Audi RS3

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by DS_BMW

340 does not feel special at all. suspension is way to soft. Also standard BMWs plumet in value like crazy.

I would say any BMW that comes with runflats from the factory doesn't feel special... the RFT's with their shitty soft designed suspension were the first step in BMW's downfall

[blschaefer1]

Except for wheels, I think the S3/RS3 looks good. Understated but proportionally correct, not cartoonishly aggressively styled. Build quality is high. Personal preference.

The stock wheels on the RS3 are no bueno, however.

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda

Now your talking. The F Type is one sweet ride. Obviously in a different category from the RS3 but still nice none the less.

Audi's as you said are boring at least to me. I never think God I really want that Audi. These thoughts just don't cross my mind.

Porsche, BMW, Jag, even the Alfa (reliability aside) have all given me that want factor at one time or another. I even stopped down at a Fiat dealer to look at the QV not that long ago. Wife HATES the front grill with a passion so it's a no go.

You haven't got to the inside and driving aspect of the Alfa either.

Not including the QV, I disliked the driving part. The car gives you mixed messages, and almost next to no-feedback on the brakes scares me. Infotainment is almost as bad as a Jaguar, interior design is all over the place and of course 2017/2018 Alfa Romeo owners are beta testers for the brand and I don't expect it to get any better.

[aerostar]

Okay so update:

I went and took a look at the car....

They only had a TTRS and a S3 on the lot.

The TTRS felt super cramped compared even to my 235i. It's a *true* sports coupe. I opened the trunk and it's laughably small even with the seats folded down.

The S3's interior was not what I was expecting. The seats were manual and the interior plastic felt even cheaper than the 2 series. The car was also a lot smaller than I expected....

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by aerostar

Okay so update:

I went and took a look at the car....

They only had a TTRS and a S3 on the lot.

The TTRS felt super cramped compared even to my 235i. It's a *true* sports coupe. I opened the trunk and it's laughably small even with the seats folded down.

The S3's interior was not what I was expecting. The seats were manual and the interior plastic felt even cheaper than the 2 series. The car was also a lot smaller than I expected....

I mentioned in a thread I posted after getting behind of a 18' S3 Prestige that people blow Audi interior quality way above what you expect. I would personally say, a A5 and above interior wise is probably better but not by such an extent you can say, "Ohh woooww!" kind of reaction. People center their perspective on Audi interiors based on the Virtual Cockpit because that is all they generally speak about. Everything else is pretty regular if you really look at it. It isn't better by a huge margin. I honestly don't understand why Audi keeps getting this perception that their interior is just heads above their competition when it isn't.

S3 is a good car but either I expected too much of Audi, or I just am not really impressed after looking at my options.

Edit: And let me remind you again. Bang & Olufsen is standard on S3 Prestige but it is not standard on a the highest trim the RS3. A3 - RS3 also doesn't come with virtual cockpit either so you have to option that as well.

[KevinM]

For me, one big reason: no MT. If I didn't care about that I would be interested.

[Jojipoji]

I just assumed from that video that you were saying a rs3 is as fast as a fbo e85 gtr and my point is actually that fbo gtr is pretty slow comparatively to most. The record for a fbo gtr with tires on track is 9.7@142 with a DA about the same as the APR and a mph about 15 miles faster.

http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/topic/...ph-new-record/

With that said the rs3 is a performance bargain and its extremely impressive and would make a great daily driver. I wish it came in manual though.

Originally Posted by quattr0

Lol i never meant to compare apple to apple so I apologize if you perceive I was.

The point is how fast the 5-cylinder is for the $. We ALL know how fast the GT-R could be.

[stevehifi]

The RS3 is a neat little package, but terribly cramped inside with the quality of a VW.
and it weighs almost 3600lbs!.. it's a pig.

not to mention having all that weight in the front (engine, transmission, transaxle).. it will push coming into the corner and coming out of the corner.. I've driven a bunch of RS4s and S4s.. they all handle the same... shitty. I'm sure this car is no different.

You really want to pay $60k+tax (laughing) for a car like this just to go fast in a straight line.. ?

[HockeyDad]

Originally Posted by stevehifi

The RS3 is a neat little package, but terribly cramped inside with the quality of a VW.
and it weighs almost 3600lbs!.. it's a pig.

not to mention having all that weight in the front (engine, transmission, transaxle).. it will push coming into the corner and coming out of the corner.. I've driven a bunch of RS4s and S4s.. they all handle the same... shitty. I'm sure this car is no different.

