Guess the M4 CS Sport Auto Supertest ‘Ring time - Update 7:42

[JibSTir13]

~7:42.

[LLNM4]

My cristal ball says 7:35

[manuelf]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

I don't see how this can go well for BMW. Either it gets very close to the M4 GTS continuing to show the GTS was a failure, or it's so slow (my guess is it will be very much so given the power to weight and cup tires) that it only proves furthermore how far behind BMW is especially when they keep touting the CS as a track ready car.

Oh . Simple. It could for instance beat the Cayman GT4. Which is a Porsche GT car! And costs with Porsches super cool pricing strategy for addons nearly as much as the CS... while the CS easily carries 2 adults more and has space for big luggage on top... so in other words the CS could prove, that BMW is way ahead

[manuelf]

Ah - and my guess: 7:39

[mrgicm]

The M3 E46 CSL did it in 7.50 which was 15 years ago. Lets not forget that, to read here on this forum that CP/no CP ia day and night difference bla bla is such BS when you place it in context of NR times.

All CSL/CS/GTS come with semislick tires and that is where 80% of the lap improvment lies...

[BMW M3 CRT]

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/n...7-4178965.html

[Phatcat]

Originally Posted by JibSTir13

~7:42.

Originally Posted by JibSTir13

~7:42.

Spot on!

[Phatcat]

It?s out boys, what you guys think?

[IDBGOD]

Can’t read German. Anyone care to translate? Lol.

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by manuelf

Oh . Simple. It could for instance beat the Cayman GT4. Which is a Porsche GT car! And costs with Porsches super cool pricing strategy for addons nearly as much as the CS... while the CS easily carries 2 adults more and has space for big luggage on top... so in other words the CS could prove, that BMW is way ahead

Well, simply put, it didn’t. Same time as the GT4 EXCEPT the fact that given it has 80 more hp and 130 lb ft more torque a much better power to weight ratio. Add on the fact that the GT4 was a manual and the CS a dual clutch it is very obviously the GT4 (which is now several years old mind you) is the better car. BTW I’d call the GT4 a half GT car.
How about we compare the time to a 991.2S on summer (not cup tires) and oh yea...it’s much faster despite being on lesser tires and having less hp and less torque. No matter what, it just doesn’t stack up well for the M4 CS.
Fact of the matter BMW is well, well, well behind and the M4 GTS and CS have been the proof in the pudding. That is quite apparent.

[JibSTir13]

Originally Posted by Phatcat

Spot on!

Woot Woot!

[CanAutM3]

Rather disappointing .

Of note, the acceleration times and Hockenheimring short track time are the exact same as the one from the comparo with the GT350 published a few months back, which was done in rather hot 35degC conditions. So I assume the CS was not retested for these metrics. They do say that the Nordschleife time was done in good conditions though.

[Parabolica]

That's a pretty average lap time. I was expecting more from this car especially considering the conditions and tires.

[Parabolica]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Rather disappointing .

Of note, the acceleration times and Hockenheimring short track time are the exact same as the one from the comparo with the GT350 published a few months back, which was done in rather hot 35degC conditions. So I assume the CS was not retested for these metrics. They do say that the Nordschleife time was done in good conditions though.

Does that mean you're no longer buying the car? 🙂

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Parabolica

Does that mean you're no longer buying the car? ��

Not sure yet. It's not all about lap times either. All the reviews so far, including this one, say that it is THE M4 to have in terms of driving experience, so it seems the total package is pretty good. I am still waiting on pricing/packaging to make my final decision.

[stevehifi]

slap some r compounds and a simple tune on any regular m4/m3 and you'll get the same time or better.

This car is another $100k marketing trick.

[Captain Unknown GT4]

SUPERTEST BMW M4 CS

Lord GEDECK

Definition of a men's deck in sports auto language? A crisp athlete plus a lonely north loop. If the athlete then still BMW M4 CS is called, the world can only be in order. Or?

