new render: M4 Gran Coupe anyone?

[i001947]

Originally Posted by E92_SID

Am I the only one that says NO to an M4GC? I think the M6GC is dead sexy but the M4 is too bulbous as a 4 door. I think an MSport 435i is good enough for the 4 series GC platform.

No, you are not the only who thinks the M4GC is a $$$ mistake.

[Jadar]

God please no!!! Do not build this! It's a joke.

[mdss6]

Originally Posted by Jonjt

The differences between the GC and the standard 3er seem rather miniscule. Could someone who understands explain to me what the business arguement is for having a standard 3er and a GC variant of every single coupe BMW makes? They're so close in looks and options, I can't see how BMW can justify the cost of producing two, nearly identitical models. GM did this years ago and look where it got them....

Hi. The business argument is that I, and enough other people to make it profitable, find a hatch to be a significance difference worth paying for. You may find them insignificant or even negative, but in either case the answer is super super easy for you - don't buy one! And don't lose any more sleep over other people being able to.

And I'd argue GM's big failing on the car side of the business "badge engineering" the same sedans under multiple different brands/dealership chains rather than offering multiple versions (coupe, sedan, wagon etc) of the same vehicle.

The truck side of the business was and always has been highly profitable with a model more like what BMW is doing with the 3-series range. You can get a full-size truck any way you want it. Long bed, short bed, regular bed, 2x4, 4x4, regular cab, extended cab, etc. etc. etc. And I doubt the forums were filled with people squealing "stop" when they decided to offer crew cabs and different payload ratings. "I'm buying a regular cab, I don't even understand why someone should be able to buy a crew cab? GM is betraying the core pickup buyer."

Originally Posted by starbai

seriously its getting really old. Dont like the 4 series. dont buy it, don't see why everyone's panties are so sandy beacuse of this. Only issue i can see is it pushing resales of 3 series sedans down becuase while people may not be willing to pay for a new 4GC over a 3 new, used, i've a feeling people will be clamoring for them.

+1. Amen.

Originally Posted by discoboy1

Just do an M3 wagon instead

I'd also be delighted to see an M3 wagon!

Originally Posted by spuntyb

Would still take an M3 over this.

And I agree 100% with the M3 wagon idea. Would love to see them make that and then see Audi bring over the RS6 Avant.

Again +1 to the wagon. But for everyone planning to take an M3 instead...you can easily vote with your checkbook. I'm confident BMW will make one for you! And I think that is fabulous. I'm glad the M3 and M4 both exist.

Does it hurt you if I can buy an M4 GC? If so, how?

[Randy M]

Not interested in the car but rather the color. Is it a stock BMW color?

[M4Trojan]

Originally Posted by Rated R

Not interested in the car but rather the color. Is it a stock BMW color?

I just went through this entire thread hoping someone had answered that. But no, just a lot of complaints about BMW. I'm with you though, I like the color.

[M3ryder55]

i wasn't a fan of the V8 back to the I6TT, but I understand environmental regulations cracked down on all of the manufactures in the European Union. Fine

M3 Sedan and M4 Couple --> ok BMW I understand, doing what Audi does w/ the A4/A5. Something uncharacteristic of you to copy another competitors ideas. But again its a business so thats fine. And no more M3 coupe or sedan, 335 coupe or sedan 328 etc etc. Fine. All the coupes now are 4 series and the sedans are 3 series. Ok thats fine

Color Choices- limited and controversial but thats the way the first year of production is going to be we can live with it. Fine

M4 gran coupe now? No. This will make me loose respect for BMW and I'm a die hard BMW fanatic, from the time I was a young boy. At 13-14 my entire wall in my bedroom was covered in modded E46 M3 pics in a collage. I don't like the direction this company seems to be heading. I know it's a money grab, but at the very least if your going to do this, don't make an M4 gran coupe. Keep it to the regular models.

[Oliver1]

Originally Posted by palpatine_us

I read this last week somewhere, but I can't remember who said it.

