The Jeremy Clarkson BMW M4 Review

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by M3guy3

come on man, you really think i dont know BMW has been making trubo engines for years now ?

i am talking about there top of the line performance engine.

Ever heard of this little guy?

[MParallel]

Don't forget the original BMW Turbo

[Kayani_1]

Heed your own advice

Defending it tirelessly will not make it true

Originally Posted by myzmak

Give. It. Up.

Saying that repeatedly does not make it so.

[Kayani_1]

Here is a bad boy 900 hp BMW F1 turbo engine.



I never have an issue with what type of an engine but rather how much theatricals, performance and fun factor that engine provides. An engine with no noise or just ok noises is half the fun gone.

I think BMW needs to work on making the turbo engine sound better so does every other manufacturer. Also, the free flowing fast revving nature needs to be incorporated in a better fashion into turbo series of engines across the manufacture lineups. The pleasure of S65 or S85 are that they are very free quick revving engines they go through rpms like nothing due to their power band and character. I believe that nature makes it more fun.

I predict we will go to more linear power band with electric + turbo combination with no turbo lag. However, sound factor and free revving factor on turbo motor still needs to be worked on by automotive industry in general.

Originally Posted by M3guy3

come on man, you really think i dont know BMW has been making trubo engines for years now ?

i am talking about there top of the line performance engine.

[M3guy3]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

I

I think BMW needs to work on making the turbo engine sound better so does every other manufacturer. Also, the free flowing fast revving nature needs to be incorporated in a better fashion into turbo series of engines across the manufacture lineups. The pleasure of S65 or S85 are that they are very free quick revving engines they go through rpms like nothing due to their power band and character. I believe that nature makes it more fun.

I predict we will go to more linear power band with electric + turbo combination with no turbo lag. However, sound factor and free revving factor on turbo motor still needs to be worked on by automotive industry in general.

the only way to get a better sound out of a turbo engine, is to route less exhaust gases away from turbo and out the tail pipes. Which i cant see happening anytime soon.

Or use a electric trubo that has little to no exhaust gases being routed to the turbos. That kind of stuff is years away also.

Another thing is that a lot of people don't really care about sound that much either. They like the power more than anything else. turbo engines can make huge power in this sense. so many people are happy.

BUT the reason why we went turbos was to reduce emissions, increase MPG, reduce engine size etc. So the automotive world was dealt a hand to play, i am sure things will improve.

[JoeFromPA]

I wonder how much this car has been driven by some commentators.

It is free-revving, fast-revving, exciting, and sounds glorious. It is not the glory of a v8, but instead the raucous bad-behavior of a schoolyard bully who mated with a large-bore Porsche flat six.

[M3 Esq]

Originally Posted by modkrazy

Well, BMW's successful motorsport cars ARE running V8s, including the new M4 DTM car.

It looks like DTM will be moving to turbo engines in 2016. Smaller, more efficient turbo engines are the future.

http://www.racer.com/more/dtm/item/5...-turbo-engines

[gthal]

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

I wonder how much this car has been driven by some commentators.

It is free-revving, fast-revving, exciting, and sounds glorious. It is not the glory of a v8, but instead the raucous bad-behavior of a schoolyard bully who mated with a large-bore Porsche flat six.

How fast and freely it revs still surprises me... sounds good too

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

Head your own advice

Defending it tirelessly will not make it true

Truly awed by the force of your reasoning.

To summarize, you made a claim and did not actually support it with anything (reference to text, etc).

The point was then discussed and debated extensively between Modkrazy and myself.

You continue to say "I was right"....but, still, without any support at all.

But, I guess one can't argue with crazy so I suppose I would be done with you then.

[modkrazy]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

I think BMW needs to work on making the turbo engine sound better so does every other manufacturer. Also, the free flowing fast revving nature needs to be incorporated in a better fashion into turbo series of engines across the manufacture lineups. The pleasure of S65 or S85 are that they are very free quick revving engines they go through rpms like nothing due to their power band and character. I believe that nature makes it more fun.

I predict we will go to more linear power band with electric + turbo combination with no turbo lag. However, sound factor and free revving factor on turbo motor still needs to be worked on by automotive industry in general.