You really want to pay $60k+tax (laughing) for a car like this just to go fast in a straight line.. ?

Okay, I'll add my $.02...

Just picked up my 2018 RS 3 last Monday. For reference, my previous DD was a 2015 M3 that I leased for 36 months. That lease ended last month. Turned the car back in. I also currently own 2 E92s, a 335i and 328 xDrive. Plan to keep both of those for quite some time. So, I am neither an Audi or BMW fanboy.

I chuckle at the amount of BMW bias in this thread. Of course, we are on a BMW enthusiast website so that's to be expected. While I only have 400 or so miles on my RS 3, I put 50K on my M3. Loved every minute of driving that car, BTW. But I like trying out different vehicles and had leased two Audis prior to the RS 3.

The MAGIC of the RS 3 is that engine. Most know the legendary nature/history of Audi's inline 5. THAT'S the reason for this car. It sounds glorious and, I'm sorry, compared to the M3, a much better aural experience. Stock for stock it just sounds better.

The second positive is TRACTION, baby! I don't track my cars so hooning on public roads will be as wild as I get, and I just couldn't put the power down in my M3 without TC intervening. Never had the balls to turn it completely off on public streets. This RS 3 just grips and grips.

Is it small? Yes. Is it expensive? Yes again. But, small and expensive is not an exclusive club, as we all know. Is the interior inferior to the F80/F82? Hmmm, debatable. I went with the RS Design package, which upgrades some of the trim to alcantara and includes the red stitching. My M3 had full leather, so no, I don't have a leather dash on my RS 3. But in terms of materials quality, from everything to the seat leather, carpeting, floor mats, etc. I'd say it's close.

Is it a front-heavy pig? Again, not sure about that. With it's short wheelbase, Quattro, and lighter engine I don't feel that. Would it manifest itself on the track? Oh, I'm sure it would, but as I said, I don't track my cars, so not a concern to me. I'm perfectly fine with the way the car handles on public streets. If I tracked my cars I would have chosen another F80/82 or an M2, but I don't, so it's not an issue for me. If tracking is in the cards and one wants an Audi I'd suggest the TT RS, but it is a very small car, and about $8-10K more than the RS 3.

I think we're damn lucky that AoA has decided to start bringing more RS models to the US and I feel fortunate to be able to own an RS 3. It's about time that we in the states got to taste what our European bretheren have had access to for years. And, it doesn't hurt that this car is damn fast out of the box, like 0-60 in 3.5, 3.6, etc. I would have preferred a manual, but unfortunately we don't get that choice. Enjoy those MTs while you can - I'm afraid they are going to become more and more rare.

I've misplaced my flame suit so go easy on me, but the RS 3 is a damn nice "little" car!

[JoeFromPA]

Originally Posted by HockeyDad

Okay, I'll add my $.02...

Just picked up my 2018 RS 3 last Monday. For reference, my previous DD was a 2015 M3 that I leased for 36 months. That lease ended last month. Turned the car back in. I also currently own 2 E92s, a 335i and 328 xDrive. Plan to keep both of those for quite some time. So, I am neither an Audi or BMW fanboy.

I chuckle at the amount of BMW bias in this thread. Of course, we are on a BMW enthusiast website so that's to be expected. While I only have 400 or so miles on my RS 3, I put 50K on my M3. Loved every minute of driving that car, BTW. But I like trying out different vehicles and had leased two Audis prior to the RS 3.

The MAGIC of the RS 3 is that engine. Most know the legendary nature/history of Audi's inline 5. THAT'S the reason for this car. It sounds glorious and, I'm sorry, compared to the M3, a much better aural experience. Stock for stock it just sounds better.

The second positive is TRACTION, baby! I don't track my cars so hooning on public roads will be as wild as I get, and I just couldn't put the power down in my M3 without TC intervening. Never had the balls to turn it completely off on public streets. This RS 3 just grips and grips.

Is it small? Yes. Is it expensive? Yes again. But, small and expensive is not an exclusive club, as we all know. Is the interior inferior to the F80/F82? Hmmm, debatable. I went with the RS Design package, which upgrades some of the trim to alcantara and includes the red stitching. My M3 had full leather, so no, I don't have a leather dash on my RS 3. But in terms of materials quality, from everything to the seat leather, carpeting, floor mats, etc. I'd say it's close.

