F80 M3 and the Base Cayman (apples and oranges, I know)

[DDR MFS]

Originally Posted by 1love

+1 Get the S and don't look back. Get the M3 when you have a kid in 3 years.

+1 I would buy the 981 B/S and then sell it and roll into a M3 lease if the time rolls around. We travel a fair amount for work so I am not sure if this will be in the next few years or beyond. Have a road trip ahead for the holidays, hence car and family planning (not sure which one is more important ) will definitely come up.

Thanks again either way.

Hit up the dealer over e-mail and he is keeping an eye out for a used S in stick. Did a query of CPO 981 S cars and there are a fair amount.

Still not completely sold but moving in that direction.

[bsiciliano]

This hits home. Wife and I have a base Cayman and an E93 M3. I love the M, it's my baby, and I love the roar of the engine but honestly, the Cayman is the most fun car I've driven. It is glued to the road and so nimble.

I keep telling people, that it's is the least expensive car Porsche makes and is unbelievable. The wife loves it too. I steal it from her whenever I can.

My advice, find a favorable lease on a left over 2015. I've seen them for under $500/mo.

Eventually we will have kids and the Cayman will turn into a macan gts, and the E93 will become an F80, but for now I'm enjoying every minute of the Cayman and you should too!

[Drizz]

Originally Posted by Drizz

I'm actually on the fence with this very decision. Had my M3 for 15 months now and about the pull the trigger on a Cayman S. I keep going back and forth in my head cause the M is a fantastic car, but so is the Cayman S.. Actually planned on possibly doing a deal on a CS tomorrow but we'll see how I feel about it when I wake up.

Well I just pulled the trigger last night on a Cayman S. Had the M3 for 15 months and loved it, but I tend to move on after 1-2 years to a new car. I was able to to get a great deal on my M (actually didn't take any hit on it, which is surprising b/c I didn't put anything down on it when I got it) and got a fantastic deal on the Cayman S. Rather than pay 5% under sticker on a new one I found a 2015 w/ just 2,100 miles on it...literally looks BRAND NEW, and got 20% off original sticker. It doesn't have the same "violent" acceleration of the M, but it's a lot of fun. I thought my M3 was glued to the road but the P car REALLY feels glued. I'm looking forward to 1-2 years w/ this before I move on to something else exciting!

[auf Deutsch]

Originally Posted by bsiciliano

My advice, find a favorable lease on a left over 2015. I've seen them for under $500/mo.

Oh, I gotta hear more on this! Feel free to pm me any sort of details.

[TheFlyingMouse]

Originally Posted by Drizz

Well I just pulled the trigger last night on a Cayman S. Had the M3 for 15 months and loved it, but I tend to move on after 1-2 years to a new car. I was able to to get a great deal on my M (actually didn't take any hit on it, which is surprising b/c I didn't put anything down on it when I got it) and got a fantastic deal on the Cayman S. Rather than pay 5% under sticker on a new one I found a 2015 w/ just 2,100 miles on it...literally looks BRAND NEW, and got 20% off original sticker. It doesn't have the same "violent" acceleration of the M, but it's a lot of fun. I thought my M3 was glued to the road but the P car REALLY feels glued. I'm looking forward to 1-2 years w/ this before I move on to something else exciting!

What do you mean you didn't get hurt on the M? How much did you lose vs original cost? I'm looking at around a 10k loss on mine with the sales tax.

[bsiciliano]

Originally Posted by auf Deutsch

Oh, I gotta hear more on this! Feel free to pm me any sort of details.

I live in Los Angeles. Walters Porsche always has one for under $500. It's usually a bit of a stripper. I've even seen it for less.

[omegaSMP300]

Originally Posted by DDR MFS

+1 I would buy the 981 B/S and then sell it and roll into a M3 lease if the time rolls around. We travel a fair amount for work so I am not sure if this will be in the next few years or beyond. Have a road trip ahead for the holidays, hence car and family planning (not sure which one is more important ) will definitely come up.

Thanks again either way.

Hit up the dealer over e-mail and he is keeping an eye out for a used S in stick. Did a query of CPO 981 S cars and there are a fair amount.

Still not completely sold but moving in that direction.

