AMS claims M3/M4 Nurburgring Lap Time of ~7.50min !

[CanAutM3]

I just checked the Sport Auto super test article for the E92, the car was equipped with Pilot Sport Cup+ tires.

In the article, they do mention that the Cup tires fitted to this M3 are not as extreme as the ones that were fitted to the CSL, but rather a specially developped tire that mixes characteristics of the PS2 and Cup tires.

[pgviper]

Impressive...

But still not on par with american sports cars. This is the NEW generation M3 we are talking about. With ford releasing their base Mustang GT which is supposedly as fast as a Boss 302 and the 2016 Camaro around the corner, this thing is going to be blown away by the competition.

Ohh wait....

But the interior is better guys...

[FogCityM3]

Don't think GM does this anymore, but was a lot of controversy surrounding the CTS-V testing, as the "harness bar" actually went across the entire vehicle and were interpreted as some as an extra roll brace to stiffen suspension:

http://rawautos.com/2012/02/uncooked...an-be-changed/

Originally Posted by See5

I'd like to evidence of this. GM typically runs bone stock cars at the Nurburgring with Sparco seats and a rollcage for crash safety. Otherwise they are bone stock from my understanding. I remember that CTS-V being an automatic model as well. Whatever the case, it usually backed up its performance on the street and in other track tests.


As for the F80/82, wouldn't be surprised to see it in the 7:40's if they did a true all out lap. It seems to be a very quick car.

[ozinaldo]

I was also not aware that 2007 Sport Auto time for the E92 M3 was with semi slicks! That now pretty much explains the 10 sec. difference between Sport Auto times of the 1M (was naturally with PS2) and the M3, both manual of course. With same tires that difference should not be more than 5 sec. max. Most of us always felt off and sceptical with the N-ring time of Sport Auto (especially when our member Advevo started clocking impressive and seemingly faster times chasing E46 M3 CSLs and E92 M3 GTSs, and in traffic; he also claimed that stock car should be able to turn a sub 8 sec. with ideal conditions and no traffic); so that 'official' time never added up compared to many other track results where 1M was either very close or sometimes ahead (Hockenheim comes to mind) of M3s, manual to manual and sometimes even against the DCT (Sachsenring by Auto Bild). All this, depending on the track (i.e. the shorter and more technical the track more likely to see the 1M ahead and with longer straights M3 has the upper hand).

In case of new M3 vs. old M3 if F8X supertest also comes with a 7.50 the logical conclusion is to take it as it is somehow less than 15 sec. the difference, maybe more like 10 sec. faster with same tires and same type of transmission.

Finally, if 7.50 is legal we should also take it as the fastest stock M3 to date because of the tire difference again (of the E46 M3 CSL as the record holder, not counting the late GTS as it was a very limited run prepared for race with wings and so).

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by pgviper

Impressive...

But still not on par with american sports cars. This is the NEW generation M3 we are talking about. With ford releasing their base Mustang GT which is supposedly as fast as a Boss 302 and the 2016 Camaro around the corner, this thing is going to be blown away by the competition.

Ohh wait....

But the interior is better guys...

The vette is the only american car that currently truly impresses me. I saw the new stang at the auto show and it still has no wow factor, interior still sucks, hopefully it doesn't have that ungodly body roll and is still a large car. I have yet on this planet to find an uglier car than a camaro.

The vette on the other hand is awesome.

[pgviper]

Originally Posted by ASAP

The vette is the only american car that currently truly impresses me. I saw the new stang at the auto show and it still has no wow factor, interior still sucks, hopefully it doesn't have that ungodly body roll and is still a large car. I have yet on this planet to find an uglier car than a camaro.

The vette on the other hand is awesome.

Stingray is a beauty, I agree.

But as far as your other comments, your sir are the exception with those opinions. Like my comment says, BMW owners are more concerned with looks and interior. Nothing wrong with that but the performance is simply not there. You can't argue the fact that all levels of camaros (1LE, ZL1 and Z/28) outrun the M3/M4 and as far as generations go, these zeta platform cars are a thing of the past. Once the ATS chassis begins to be produced, the gap is going to grow that much more. I wouldn't be surprised if a 2016 camaro SS has the same lap times as a current model 1LE just like the 2015 mustang has the same lap times as a boss 302.

In my opinion, the e92 M3 BLEW PEOPLE AWAY, took the public by surprise and raised the bar. The f80 M3/M4 is just another BMW. There really are no rave reviews about it which is unforunate.

[Boss330]

AFAIK, the 997 GT3 went on sale in the summer of 2006 (making it a 2007 MY).

In 2009 the 997.2 GT3 came out with a larger engine (3,8 vs 3,6 and 435hp vs 415hp) and quite a bit of other upgrades.

I'd say that the 2009 onwards model is a fairly upgraded GT3 and not just a facelift model.

But, we don't even know whether he meant 997 or 991 GT3...

[tallshortguy]

Originally Posted by Boss330

AFAIK, the 997 GT3 went on sale in the summer of 2006 (making it a 2007 MY).