Ever heard of REM sleep? This is the phase of sleep in which most dreams occur. And there he is again, my darling, who starts at the hall entrance of my imaginary vehicle collection on an area the size of a soccer field. Far ahead: the half-gods of BMW called E30 M3 Sport Evolution, E36 M3 GT and, of course, the godfather of all BMW special models called M3 CSL. Waking up from the dream becomes reality. Today we meet one on the Nordschleife, which has the stuff to the next new entrance in the dream car hall - welcome to the BMW M4 CS.

Already at the Hatzenbach you fall in love. With the normal models of the current M3 / M4 series you were always so a bit zwiegespalten. Her three-pounder is like hell, but the sound of the biturbo has always been artificially trained against the suckers.

The M4 CS is quite different: its metallic voice imitates a bit the long sold out M4 GTS, without being quite as intrusive. The tin-plated skirt of the CS, mixed with turboprops at the lower speed range and dark thunderbolts at gas pickup sounds more honest than the M4 sound so far.

"G'standnes man's picture"
In addition, one could lament about the weight and the massive stature of an M4. Thanks to its light-footed ideallia search, you can already forget that the M4 CS with a width of 1870 mm is now broader than an M5 of the E60 series (1846 mm), and with 1609 kilos anything but a Lightweight. Especially from a driving dynamics point of view, you immediately feel that developers and test drivers were still working on the old stroke. Or let's say it differently: At the CS the driving dynamics still largely free hand was left. Who has ever driven a current Audi RS 5 knows what I'm talking about. In the RS 5 you know already after the first curve that the sales have the driver dynamics in the handiwork must have chattered. According to the motto: "It should look like an athlete, but the focus should be on everyday comfort."

Compared to the synthetically and decoupled acting RS 5, the M4 CS is what they like to call "G'standnes Mannsbild" in Bavaria:

solid and honest. Compared to the normal M4 Coupé, the M4 CS has drunk even more target water. Even in the Hatzenbach one notices that the coordination of front and rear axle perfectly matches.

The deflection behavior is not too blunt and not too pointed. In other words, the front axle does not obstruct the rear axle during the steering. The reverse is the same. The rear axle does not overload the front axle with its good traction under load. On the contrary, under load the CS does not tend to push over the front axle, but presses slightly with the rear in the border area.

Unlike the M2, which pushed on the north loop under load very hectic and abruptly into the performance overruns, the M4 CS scores with a much better controllable rear axle. The transition from sticking to sliding friction is more smooth and predictable than in the M2, which is due to the 11.9 centimeter longer wheelbase, but also to the higher mechanical grip level of the M4 in general and the CS in particular.

From the entrance right at the Hatzenbach, the following right-left change combination can be run without problems "fully" up to the wide Curb of that right curve, before it goes into the links at the exit Hatzenbach. Not only the mechanical grip is very good, also the standard adaptive suspension swallows the curbs very well in the tightest damper curve of the three selectable modes (Comfort, Sport, Sport +). Nervousness does not occur in CS. The M4 special model does not jump on the north loop ground shafts or curbs, but sits quickly.

At 252 km / h through the fox tube
Cross the path, continue along the "Ideallinienjagd", turn right, then down into the hanging links, and head towards Quiddelbacher Höhe. The CS crashes over the bridge to the aerodrome section. On these high-speed sections, as well as subsequently on the way to the Schwedenkreuz or later in the Kesselchen and on the Döttingerhöhe, one does not cry tears to the predecessor suction engines. The three-liter bit-turbo stroke, which can be dosed easily and can be called up via a wide speed range up to the limiter at 7600 rpm, stimulates the production of the joy of the tear. Compared to the basic M4, the engine called internally S55B30 works with 1.4 instead of 1.25 bar maximum maximum supercharging pressure and brings the CS special model 29 hp more. Thus, the CS is exactly between

Entry M4 and the expired top model M4 GTS with 500 hp. Unlike the GTS, the three-bit biturbo in CS does not have a water injection. With its 460 hp, the special model also offers 10 hp more than with the optional competition package for the M4.