981 S all the way. I really really liked my Boxster S. With the soft top it was maybe too loud to be a DD (it was more of a weekender car anyways) but you won't have this issue with the Cayman. I always go used and you can find some tremendous deals. For the 981 S I typically look for an original MSRP of 84k+ it tends to have all the options you could ever want/need (my Boxster was originally 90k and I added PSE).

The performance options are a must have in my opinion (Sport Chrono etc). The center stack will have 4 buttons on the left and 3 on the right if it is fully optioned (sport exhaust can always be retrofitted). Porsche Torque Vectoring is not standard on the 981 but worth keeping an eye out for.

The shapes of the seats do vary. 14 way is plenty comfortable for me and have the full leather wrap (18 way have the silver shell backing which I personally like but isn't quite as luxurious looking).

My friend was considering one and when I helped look I did come across a lot of manuals. Good luck in your search!

[Drizz]

Originally Posted by TheFlyingMouse

What do you mean you didn't get hurt on the M? How much did you lose vs original cost? I'm looking at around a 10k loss on mine with the sales tax.

Here's how I looked at it. My M3 had a $67K sticker, and I paid $65K (I was part of first F80 allocation so I barely got a discount). I rolled all taxes and feed into my loan, so I paid nothing out of pocket. Wound up with approx $70K loan. Oh, I did a PenFed Payment Saver loan as well with the balloon at the end to keep payments low, as I knew I would get rid of the car way before 60 months was up anyway. I've been paying just 790/month for the last 15 months I've had the car. I just got the dealership where I bought the Cayman S to completely pay off my M loan, so to me that's no hit. Agreed?

And, it's not like the dealer made it up on the backend by charging me more for the P car as I'd been shopping around and the one I bought was already a good deal, to which I was able to get some additional money off.

[Drizz]

Originally Posted by bsiciliano

I live in Los Angeles. Walters Porsche always has one for under $500. It's usually a bit of a stripper. I've even seen it for less.

I'm in OC and see the Walters Porsche deals as well. They're usually $599/month plus tax on the base Cayman if I'm not mistaken and need $5-7K down, and then are limited to sometimes as little as 5K miles/year. I know because I've been in the market for the Cayman and actually checked them out. Only writing this to help the other guy who was interested in those low cost leases you mentioned. I'll say to that guy as well the good thing about Walters is that they usually have lightly optioned cars on their lots as well, whereas too many dealers have their P cars so heavily optioned on the lots their Caymans can run 90K.

[TheFlyingMouse]

Originally Posted by Drizz

Here's how I looked at it. My M3 had a $67K sticker, and I paid $65K (I was part of first F80 allocation so I barely got a discount). I rolled all taxes and feed into my loan, so I paid nothing out of pocket. Wound up with approx $70K loan. Oh, I did a PenFed Payment Saver loan as well with the balloon at the end to keep payments low, as I knew I would get rid of the car way before 60 months was up anyway. I've been paying just 790/month for the last 15 months I've had the car. I just got the dealership where I bought the Cayman S to completely pay off my M loan, so to me that's no hit. Agreed?

And, it's not like the dealer made it up on the backend by charging me more for the P car as I'd been shopping around and the one I bought was already a good deal, to which I was able to get some additional money off.

Ah ok. The difference is you've actually gotten to drive your M for 15 months so you feel like you've gotten your money's worth. I've had mine a few weeks and the offer I have is 10-12k less than what I paid after tax.

[Drizz]

Originally Posted by TheFlyingMouse

Ah ok. The difference is you've actually gotten to drive your M for 15 months so you feel like you've gotten your money's worth. I've had mine a few weeks and the offer I have is 10-12k less than what I paid after tax.

Ouch. Dude... A few weeks!?! Keep the M for a while and enjoy it. It's a fantastic car in every aspect. I loved mine but there's something wrong with me and I have a need to change out cars all the time. Thankfully I have an understanding wife.

[DDR MFS]

So been shopping around and have come up with the following two builds. Going to go test drive another S vs Base comparison and make the decision from there. I am optioning for DD, road carving, auto-Xing and the occasional track event. Difference between both is roughly 3K with the Base being much more heavily optioned and the S being slightly above where I want to be.

Honestly, the Base is looking more attractive but I need to do a another test drive of both and, just make a goddamn decision after.

