event and is looking for every single opportunity to "one-up" each and every single story you tell - annoying right? Guess what - you're that guy... Go back and check your posting history if you have any doubt.

Nothing wrong with you mentioning Porsche on a BMW forum - just try to take it down a notch or two...

I like my M4. It's fast enough, it handles well, but it leaves a lot to be desired in what I value most; steering feel, overall suspension tuning (rebound and dampening), a car that is planted, and sound. I do think it looks quite good from most angles, and while I do think the 6mt needs work, I still like having 3 pedals best. It's almost as if people can't handle what in my cases are almost universal and well known shortcomings. The current M3/4 are more of an acquired taste. My own experience was not love at first drive.
As for a base 991.1 vs an M3/4, I would certainly hope it could put up close times, given the whopping advantage it has in power to weight (8.4 vs 9.3). To me, I view that from a different lens.

When you look at some of the prices people are paying for these, I have no idea where you find value in these cars above ~75K. I hope the below isn't a reality of what anyone would actually pay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2017-BMW-M3-...m=252744913689

115K for an M3? In 2 years that car will be worth less than half that.

I won't disagree that I'm more a Porsche fan than anything, but my advice would be not to over index on the opinion piece(s) of my posts. I am not trying to be dictatorial, but share my own view and perspective. If everyone had the same thing to say, I doubt a lot of these conversations would exist.

[Jockey]

Wow, didn't even know you have an M4 since all you talk about is Porsche

[basscadet]

My only complaint about my '15 M3 is that you have push a bunch of buttons in the car AND drive it hard to make it feel like a M car.

My next car will be a 991.2 C2S or the Alfa as I definitely desire more driver involvement without having to drive like a maniac. This, coincidentally, was the same problem I had with the GT-R: you just have to beat the thing to make it fun.

Until the turbo 3.0 in the new Carerras, I wouldn't be caught dead in one as they were seriously down on power. Now it's a totally different world. Porsche is going to sell a shitload of them.

[neilum]

I think the short answer is if you can afford a $100K + car and only need two doors, most reasonable people who say hell yes.

I am not there yet with either of these two things unfortunately, hey I'm 36 and still working on getting to that level.

911 GT3, RS, 911 GTS, 911 S/4S, Turbo 911 models, 718, Cayman Gt4 are all absolutely bonkers good, fast and just incredible.

But, they are all very expensive and are built as pure sports cars that don't have to compromise price, chassis, layout or really anything. .

Now if the question is would I trade my car for any 4 door or Porsche SUV in the same price range as the M3, no. Hell no.

[tareemaa]

My F80 was fun but sold it to get back into an E90 M3 for daily duties and 997.2 4S for fun, was able to get this done for marginal increase in my monthly expense, well worth it.

Every car enthusiast should own a Porsche at some time in they're life.

[jpdchicago]

No. I need the trunk in my Gts.
More seriously, the 911 just does not do it for me and that is the only model series capable of keeping up with the M4 gts.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

blah blah

Any car company can make a fast car. Nothing proprietary there. Perfecting the way a car drives, the way it feels, the input and output of everything from the clutch to the steering to the shifter is truly priceless and why the Porsche experience is so much better. Add in the most successful company in racing, their impeccable and high quality and you get a higher price tag.
blah blah

Actually, you forgot the most important reason for the higher price tag of Porsche.. people like you who have drunk the koolaid and gotten hooked by the marketing hype, hook line and sinker

c'mon man.. I agree that 911 are great, and I like mine a lot too, but you are causing some bad stereotypes here for p-car owners

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by jpdchicago

No. I need the trunk in my Gts.
More seriously, the 911 just does not do it for me and that is the only model series capable of keeping up with the M4 gts.