Homeopathic performance is not felt subjectively. Leaves, leaves, leaves - a look at the archive shows that the CS is only slightly ahead of its M4 test colleagues from the past when accelerating up to 200 km / h. The two test cars with a 450 bhp competition package needed 14.0 seconds (at 30 degrees air temperature and 42 degrees asphalt temperature) or 14.2 seconds (at 24 degrees air temperature and 28 degrees asphalt temperature). The Supertest M4 (sport auto 7/2014) accelerated to 200 mph (24 degrees air, 33 degrees asphalt temperature) in 13.7 seconds without competition performance.

With 13.3 seconds, the M4 CS is still slightly faster, although it had to pass the accelerator at brisk hot temperatures (air temperature 35 degrees, asphalt temperature 55 degrees). And the GTS with its 500 hp? The hardcore M4 sprinted in the super test in 12.3 seconds to 200 km / h - however also at optimal temperatures with 13 degrees of air, and 14 degrees of asphalt.

Enough of the Stammtischzahlen. The moderate performance increase is not the only characteristic feature of the M4 CS. It is to be positioned between the M4 with the Competition package and the radical, long sold out M4 GTS. "In contrast to the BMW M4 GTS, BMW has deliberately refrained from focusing on the race track at the M4 CS", is a sentence in the press release. While the M4 CS now races at 259 km / h over the top at the Schwedenkreuz, this set sounds so deeply, as if Bayern Munich itself to the underdog.

On the jumping dive at the Swedish cross, the CS is slightly more feathered than the M4 GTS, but this does not feel uncomfortable and can be controlled at any time. Visually, one might think that the M4 CS would be a kind of "touring package" like the Porsche 911 GT3, almost a wingless M4 GTS. The CS aerodynamics has been somewhat reduced compared to the GTS. The CS carries a fixed carbon front splitter, which can not be adjusted like the GTS-Pendant. Instead of the triple-adjustable GTS tailgate, only a small Gurney is made of carbon on the CS tailgate.

Compared to the GTS race track set-up with maximum wing position (total output at 200 km / h: 52 kilos), the M4 CS comes only to a total output of 4 kilograms at 200 km / h. Comparing the CS with the basic M4, which has 24 kw at 200 km / h on the front axle and 12 kph on the rear axle, the CS-Aero could be optimized.

Compared to the M4 GTS, the CS does not have to fight on the north loop at outside temperatures of 30 degrees Celsius. At a fresh 18 degrees, the three-rider straight forward marched accordingly motivated, and the grip level of the Michelin Pneus remained on the high level over the entire round. At 252 km / h the CS crashes even 1 km / h faster than the GTS into the Fuchsröhren-compression.

Mechanical grip, 460 hp, running!
The mechanical grip of the M4 CS is not quite as high as the GTS, but significantly higher than in the basic M4. In addition to the Michelin Cup Sport Cup 2, which is used for the first time outside of the M4 GTS, the CS suspension is also very well suited for use on the Nordschleifen.

Unlike the GTS, the CS has no adjustable helical gear, as it is more everyday than the hardcore M4, which can be done without question well. On the basis of the competition chassis, the spring rate and damper characteristics have been slightly modified for the M4 CS. In addition, the CS carries new staff with stiffer staff than the competition package. In addition, the developers fine-tune the regulation of the electronically controlled lamellar barrier. Since the M4 has not used cups outside of the GTS model, a further development of the GTS-ABS is used in the CS, which has been tuned very well to the cup tires. The braking values ​​of the CS are even better than those of the M4 GTS - Chapeau!