The previous bar to having so many different types or variations of cars was the cost of tooling each and every assembly line- typically every car model had its own line and very few cars (except GM clones) shared a line. GM tried to do this with Cadillac, Buick and Chevy- Cimarron, Sky lark and Cavalier respectively. This failed miserably because the Cimarron's quality was horrible.

In today's times, you can get multiple cars off one line with very little price differences. Now, BMW can do this with the 3, 3 GT, 4, 4GC. They can charge a premium for the 3GT, 4 and 4 GS. However, they all play in a similar price playground. There is a high quality requirement for all cars- plus the engine/power trains are all compatible.

If Mary only likes the 3, Billy only likes the 3GT, Sally only likes the 4 and Jimmy only likes the 4 GC- How many cars will be sold? Previously, they'd only have 1 sale for the original 3- now they have 4 sales- Three of the sales at premium value- for minor tooling differences. Everyone is happy. Including BMW finance guys.

So stop complaining about why so many variants and give me a M4 GC. It looks damn good.

The 4GC is a three-way cross between the coupe, the sedan, and the wagon. BMW is hoping this car will appeal to all three buyers instead of having to make three different versions for 3 different tastes.

Personally, I am only interested in a cross between a coupe and a sedan, they can leave out the wagon part.

[mdss6]

Originally Posted by M3ryder55

M4 gran coupe now? No. This will make me loose respect for BMW and I'm a die hard BMW fanatic, from the time I was a young boy. At 13-14 my entire wall in my bedroom was covered in modded E46 M3 pics in a collage. I don't like the direction this company seems to be heading. I know it's a money grab, but at the very least if your going to do this, don't make an M4 gran coupe. Keep it to the regular models.

Originally Posted by dd1981

God please no!!! Do not build this! It's a joke.

Hi. The M4 GC idea seems to generate a lot of passion, with a fair bit (or perhaps an "unfair" bit) being negative. Trying to understand this, I ask, what are the regular models? The coupe is certainly the traditional model. The much heavier and more flexible convertible is the second most traditional (in terms of model years of existence). Is that regular? For a great majority of the history of the M3 there was no sedan, but does that qualify as regular? Just the coupe?

The M4 GC would be lighter and stiffer than the M4 convertible (unless the M4 GC weighs a lot more than the 435 GC and the M4 convertible weighs A LOT less than the 435 convertible model, in which case these bets are off) and only a bit more of an anomaly than the sedan (and number change) in M3/M4 history.
What line does it cross that seems so wrong?

High performance hatchbacks are definitely rare in the USA, so I admit you probably represent the majority, and my interest in one is a minority view. But what part of it is more offensive than another variant?

[3XTR3M3]

I would buy the fuck out of this

[JTO24]

Not a fan.. Too 3 series GT, IMO.

[ojp5q]

Originally Posted by 3XTR3M3

I would buy the fuck out of this

Yeah, I don't see the problem. Another BMW on the market is a win for me. This car looks solid, would drive well (I'm sure), and is just another entry in that market segment. I'd buy the Shib out of it too!

Just my opinion.

[Eichler1]

Originally Posted by stormlv

Isn't this the 3 series vs the 4 series GC argument all over again?

Yes, and it's an argument worth continuing, because aside from dedicated hair-splitters and those relatively few BMW customers who care whether the first number on the decklid is a 3 or a 4, people are not going to be able to tell 3GTs and 4GCs apart. As I posted before Mazda offered essentially the same look in the '90s. There is nothing new under the sun. Too bad all the marketing energy devoted to making 3GTs and 4GCs relevant isn't directed to helping US buyers "get" tourings/ wagons / estates.

[monkawekrue]

nice render.

[Jonjt]

Originally Posted by danniexi

That's a stupid question. Why have x and not y?

Because they SELL. They make money. What else do car companies want?

A stupid reply from a fool who confuses a quick wit for a myopic vision.