This I find as an odd argument. An M4 GTS, which is less practical than a 911 and yet saying you need the trunk doesn't reconcile. A 991.2S spanks an M4 GTS around the track while being a GT car in comparison, actually has more storage space and can provide seating for 3 or 4 in a squeeze. I get not everyone needs to love the 911, but I just don't see saying the trunk makes a difference when you gave up a back seat, which is the main reason why people buy them instead of something that is more of a 2 seater. To each their own.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Actually, you forgot the most important reason for the higher price tag of Porsche.. people like you who have drunk the koolaid and gotten hooked by the marketing hype, hook line and sinker

c'mon man.. I agree that 911 are great, and I like mine a lot too, but you are causing some bad stereotypes here for p-car owners

I don't think it has anything to do with the former. Marketing hype? I don't think a car company that is universally praised for their cars (any model) as one of, if not the best, would be 'marketing hype'. Marketing hype and controlling results, that's got Ferrari written all over it. Porsche doesn't need to hype their products, they just send them for comparisons and let the results speak for themselves.

Which model 911 do you own?

[jpdchicago]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

This I find as an odd argument. An M4 GTS, which is less practical than a 911 and yet saying you need the trunk doesn't reconcile. A 991.2S spanks an M4 GTS around the track while being a GT car in comparison, actually has more storage space and can provide seating for 3 or 4 in a squeeze. I get not everyone needs to love the 911, but I just don't see saying the trunk makes a difference when you gave up a back seat, which is the main reason why people buy them instead of something that is more of a 2 seater. To each their own.

The trunk argument was a tongue in cheek comment. Hence the "more seriously" in the following sentence.
I know the ultimate 911 will beat the ultimate M. Just cannot warm up to it for everyday driving. It also seems like, in the north shore of Chicago, every other car is a Porsche or a Land Rover. I like to be a little different.
Porsche is probably the best all around car manufacturer for everyday sport driving. Just not my personal taste.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by jpdchicago

The trunk argument was a tongue in cheek comment. Hence the "more seriously" in the following sentence.
I know the ultimate 911 will beat the ultimate M. Just cannot warm up to it for everyday driving. It also seems like, in the north shore of Chicago, every other car is a Porsche or a Land Rover. I like to be a little different.
Porsche is probably the best all around car manufacturer for everyday sport driving. Just not my personal taste.

I'd hardly call a basic Carrera S an ultimate 911, but I get everyone has different tastes. I get wanting to be different too, which is one of the reasons, among many others, I want to check out the Giulia QV. I don't even care for 4 doors, but that car is certainly something very interesting and the reviews say it brings a level of occasion and excitement, which is why I love me 911.

[jpdchicago]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

I'd hardly call a basic Carrera S an ultimate 911, but I get everyone has different tastes. I get wanting to be different too, which is one of the reasons, among many others, I want to check out the Giulia QV. I don't even care for 4 doors, but that car is certainly something very interesting and the reviews say it brings a level of occasion and excitement, which is why I love me 911.

By ultimate, I meant 911 GT3 RS vs M4 GTS.
The M4 gts is left in the dust, but I would not drive a GT3 RS to work every day.
M4 gts? No problem.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by jpdchicago

By ultimate, I meant 911 GT3 RS vs M4 GTS.
The M4 gts is left in the dust, but I would not drive a GT3 RS to work every day.
M4 gts? No problem.

I get that, but in reality all you need to beat an M4 GTS in the Porsche line is a 991.2 Carrera S. If you put cup tires on it to match the GTS, the beating is would be even worse. I'd even guess a base 911 on cup tires would be quite close to an M4 GTS given how much faster the S is.

I would daily a GT3, but an RS I wouldn't. I wouldn't for an M4 GTS either (and, yes, I've driven one).

[Jockey]

What's with the fetish of having the fastest daily driver?

I almost, almost bought a Cayman S as my daily but quickly realized I would be driving it much less because it's not that practical.

Everytime I look at Porsche I realize I'm spending more money on a car I would drive less.

[NorCal f80]

you cant beat porsche and audi interior. best imo

if money wasnt an issue i would have porsche cayenne turbo , gt3 , and 918 .

[Russkey]

Some people have hard time to accept the fact that there are better cars out there, especially if we are talking about Porsche. I talk cars with different types of people and some are clearly hating on better or newer cars only because they are not the ones they chose or could afford.