How good the ABS control fits the gripping level of the cup tires is particularly evident when braking on the narrow curves of the sections Kallenhard and Wehrseifen. Late braking into the curve? In the CS no problem. We recall: For all tuned basic M4, which had previously visited us with Semislicks, problems with the coordination of the series ABS showed at the border. Understandable, because this has not been adapted to the use of cups.

In contrast to the Audi TT RS at the last Supertest, one also has to deal with the topic "Stability of the optional ceramic brake system"

do not worry. Even after several Nordschleife rounds, the pressure point of the M4-CS brake remains constant and easy to dose when braking to the "epicenter of the brake failure" in Breidscheid. The BMW M4 CS can therefore look calmly at the trip into the Nordschleifen tourist driving scene with its future owners.

Uphill-right Ex-mill - from the apex can be booted again early on the accelerator pedal. The traction of a vehicle can be analyzed well at this section of the route. Without a notable lateral drift, the M4 CS crashes up the slope, and then falls a little later with full load through the Lauda Linksknick.

Subsequently, the speed limit is reduced to 215 km / h. On the ground waves in the deceleration zone before, the ABS is the only time to get out of the way during the racetrack visits in Hockenheim and the Nordschleife. The braking point was also optimistic late for the high speed here.

Relax in the kettle. This section of the track hooks the M4 CS loose up to the Mutkurve with a maximum speed of up to 237 km / h. It is interesting again only in the technically demanding passages from the track section Hohe Acht. Especially here, the CS shines again with its successful chassis adjustment and can be precisely placed. Overall, the CS reacts somewhat more than the M4 GTS on load change, but still remains largely unobtrusive in the border area and very easy to ride.

8 seconds faster than the legend CSL
And what steering mode is best for the search for the ideal line? The Electromechanical Adaptive steering system offers the three modes Comfort, Sport and Sport +. The first setting is suitable for a comfortable ride home from the ring or the inner city parking. The last of the three modes replaces the fitness studio with its core steering.

On the racetrack the golden center, the sport mode, is recommended. The feedback is not too acute, but not too deaf around the middle layer. The steering angle need not mean an omnibus, but a real athlete. Unlike in Sport +, the hand moment in sports mode is then on a perfect level - not too lash, but also not susceptible to muscle cramps. In short: A sportive steering has to be felt.

Döttinger Höhe: At 268 km / h, the M4 CS rushes through the left-hand arc under the Bilstein bridge into the Tiergarten. Hohenrain chicane, the last north loop curves are breakfasted, then the target flag drops at the T13. With a lap time of 7.42 minutes, the M4 CS is eight seconds faster than the legendary M3 CSL - if this is not enough qualification for the aforementioned dream car hall. ◾

Text Christian Gebhardt · Photos Hans-Dieter Seufert

MY OPINION

When a car becomes a collector's item and cult status, the purchase price often reaches dizzying heights. The best example is the BMW M3 CSL. Good specimens with low mileage are now available at almost 120,000 euros. This is why it is important to strike when the prices are still moving in realistic regions. My tip: In addition to the more radical BMW M4 GTS, the M4 CS is also an upcoming classic. The CS special model does not only have the certain something from a vehicle dynamics point of view. Also model-specific details such as the performance increase to 460 hp, the CFRP components, the reduced interior equipment or the light alloy wheels especially developed for the CS make this M4 a very special M4. Think about my words when you surf the Internet in 15 years looking for an M4 CS.

[manuelf]

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

Well, simply put, it didn’t. Same time as the GT4 EXCEPT the fact that given it has 80 more hp and 130 lb ft more torque a much better power to weight ratio.

So you say GT4 is either overpriced or underpowered?

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

Add on the fact that the GT4 was a manual and the CS a dual clutch it is very obviously the GT4 (which is now several years old mind you) is the better car.

Oh. Stupid Porsche does not even offer a good transmission ... and by the way ... the F8x platform stems from 2014...

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

BTW I’d call the GT4 a half GT car.

Ahh. Ok.