Here's a quick lesson in business: the best ones don't make decisions just because someone else can SELL something. They also make decisions because they know WHY things sell, as well. Do you understand what, say, a fad is? Those can be expensive and avoiding a loss while catering to one requires knowing WHY something interests the market. Metlife's aversion to certain derivative trading tools is a fantastic example of this. Get it?

[Jonjt]

Originally Posted by mdss6

You may find them insignificant or even negative, but in either case the answer is super super easy for you - don't buy one! And don't lose any more sleep over other people being able to.

Learn to relax. Your imagined slight was actually a very simply question. Why you can't answer a question without the posturing is beyond intelligent comprehension. Hint: that last sentence was definitely worth getting angry over.

Originally Posted by mdss6

And I'd argue GM's big failing on the car side of the business "badge engineering" the same sedans under multiple different brands/dealership chains rather than offering multiple versions (coupe, sedan, wagon etc) of the same vehicle.

That's part of it, certainly.

Originally Posted by mdss6

offer crew cabs and different payload ratings

Being someone who is familiar with the particulars of work trucks, the value in differentiation is obvious. As such your quote (particularly the sarcastic delivery):

Originally Posted by mdss6

"I'm buying a regular cab, I don't even understand why someone should be able to buy a crew cab? GM is betraying the core pickup buyer."

Is just stupid. It's particularly funny how it is assumed I'm annoyed over BMW's supposed betrayls when you don't have a clue what my disposition actually is. Enquiries somehow equal disdain? Right.

The idea in asking about the sedan/coupe/GC/GT differentation direction is no different from asking why GM makes different trucks. The answer to the latter is that different folks need different payloads and/or different amounts of space to move people. If the answer to the BMW specific question is simply aesthetic and "well, I just like the fastback style" or "BMW is predicting a market in the medium term wherein people want such differentiation in the cars they buy" is all that BMW needed to justify their design decisions, then all you have to do is say so. It's really, really easy.

I hesitate to think what happens when you have a real problem. Does your head explode? (did it explode just now??)

[EMpunker]

I don't really care if BMW wants to make the M4 Gran Coupe.

I'm just wondering why they split up the names in the first place.

The 4 GC goes against BMW's own logic of having the two door models as even numbers...

They should have just left the name alone as the 3 series instead of splitting it up:

3 sedan, 3 coupe, 3 wagon, 3 gran coupe, 3 convertible.

[mdss6]

Originally Posted by Jonjt

Hint: that last sentence was definitely worth getting angry over.

My apologies for giving you reason to get angry.

Originally Posted by Jonjt

The idea in asking about the sedan/coupe/GC/GT differentation direction is no different from asking why GM makes different trucks. The answer to the latter is that different folks need different payloads and/or different amounts of space to move people. If the answer to the BMW specific question is simply aesthetic and "well, I just like the fastback style" or "BMW is predicting a market in the medium term wherein people want such differentiation in the cars they buy" is all that BMW needed to justify their design decisions, then all you have to do is say so. It's really, really easy.

Obviously we disagree on if the differences between sedans, wagons, hatchbacks, convertibles etc are "simply aesthetic" or if they reflect something more along the lines of "different folks need different payloads and/or different amounts of space to move people." Or maybe it wasn't obvious. But I tried to convey that for the many buyers like myself willing to pay for a hatchback, the difference from a coupe or sedan is far from simply aesthetic.

Originally Posted by Jonjt

I hesitate to think what happens when you have a real problem. Does your head explode? (did it explode just now??)

Hasn't yet.

[RoboM]

Kinda wish this was M3 LCI rather than M4 GC.

[Alpine F31]

Originally Posted by discoboy1

Just do an M3 wagon instead

PLEASE

[Alpine F31]

Originally Posted by EMpunker

The 4 GC goes against BMW's own logic of having the two door models as even numbers..

BMW never said "two door models" will have even numbers. They said "coupes" will have even numbers. So as long as they insist on calling a fastback 4 door car a "coupe" they can justify giving it an even numbered moniker.

The model name "435i" is a million times better than "X6 xDrive35i" Who's idea was that?