There is now a subset of automotive design that focuses on designing pleasing soundtracks for future electric cars that will otherwise generate no engine noise. I think once people come to terms with car sound being artificial, and manufacturers are allowed to design them from the ground up (as opposed to oddball hybrid designs that try to straddle the fences like Active Sound), we will get nice futuristic sounding cars. Whoosh!

Originally Posted by M3 Esq

It looks like DTM will be moving to turbo engines in 2016. Smaller, more efficient turbo engines are the future.

http://www.racer.com/more/dtm/item/5...-turbo-engines

Yes, bottom line cost and emissions is the only thing anyone is concerned with anymore.

"The important point that all the manufacturers have accepted is cost reduction. This will allow them to run around the world with the same car and engine." ...the move away from V8s was also designed to mirror the downsizing of engines in the manufacturers' ranges of road cars. "If we can achieve a format where you can transform you basic race engine for serial applications it would save a lot of money for the manufacturers."

The future of DTM is so awesome, you guys, it's going to be so much cheaper for the manufacturers! Yay!

Interestingly enough, they are going to 2-liter DI 4-pots with KERS, so it seems like BMW's flat-6 racing days will remain in the past.

[gthal]

Originally Posted by myzmak

Truly awed by the force of your reasoning.

To summarize, you made a claim and did not actually support it with anything (reference to text, etc).

The point was then discussed and debated extensively between Modkrazy and myself.

You continue to say "I was right"....but, still, without any support at all.

But, I guess one can't argue with crazy so I suppose I would be done with you then.

Why should anyone support anything they say on the internet?

Internet debates are really fun, aren't they?

[ersin]

Originally Posted by gthal

Why should anyone support anything they say on the internet?

You're not allowed to post anything that's wrong on the internet. Right? The internet police enforce this.


Cheers.

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by gthal

Why should anyone support anything they say on the internet?

Internet debates are really fun, aren't they?

That is about the long and short of it.....

....and I guess I (we) can't complain too much about some of the quality of debate here as I (we) do participate in them.....nobody is holding a gun to my head to make me reply to those silly posts.

But, then again, I am just an argumentative s.o.b. to begin with so...

(to which you reply: "No you aren't!", to which I reply "Yes am I!" ad infinitum)

[SakhirM4]

Originally Posted by modkrazy

Interestingly enough, they are going to 2-liter DI 4-pots with KERS, so it seems like BMW's flat-6 racing days will remain in the past.

???????

[Kayani_1]

I disagree with this part. If one is any type of an automotive enthusiast the sound a car makes or motorcycle makes plays a big part in its appeal. There is a reason why after market exhaust sell like hot cakes. Cars like Ferrari, Lambo, Porsche, Corvette, Jaguar, Aston, BMW M cars of past, MB AMG cars, Mustangs, Camaros, Ford GT, Pagani, etc...etc....are lusted after not just for their power or speed but for the unique sounds the engine of each car produces to enhance theatricals.

The ones who do not care for sound are already driving Toyota Prius, Buick, or some hush hush Lexus. These are the same folks who look at a car as a mere tool and could not be bothered less about how they got from one place to another as long as they did in comfort. They would rather have the car drive itself while they play on their phone and #### tag it all over the net.


I have yet to meet a single automotive enthusiast who does not care about the glorious sound that a cars engine makes.

Originally Posted by M3guy3

Another thing is that a lot of people don't really care about sound that much either. .

[Kayani_1]

I can see your point but at the same time for now not everyone has had a privilege to drive a car that is hardly out. You would have to take the word of those who do this for a living. All of them find the new engine full on power but less on those other factors I mentioned. The sound is not always the same on internet as it is in person but from all accounts and videos the NA V8 and V10 sang far more gloriously. The turbo engine is not as fast revving as the V8 nor as high. The need to rev fast is mitigated by abundance of torque. These are some simple things that are quiet evident.

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

I wonder how much this car has been driven by some commentators.

It is free-revving, fast-revving, exciting, and sounds glorious. It is not the glory of a v8, but instead the raucous bad-behavior of a schoolyard bully who mated with a large-bore Porsche flat six.