Any thoughts?

New Cayman Build S (dropped the blue paint and went black, dropped alcantara, and added PTV)

Also, I do not smoke but the smoking package adds an additional power outlet and a "cover" that hides what is otherwise an awkward looking "storage... hole?" in the center console.

Cayman S

Transmission: 6-Speed Manual (480)
Wheels: 8j X 19" Fr & 9.5j X 19" Rr Cayman S Alloy (406)
Black Standard Paint (-PAINT)
Sport Suspension (Lowered 20mm) (X73)
2-Way Electric Sport Seats Plus (P04)
Porsche Torque Vectoring (Ptv) (220)
Smoking Package (583)
Deletion Of Model Designation (498)
Black (A1)
Convenience Package (P9A)
Luxor Beige, Partial Leather Seat Trim (UG)
Sportdesign Steering Wheel (840)


Revised Base Build (dropped same "extras" but added PTV)

Transmission: 6-Speed Manual (480)
Wheels: 8j X 18" Fr & 9j X 18" Rr Cayman Alloy (396)
Standard Paint (-PAINT)
Dark Blue Metallic (N4)
Luxor Beige, Partial Leather Seat Trim (UG)
Sport Suspension (Lowered 20mm) (X73)
Sports Exhaust System w/Sports Tailpipe (XLF)
Bi-Xenon-Headlights w/Pdls (603)
Porsche Torque Vectoring (Ptv) (220)
Premium Package w/Sport Seats (P9B)
Convenience Package (P9A)
14-Way Electric Sport Seats w/Memory Package (P06)
SiriusXM Sat Radio Receiver (686)
Smoking Package (583)
Deletion Of Model Designation (498)

[TheFlyingMouse]

Consider skipping the PSE and getting a good aftermarket. I think the Borla sounds way better and is cheaper. PSE is nice if you need quiet mode, but it's a sports car yeah? I'd like more noise on my daily drive inside the cabin than the M3 provides.

Add Bose sound (not with the Nav package) if you like tunes. It's as good or better than our HK from what I've heard from it.

[Warranty P]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

I took a pass on 981 S PDK

Too slow in a straight line for the $

This exactly. I took a Cayman GTS for half a day and it felt slow. Nice car but you give up too much at that price point. With Cayman it is either GT4 or no go.

[DDR MFS]

Finalized my builds. Going to test drive, again, both tomorrow and make the decision. The Cayman S build is more auto-X and track oriented with a few DD comforts (had to keep within budget) and the Base is much more optioned. I will do an aftermarket exhaust on S at some point, but the both will remain stock for my duration of ownership.

Cayman S

Transmission: 6-Speed Manual (480)
Wheels: 8j X 19" Fr & 9.5j X 19" Rr Cayman S Alloy (406)
Standard Paint (-PAINT)
Smoking Package (583)
Deletion Of Model Designation (498)
Convenience Package (P9A)
Sport Suspension (Lowered 20mm) (X73)
2-Way Electric Sport Seats Plus (P04)
Black (A1)
Black, Partial Leather Seat Trim (AG) (Might go with tan but the windscreen glare is supposed to be bad)
Porsche Torque Vectoring (Ptv) (220)
Sportdesign Steering Wheel (840)

Base build:

Transmission: 6-Speed Manual (480)
Wheels: 8j X 18" Fr & 9j X 18" Rr Cayman Alloy (396)
Standard Paint (-PAINT)
Dark Blue Metallic (N4)
Luxor Beige, Partial Leather Seat Trim (UG)
Sport Suspension (Lowered 20mm) (X73)
Sports Exhaust System w/Sports Tailpipe (XLF)
Bi-Xenon-Headlights w/Pdls (603)
Porsche Torque Vectoring (Ptv) (220)
Premium Package w/Sport Seats (P9B)
14-Way Electric Sport Seats w/Memory Package (P06)
SiriusXM Sat Radio Receiver (686)
Smoking Package (583)
Deletion Of Model Designation (498)
Sportdesign Steering Wheel (840)

[Damasconian]

Sorry to muddle the waters but if there is any car I look at with slight regret of not buying its the Cayman. Especially the GTS and GT4.

This is a really tough decision but one so many people would like to have. The good news is you cant make the wrong choice.