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

How about we compare the time to a 991.2S on summer (not cup tires) and oh yea...it’s much faster despite being on lesser tires and having less hp and less torque.

Pirelli PZERO in N specification are not normal summer tires. They are half way semis.
A 911.2S in specification with all performance addons like tested by sport auto is more expensive than an M4 CS. Yep, it is also a bit faster, but you are comparing apples to oranges. Could I take my friends with me for going out to have a drink in the 991? No. It is a pure sportscar, while the CS is a coupe with much more flexibility.

Originally Posted by Motorsportenterprise

No matter what, it just doesn’t stack up well for the M4 CS.
Fact of the matter BMW is well, well, well behind and the M4 GTS and CS have been the proof in the pudding. That is quite apparent.

Well behind... to be honest both are blistering fast. BMW does a 7:35 on the N'Ring with the CS. The 991.2 S will be some seconds faster - that is the same ballpark. So what will be your personal N'Ring time with both? Or are you just moaning about theoretical times, which you will never come near, when driving both? Maybe you would be quicker with the CS than in the 991?
Bye the way: C. Gebhardt was full of praise for the abilities and driving feeling of the CS...

[Motorsportenterprise]

Originally Posted by manuelf

So you say GT4 is either overpriced or underpowered?


Oh. Stupid Porsche does not even offer a good transmission ... and by the way ... the F8x platform stems from 2014...


Ahh. Ok.


Pirelli PZERO in N specification are not normal summer tires. They are half way semis.
A 911.2S in specification with all performance addons like tested by sport auto is more expensive than an M4 CS. Yep, it is also a bit faster, but you are comparing apples to oranges. Could I take my friends with me for going out to have a drink in the 991? No. It is a pure sportscar, while the CS is a coupe with much more flexibility.


Well behind... to be honest both are blistering fast. BMW does a 7:35 on the N'Ring with the CS. The 991.2 S will be some seconds faster - that is the same ballpark. So what will be your personal N'Ring time with both? Or are you just moaning about theoretical times, which you will never come near, when driving both? Maybe you would be quicker with the CS than in the 991?
Bye the way: C. Gebhardt was full of praise for the abilities and driving feeling of the CS...

Ok first of all, the GT4 stems from a platform from 2012. Also Porsche transmissions whether manual or PDK are better than BMW.
Also, the PZero on the 991.2S are normal summer tires, not Cup, so there you are mistaken. They are not like the Pilot Sport Cup 2s the CS has so on the same tires the 991.2S is much faster given even as it sits, was 8 seconds faster than the CS despite having lower hp and lower torque. With the same tires it would be likely 14-15 seconds faster on the Ring. And if you look at the Hockenheim time the 991.2S is 1:09.6 vs 1:11 for the CS. The 911 GTS on the same tires as the CS ran 7:22 btw.
The 911 is a GT car. If you look at the overall score and the write ups they tell you all you need to know.

Btw N spec is just a Porsche spec tire, same as how BmW has * spec for their specified tires.

Here are the PZero the 991.2S ran and did 7:34 on

https://m.tirerack.com/tires/tires.j...+Axle+Steering

Here are the tires the M4 CS ran on

https://m.tirerack.com/tires/tires.j...S&autoModClar=

One is a stree summer and the other a track and competition tire.

Anyone with equal skill will be faster in the 911 as it’s an easier car to drive and much higher limits.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by manuelf

Oh. Stupid Porsche does not even offer a good transmission ... and by the way ... the F8x platform stems from 2014...

Actually from 2012, that's when the F30 was released

[MyFragileHalogen]

Originally Posted by stevehifi

slap some r compounds and a simple tune on any regular m4/m3 and you'll get the same time or better.

This car is another $100k marketing trick.

+1

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by stevehifi

slap some r compounds and a simple tune on any regular m4/m3 and you'll get the same time or better.

This car is another $100k marketing trick.

This.