In 2009 the 997.2 GT3 came out with a larger engine (3,8 vs 3,6 and 435hp vs 415hp) and quite a bit of other upgrades.

I'd say that the 2009 onwards model is a fairly upgraded GT3 and not just a facelift model.

But, we don't even know whether he meant 997 or 991 GT3...

Chris Harris? He mentioned 997 in the tweet.

[fischer]

The X5 E53 V12 did a 7:49(several years before).


Also very impressive: The old E46 CSL did a 7:50
http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...50.html?show=4

[Boss330]

Originally Posted by tallshortguy

Chris Harris? He mentioned 997 in the tweet.

Did he???

I only saw "1 sec faster than a GT3" in his tweet...

EDIT: He did write "(assuming 997)". Which at least means it wasn't his own lap time in a GT3, and that we have no clue if it was a 996, 997 or 991 GT3

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Boss330

AFAIK, the 997 GT3 went on sale in the summer of 2006 (making it a 2007 MY).

In 2009 the 997.2 GT3 came out with a larger engine (3,8 vs 3,6 and 435hp vs 415hp) and quite a bit of other upgrades.

I'd say that the 2009 onwards model is a fairly upgraded GT3 and not just a facelift model.

But, we don't even know whether he meant 997 or 991 GT3...

Don't forget the 2011 4.0

[tallshortguy]

Originally Posted by Boss330

Did he???

I only saw "1 sec faster than a GT3" in his tweet...

EDIT: He did write "(assuming 997)". Which at least means it wasn't his own lap time in a GT3, and that we have no clue if it was a 996, 997 or 991 GT3

"Assuming 997" usually means assuming you're comparing it to a 997 and is what I understand he meant. If he meant 991 then I would be absolutely floored given that car has 475 hp.

[Powerslide]

Ok - for everyone who thinks 7:50 is such a horrible time, take a look at what falls in the 7:44.00 to 7:56 range... by the naysayers' logic, every single one of these cars suck compared to the 911S (991 chassis) and Boss 302 - in other words, all of the manufacturers of the cars below have lost their way, don't know how to build performance cars, the world is about to be obliterated by an asteroid the size of the sun... blah blah, wah wah....

Dear Lord, when are all the babies on here just going to enjoy cars instead of constantly whining about them...???!! It would be one thing if people's expectations were at least somewhat plausible. Keep in mind that the new M3/M4 are one of the least expensive cars in this time group...


Pagani Zonda C12 S
7:44.00
160
'02
555 / 1250




63.

Audi R8 V10 5.2 FSI

7:44.00

160

'09

525 / 1620




64.

Porsche 911 Turbo S

7:44.00

160

'10

530 / 1585

Horst Von Saurma



65.

Mercedes CLK 63 Black Series

7:45.00

159

'07

507 / 1745

Berndt Schneider



66.

Gardner Douglas GD T70 Spyder

7:45.00

159

'10

710 / 900

Dario Margutti



67.

Audi R8 V10 plus (2013)

7:45.00

159

'13

550 / 1570

Horst von Saurma



68.

Porsche 911 GT2

7:46.00

159

'00

460 / 1430




69.

Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera

7:46.00

159

'07

530 / 1520




70.

Mercedes C 63 AMG Coupe Black Series

7:46.00

159

'11

517 / 1748

sportauto



71.

Jaguar XJ220

7:46.37

159

'92

549 / 1470

John Nielsen



72.

Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano

7:47.00

159

'06

620 / 1748




73.

Wiesmann GT MF5

7:47.00

159

'08

507 / 1380




74.

Porsche 911 Turbo

7:47.00

159

'09

500 / 1570




75.

BMW M3 GTS

7:48.00

158

'10

450 / 1543




76.

Alpina B3 GT3

7:49.00

158

'12

408 / 1535




77.

RUF CTR2

7:49.85

158

'97

520 / 1422




78.

Lamborghini Murcielago

7:50.00

158

'02

580 / 1800




79.

Porsche 911 Carrera S

7:50.00

158

'08

385 / 1420




80.

BMW M3 CSL

7:50.00

158

'03

360 / 1385

Horst von Saurma



81.

Mercedes SL65 AMG Black Series

7:51.00

157

'09

670 / 1870




82.

Jaguar XKR-S

7:51.00

157

'11

551 / 1843




83.

Ford GT

7:52.00

157

'04

550 / 1538




84.

Lamborghini Gallardo LP560-4

7:52.00

157

'08

560 / 1530




85.

BMW M5

7:52.00

157

'05

507 / 1848

Hans Stuck



86.

Lamborghini Gallardo

7:52.00

157

'03

500 / 1613




87.

Porsche 911 Turbo Cabriolet

7:52.00

157

'07

480 / 1655

Walter Rohrl



88.

Porsche Panamera Turbo S

7:52.20

157

'11

550 / 1995

Horst von Saurma



89.

Lotus Exige S

7:53.00

157

0

350 / 1080

Christian Gebhart



90.

Mercedes CLK DTM

7:54.00

156

'04

582 / 1678




91.