[zer0cool]

Humm why not buy a used Cayman S instead of a new car? You can find well equipped used Cayman S's for the same price as a new Cayman.

However know this, the cost of ownership of a Cayman (new or used) vs a M3, if you intend to use either car as your DD are VASTLY different. This is true unless you plan to keep either car for many years and drive well over 100k miles (at that point all cars are worth little so there will be very little diff).

If on the other hand, you intend to own only for a few years... I think using a Cayman as a DD and putting 12+k miles on it annually means the car will be pretty much worthless after just a few years... say after 4 years and 50k miles, the M3 may still sell pretty well (say high 30s or even more) while I am not sure how you would sell a Cayman with 50k miles... when almost all 4 year-old Caymans on dealer lots will have less than 20k miles...

Let's just say the depreciation on the M3 is 30k, then really your 50k mile Cayman will depreciate by AT LEAST 10k more than that. Add in maintenance cost etc, pretty much the cost of ownership of that Cayman will be 50+% more than the M3.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Warranty P

This exactly. I took a Cayman GTS for half a day and it felt slow. Nice car but you give up too much at that price point. With Cayman it is either GT4 or no go.

Even then, you have to really want a p-car

My older brother just got his GT4 and one of his first texts to me was that he thought my stock F80 pulled harder, and his E63S wagon definitely will outrun it in a straight line

I get it, straight line speed is not everything, feel/sound/experience/feeling of being special all matters too, but I personally would struggle with paying $$$$ for a GT4 and getting smoked on the highway by a C6 Z06 that is now mid $30k, or a loaded up E-class station wagon with 2 child seats in the back and massaging driver seat

[csbear]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Even then, you have to really want a p-car

My older brother just got his GT4 and one of his first texts to me was that he thought my stock F80 pulled harder, and his E63S wagon definitely will outrun it in a straight line

I get it, straight line speed is not everything, feel/sound/experience/feeling of being special all matters too, but I personally would struggle with paying $$$$ for a GT4 and getting smoked on the highway by a C6 Z06 that is now mid $30k, or a loaded up E-class station wagon with 2 child seats in the back and massaging driver seat

F80 or Z06 smoking a GT4... Doesn't look like it to me

1 Nissan GT-R Nismo (R35) Randy Pobst 1:19.07 600 / 1720
2 Nissan GT-R (R35 530 PS) Randy Pobst 1:20.25 530 / 1736
3 Corvette Z06 Z07 Package Randy Pobst 1:20.43 512 / 1394
4 Porsche Cayman GT4 (981) Randy Pobst 1:21.74 385 / 1340
5 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 1:21.90 647 / 1530
6 Audi R8 V10 5.2 FSI Plus 1:21.95 550 / 1570
7 Ferrari 458 Italia 1:22.30 570 / 1485
8 Jaguar XKR-S GT Randy Pobst 1:22.53 550 / -
9 Porsche Panamera Turbo 1:22.68 520 / -
10 Chevrolet Camaro 1LE Randy Pobst 1:22.70 432 / 1751
11 SRT Viper 1:23.00 649 / 1520
12 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 Randy Pobst 1:23.48 558 / 1712
13 BMW M4 randy pobst 1:23.73 431 / 1497
14 Lexus RC F randy pobst 1:24.05 477 / 1795
15 Corvette Z06 Z07 Package 1:24.28 512 / 1394
16 Mustang GT Performance Pack Randy Pobst 1:24.29 426 / 1650
17 Audi RS7 Sportback 1:24.30 560 / 1895
18 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 1:24.55 461 / 1577
19 CLS 63 AMG S-Model 1:24.70 585 / 1870
20 Aston Martin V12 Vantage S Randy Pobst 1:24.85 573 / 1665

Now put a PDK in the GT4, and see what Randy Pobst does with it at Willow...

Kidding aside, the M3/M4 and Z06 pull harder... no argument there.

But that's OK, I am loving the GT4. Some of the stuff this car can do on turns (which is A LOT more fun than going fast in a straight line) is simply amazing. Driving fast in a straight line on the streets never gave me white knuckles like I get when carving through a sharp turn.

Different strokes... The F8X, Z06, and GT4 are all great cars and all have their individual admirers. Hope your brother enjoys his new car as he breaks-in the miles!