[FTS]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

I have yet to meet a single automotive enthusiast who does not care about the glorious sound that a cars engine makes.

Hello there, very pleased to meet you here; I have no interest in sound quality, loudness or anything else in that area, as long as there is something (not liking e-cars without any sound). I am more interested in the sound of the tires, transmission, chassis and surroundings.

[Kayani_1]

Feelings are mutual, as you failed to make a point and by constantly harping on it no matter how argumentative your nature is it will not change the facts. You have not been able to support anything except repeat your claims over and over like a parrot.


I had already realized the crazy part and kept my replies short to you when you followed me to my other threads and posted in them.

Now relax and take a chill pill and lay off crazy

Originally Posted by myzmak

Truly awed by the force of your reasoning.

To summarize, you made a claim and did not actually support it with anything (reference to text, etc).

The point was then discussed and debated extensively between Modkrazy and myself.

You continue to say "I was right"....but, still, without any support at all.

But, I guess one can't argue with crazy so I suppose I would be done with you then.

[M3guy3]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

I disagree with this part. If one is any type of an automotive enthusiast the sound a car makes or motorcycle makes plays a big part in its appeal. There is a reason why after market exhaust sell like hot cakes. Cars like Ferrari, Lambo, Porsche, Corvette, Jaguar, Aston, BMW M cars of past, MB AMG cars, Mustangs, Camaros, Ford GT, Pagani, etc...etc....are lusted after not just for their power or speed but for the unique sounds the engine of each car produces to enhance theatricals.

The ones who do not care for sound are already driving Toyota Prius, Buick, or some hush hush Lexus. These are the same folks who look at a car as a mere tool and could not be bothered less about how they got from one place to another as long as they did in comfort. They would rather have the car drive itself while they play on their phone and #### tag it all over the net.


I have yet to meet a single automotive enthusiast who does not care about the glorious sound that a cars engine makes.

there are people who just buy cars like the M4 because its a nice and fast car. sadly i have met plenty of "car guys" who dont care about sound.

I was at the track with some friends few weeks ago. There was a guy there with a modded 335i. he had a stock exhaust, with downpipes. the car didn't have much sound to it at all. I asked him about his setup, he was more about making power than anything else. Could careless about sound.

That was just one example.

[Kayani_1]

Originally Posted by FTS

Hello there, very pleased to meet you here; I have no interest in sound quality, loudness or anything else in that area, as long as there is something (not liking e-cars without any sound). I am more interested in the sound of the tires, transmission, chassis and surroundings.

[Kayani_1]

A larger aftermarket downpipe on a 335i even with regular exhaust will make it louder than normal. By itself if one wants the quietest mod for most power the guy was going in wrong direction. His best place for most power and least sound would have been a tune.

I have seen guys like that myself and even had started a thread about it few years back as I went through it. It was hilarious that most guys that were scared to hear their car glorious engine or were forced into reverting back was not doing it by their own choice but were usually doing it for girl friends and wives or for other social aspects. Now there are always those that just drive BMW for status and nothing more or the prius type.

Originally Posted by M3guy3

there are people who just buy cars like the M4 because its a nice and fast car. sadly i have met plenty of "car guys" who dont care about sound.

I was at the track with some friends few weeks ago. There was a guy there with a modded 335i. he had a stock exhaust, with downpipes. the car didn't have much sound to it at all. I asked him about his setup, he was more about making power than anything else. Could careless about sound.

That was just one example.

[M3guy3]

Originally Posted by Kayani_1

A larger aftermarket downpipe on a 335i even with regular exhaust will make it louder than normal. By itself if one wants the quietest mod for most power the guy was going in wrong direction. His best place for most power and least sound would have been a tune.

I have seen guys like that myself and even had started a thread about it few years back as I went through it. It was hilarious that most guys that were scared to hear their car glorious engine or were forced into reverting back was not doing it by their own choice but were usually doing it for girl friends and wives or for other social aspects. Now there are always those that just drive BMW for status and nothing more or the prius type.

just for the record he had a tune. The car had no emotion to it at all.