Porsche 911 GT3

7:54.00

156

'03

380 / 1380




92.

Porsche Cayman S

7:55.00

156

'13

325 / 1320

Walter Rohrl



93.

Ferrari F430

7:55.00

156

'05

489 / 1450




94.

Caterham R500 1.8L K Series

7:55.00

156

'99

233 / 450

Robert Nearn



95.

BMW M5

7:55.00

156

'11

560 / 1870




96.

Mercedes E 63 AMG S-Model

7:55.00

156

'13

585 / 1840

Horst von Saurma



97.

Porsche 911 Turbo

7:56.00

156

'00

420 / 1540




98.

Ferrari 360 CS

7:56.00

156

'03

425 / 1280




99.

Ferrari California GT

7:56.00

156

'09

460 / 1787




100.

Porsche Panamera Sport Chrono Turbo

7:56.00

156

'09

500 / 1974

Walter Rohrl



101.

Porsche Panamera Turbo

7:56.00

156

'09

500 / 1870

Walter Rohrl



102.

Chevrolet Corvette Z06

7:56.00

156

'02

411 / 1414

Dave Hill



103.

Mercedes SLS AMG Coupe Electric Drive

7:56.23

156

'13

751 / 2095




104.

Mercedes SLS AMG Coupe Electric Drive

7:56.23

156

'13

751 / 2095

[turbo8765]

I'd bet the latest PSS fitted to the 991 and C7 is as fast as the PSC that was on the early euro e92.

I'd also bet that an LCI DCT E92 on stock PSSs would be as fast or faster than the early manual E92 on the PSC.

[Nautik]

Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT

In the today print issue of AMS (Auto Motor Sport) is an track driving review of the MotoGP M4 on Losail Circuit in Qatar. They also claimed the S55 as not so sharply throttle responsive as the old S65, but because of the overall performance this doesn´t matter much, there is enough power out of the engine and with the Akrapovic Performance Exhaust it sounds like an/the V8.

Included is an small article about an comparison between M3 vs. M4 ... in this article they quoted for M3 and M4 identical performance and identical (reached) Nurburgring times of round 7.50 min !!!

Greetings BMW M3 CRT

What are they basing the Akrapovic Performance Exhaust comment on? Has Akra developed an exhaust for the car and the sound been witnessed somewhere?

I would like to love this car but I just cannot get over the sound. I enjoy my e92 immensely with the Corsa exhaust simply due to the sound. I love it and it is a huge part of the driving experience for me.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Boss330

Did he???

I only saw "1 sec faster than a GT3" in his tweet...

EDIT: He did write "(assuming 997)". Which at least means it wasn't his own lap time in a GT3, and that we have no clue if it was a 996, 997 or 991 GT3

It was 1 second slower not faster.

Either way, a 991S is as fast or faster than a 997 GT3 but again that car is quite old at this point. Funny how you couldn't compare it to a brand new 991 GT3 bc there isn't a split second of comparability.

And you also don't know what time Harris was talking about, his own or ??

[Nautik]

Gentlemen, no one other than you cares how old the Porsche is or whatever else is being argued. It's getting quite comical and I can't even tell who is being serious.

But for the love of God, someone please explain the exhaust comment already!

"What are they basing the Akrapovic Performance Exhaust comment on? Has Akra developed an exhaust for the car and the sound been witnessed somewhere? "

[Boss330]

Originally Posted by Nautik

Gentlemen, no one other than you cares how old the Porsche is or whatever else is being argued. It's getting quite comical and I can't even tell who is being serious.

But for the love of God, someone please explain the exhaust comment already!

"What are they basing the Akrapovic Performance Exhaust comment on? Has Akra developed an exhaust for the car and the sound been witnessed somewhere? "

It have been mentioned a time ago, based on an article in a German Magazine that did a special article on Akrapovic.

The M Performance exhaust has been witnessed by several members and here are a few posts with the sound of that exhaust:

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=968058

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=968250

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=965195

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=959707

[dlbrooks18]

Wow, 7:50 is impressive.

http://nurburgringlaptimes.com/lap-t...times-top-100/

For comparisons sake, which we all know:

E92 M3 GTS _ 7:48
E92 Alpina B3 GT3 _ 7:49
E46 M3 CSL _ 7:50

[vladberca]

More track oriented versions will be released so we'll see better times for sure

[Nautik]

Originally Posted by Boss330

It have been mentioned a time ago, based on an article in a German Magazine that did a special article on Akrapovic.

The M Performance exhaust has been witnessed by several members and here are a few posts with the sound of that exhaust:

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=968058

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=968250

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=965195

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=959707

Thank you! Guess I will be gutting the cats and driving around with the ole emisisons light on.

[Remonster]

Originally Posted by Nautik

What are they basing the Akrapovic Performance Exhaust comment on? Has Akra developed an exhaust for the car and the sound been witnessed somewhere?

I would like to love this car but I just cannot get over the sound. I enjoy my e92 immensely with the Corsa exhaust simply due to the sound. I love it and it is a huge part of the driving experience for me.

Akrapovic makes the M Performance exhaust systems.