Is it a front-heavy pig? Again, not sure about that. With it's short wheelbase, Quattro, and lighter engine I don't feel that. Would it manifest itself on the track? Oh, I'm sure it would, but as I said, I don't track my cars, so not a concern to me. I'm perfectly fine with the way the car handles on public streets. If I tracked my cars I would have chosen another F80/82 or an M2, but I don't, so it's not an issue for me. If tracking is in the cards and one wants an Audi I'd suggest the TT RS, but it is a very small car, and about $8-10K more than the RS 3.

I think we're damn lucky that AoA has decided to start bringing more RS models to the US and I feel fortunate to be able to own an RS 3. It's about time that we in the states got to taste what our European bretheren have had access to for years. And, it doesn't hurt that this car is damn fast out of the box, like 0-60 in 3.5, 3.6, etc. I would have preferred a manual, but unfortunately we don't get that choice. Enjoy those MTs while you can - I'm afraid they are going to become more and more rare.

I've misplaced my flame suit so go easy on me, but the RS 3 is a damn nice "little" car!

Nice review and thank you.

I own and DD a '15 m3 with 38k miles on it. The interior is, to me, basic. Not bad, not good. I deliberately did not get the full leather experience, which would improve it. And I got carbonstructure, which I've never once regretted.

The traction issues are real. 7+ months a year I'm driving on broken up roads or uneven surfaces at or below 60 degrees fahrenheit. You're in fairyland if you think the f8x can put down WOT power in gears 1-2 (and sometimes 3) in these conditions - damn near 60% of the year. I use M-Mode and get regular DSC intervention, for which I'm thankful by the way.

So if I take the interior as a wash and I get much better traction with the rs3, what am I sacrificing again?

Ah yes:
- Size of the vehicle (which is a negative for me, though a positive for some)
- "Understeer"

I haven't driven an rs3, but the incredible belief in understeer in these applications is the equivalent of people calling 911s pendulum deathtraps even after the 993. Yeah there's still some element of that due to weight allocation, but it's been vastly minimized compared to previous iterations/generations through good engineering. Now, again, I haven't driven the rs3 so this is commentary purely based upon every single review I've read.

I'm not sold on the rs3 and frankly I'm inclined to keep my m3 and go with a 911 as my next car once the kids are a tad older.

[blschaefer1]

Originally Posted by JoeFromPA

I haven't driven an rs3, but the incredible belief in understeer in these applications is the equivalent of people calling 911s pendulum deathtraps even after the 993. Yeah there's still some element of that due to weight allocation, but it's been vastly minimized compared to previous iterations/generations through good engineering.

Agree 100% on this. I also have not driven an RS3, but we do have a '17 S3 in the garage. Understeer is a complete non-issue in the car, particularly on public roads. In fact, I find handling more predicable and accurate than the M4. Plus there is more traction on corner exits on rough roads that would cause the TC on the M4 to intervene. With wider front tires as stock, I'm sure the RS3 is even better in this regard.

[nittany]

tracking the RS3 looks fun with the right mods.

[blschaefer1]

Originally Posted by nittany

tracking the RS3 looks fun with the right mods.

Wow. That thing hauls. And sounds great.

[JoeFromPA]

Wow that thing is hauling. Hitting 150mph on the straights - but also the timing from 100-150 - shows the power this thing is putting down.

Obviously driver skill and all that, but it wasn't having a hard time with under-steer in that video when it was passing everyone

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by blschaefer1

Agree 100% on this. I also have not driven an RS3, but we do have a '17 S3 in the garage. Understeer is a complete non-issue in the car, particularly on public roads. In fact, I find handling more predicable and accurate than the M4. Plus there is more traction on corner exits on rough roads that would cause the TC on the M4 to intervene. With wider front tires as stock, I'm sure the RS3 is even better in this regard.

fwiw, i was able to get an s3 to plow at 30 mph on the test drive... my older 135i would have taken that turn like a champ

[blschaefer1]

Originally Posted by ASAP

fwiw, i was able to get an s3 to plow at 30 mph on the test drive... my older 135i would have taken that turn like a champ

I owned a 135i back in 2011. We have polar opposite opinions on this one. That 135i was the worst handling BMW I have ever owned. Very unsorted chassis, major understeer, a well known issue with that model. Front sway bars looked like spaghetti noodles. And runflats only made it worse.

What year was the S3 you test drove? Did it have adaptive dampers? I don't have data points on older models, but I can tell you understeer is a non-issue with ours when set in Dynamic mode.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by blschaefer1

I owned a 135i back in 2012. We have polar opposite opinions on this one. That 135i was the worst handling BMW I have ever owned. Very unsorted chassis. And runflats only made it worse.