[EfEightyM3]

Originally Posted by csbear

F80 or Z06 smoking a GT4... Doesn't look like it to me

1 Nissan GT-R Nismo (R35) Randy Pobst 1:19.07 600 / 1720
2 Nissan GT-R (R35 530 PS) Randy Pobst 1:20.25 530 / 1736
3 Corvette Z06 Z07 Package Randy Pobst 1:20.43 512 / 1394
4 Porsche Cayman GT4 (981) Randy Pobst 1:21.74 385 / 1340
5 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 1:21.90 647 / 1530
6 Audi R8 V10 5.2 FSI Plus 1:21.95 550 / 1570
7 Ferrari 458 Italia 1:22.30 570 / 1485
8 Jaguar XKR-S GT Randy Pobst 1:22.53 550 / -
9 Porsche Panamera Turbo 1:22.68 520 / -
10 Chevrolet Camaro 1LE Randy Pobst 1:22.70 432 / 1751
11 SRT Viper 1:23.00 649 / 1520
12 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 Randy Pobst 1:23.48 558 / 1712
13 BMW M4 randy pobst 1:23.73 431 / 1497
14 Lexus RC F randy pobst 1:24.05 477 / 1795
15 Corvette Z06 Z07 Package 1:24.28 512 / 1394
16 Mustang GT Performance Pack Randy Pobst 1:24.29 426 / 1650
17 Audi RS7 Sportback 1:24.30 560 / 1895
18 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 1:24.55 461 / 1577
19 CLS 63 AMG S-Model 1:24.70 585 / 1870
20 Aston Martin V12 Vantage S Randy Pobst 1:24.85 573 / 1665

Now put a PDK in the GT4, and see what Randy Pobst does with it at Willow...

Kidding aside, the M3/M4 and Z06 pull harder... no argument there.

But that's OK, I am loving the GT4. Some of the stuff this car can do on turns (which is A LOT more fun than going fast in a straight line) is simply amazing. Driving fast in a straight line on the streets never gave me white knuckles like I get when carving through a sharp turn.

Different strokes... The F8X, Z06, and GT4 are all great cars and all have their individual admirers. Hope your brother enjoys his new car as he breaks-in the miles!

M3 is NOT at all coming anywhere close to a GT4. And if it had PDk it would be an even bigger loss for the m3/4.
GT4 just won EVO car of the year whereas the m3 was only said to be the biggest disappointment in last years car of the year.
Anyone can make a fast car that pulls hard with turbos and a lot of boost. Nothing special there. Make a car handle like a gt4 or 911 isn't isn't so easy. Just look at the fact that a 991.2S with street tires is almost as fast as an m4 GTS which in reality has close to 200 more hp and is on cup tires.

[adc]

Originally Posted by EfEightyM3

Make a car handle like a gt4 or 911 isn't isn't so easy. Just look at the fact that a 991.2S with street tires is almost as fast as an m4 GTS which in reality has close to 200 more hp and is on cup tires.

That's if you believe the power claims on the 991.2 cars. I have a feeling that Porsche is playing the same game that BMW did with the M4 - mostly so they don't embarrass GT3 owners and don't kill the resale values.

Folks, don't magazine race please, it makes no sense. If you take your GT4 to the track there is every chance you will get your ass handed to you by some guy in an old cobbled together E46 or any other "lesser" car.

In daily driving, there is also a good chance you'll get whipped by someone in a C63 or M4 DCT. So what. You still have an amazing car...

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by csbear

Different strokes... The F8X, Z06, and GT4 are all great cars and all have their individual admirers. Hope your brother enjoys his new car as he breaks-in the miles!

Yes he is loving it and it is definitely a keeper, since he is a huge porsche fan and does DEs on a reasonably frequent basis. He has also done a DE in f80 (went to pcd with me) and street miles (my car was broken in from euro delivery so we were hammering on it in sc)

I agree btw cgt4 is a great car, and also wanted to point out in the interest of fair balance that there is always a trade off/ drawback with any car, with straight line acceleration and (poor) ease of exiting the LWB two such things for the Cgt4.

Just wanted to share the perspective since i think few on here have firsthand experience with both f80 and cgt4