What year was the S3 you test drove?

I 300% agree with you... it is the worst handling BMW ever made... the short chassis when combined with non run flats makes the car a god damn trampoline in the rear w the suspension play... however; I had enough mods on it to allow it turn rather quick (especially with wide 235 front PSS tires) and one thing it would never do was understeer unless you were going very fast.

2016 S3 was what I drove.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by blschaefer1

Agree 100% on this. I also have not driven an RS3, but we do have a '17 S3 in the garage. Understeer is a complete non-issue in the car, particularly on public roads. In fact, I find handling more predicable and accurate than the M4. Plus there is more traction on corner exits on rough roads that would cause the TC on the M4 to intervene. With wider front tires as stock, I'm sure the RS3 is even better in this regard.

There was a former f8x owner here with an s3 and tracked his cars- s3 had bad understeer and tires were shredded. He got rid of it, got a Camaro SS as well, forgot his name.

I haven't driven a modern RS/S model since I had mine over a decade ago. with +57% of the weight in front of the car, and the engine mounted in front of the front wheels caused the entire experience to suck. I pushed mine and I had 2 sets of Yoko's with tread separation only on the fronts from normal street driving. Anything above 8/10's and the understeer is bad and fronts started to plow, similar to my x5m unfortunately, that's even with the trick diff.

Look at track times for the TTRS, it is not performing on par with the engine numbers, the f8x beating it on some tracks already. There are no track times yet on the RS3 but I'd imagine it is similar. Great little car for the road, no doubt, not a seat of the pants handler though. Here is a fair assessment from drivetribe:

I guess I am lucky I live in sunny southern CA, I have 295's rears and very little traction issues.

[blschaefer1]

Yep, comments here from Car and Driver. Understeer not apparent on street but raises its head on the track. I don’t track so not a concern for me.

https://blog.caranddriver.com/fives-...tt-rs-and-rs3/

[doberzus]

If you want a track car, forget the RS3/TTRS or even F8x for that matter. Just buy an M2 or 718 Cayman/S, you’ll have the better tool for the job.

If you want a car that 99% of the time is faster on road, in “real-world” situations, with actual traction? The RS3/TTRS is your ticket.

Nurburgring times, 1/4 mile times, and other track times are cool to bring up, but I could care less. After owning a 707hp Hellcat and two F80s(6MT/DCT+ZCP) I am truly done with overpowered RWD cars. Sad part is the “fun” RWD, performance cars are some of the best looking and most visceral.... that wears off quite quickly when all you’re doing is spinning at the sight of uneven, cold, wet, debris filled roads we experience on a daily basis.

On a side note, cars are becoming larger and larger. All the people complaining about the “small-size” of the RS3/TTRS. That is what drew me to the car. The F80 is bigger than the old E60 M5, and the new 5 series is bigger than the older gen 7 series.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by doberzus

If you want a track car, forget the RS3/TTRS or even F8x for that matter. Just buy an M2 or 718 Cayman/S, you’ll have the better tool for the job.

If you want a car that 99% of the time is faster on road, in “real-world” situations, with actual traction? The RS3/TTRS is your ticket.

Nurburgring times, 1/4 mile times, and other track times are cool to bring up, but I could care less. After owning a 707hp Hellcat and two F80s(6MT/DCT+ZCP) I am truly done with overpowered RWD cars. Sad part is the “fun” RWD, performance cars are some of the best looking and most visceral.... that wears off quite quickly when all you’re doing is spinning at the sight of uneven, cold, wet, debris filled roads we experience on a daily basis.

On a side note, cars are becoming larger and larger. All the people complaining about the “small-size” of the RS3/TTRS. That is what drew me to the car. The F80 is bigger than the old E60 M5, and the new 5 series is bigger than the older gen 7 series.

Regarding ever increasing size, the RS3 is much closer in size to our B7 S4 than the B9 S4 is. For example the RS3's wheelbase is within an inch of the B7 while the B9's wheelbase is 7 inches longer than the B7. So from our point of view, the RS3 ain't that small.

[doberzus]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Regarding ever increasing size, the RS3 is much closer in size to our B7 S4 than the B9 S4 is. For example the RS3's wheelbase is within an inch of the B7 while the B9's wheelbase is 7 inches longer than the B7.

That is a good thing, IMO. I really loved the B7 RS4 with the 420HP V8 and 6MT. It felt special and sounded incredible.

Yeah, it has bad carbon build-up issues that require quite a bit of maintenance and upkeep... beautiful car though.