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[NO_USER_]

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[BuLoOoSki]

Glad it all worked out for you man

The reason BM3 didn't attempt to flash the first time you tried flashing after switching to VF was because it detected you were now on a different software version than what you activated BM3 with. So it prevented you from flashing because of that software mismatch. This could have been resolved two ways: Ask PTF to reactivate your account and update your info to account for your new software version (which you should do in the case if say a dealership updates your entire car to a newer i-level). Your second option (which in your case is the right option since your DME was updated to another version by the tuner, but you could also have gone with the first option), is have your other tuner flash you back to stock and to the same version you were on originally while still maintaining OBD unlock. Unfortunately for you VF flashed you back to stock but locked your DME, which personally I think they shouldn't have as you came to them with an unlocked DME. You should have flashed a stock map with their tool, but the same way you would have flashed a "tuned" map in order to have the frieling software still apply the unlock patch to your bootloader and keep your OBD unlocked.

So when you came to flash with BM3 the second time with a LOCKED DME the flash failed obviously, since BM3 still doesn't support OBD unlock yet. To recover that you needed to do a full flash of a stock map via E-sys to recover your DME.

Your situation brings an important point IMO which I think people should give more thought to. People seem so concerned with flash counters, but don't seem to care about software version. With BM3, they literally create a map for every car based on the software version your car is on. They do not change your DME software version at all whether your flashing a tuned map or back to stock. Almost every other tuner not using BM3 works on a single software version and create ALL their tunes based on that software. So all their customers are on the same software version which for some could mean a software upgrade and others could mean a software downgrade. Some of those tuners do flash you back to your stock software version when you want to return back to stock, but others (which I shall refrain from naming) will not take you back to your original software version even when flashing you back to stock.

Most customers don't know that, but they should be aware. Because there are potential downsides of being on a different software version in one ECU and being on a completely different software version in your other related ECUs (Most of the ECUs in the car are interconnected). But besides all that, for those who are so concerned about their flash counter being a giveaway to the dealership that you are tuned, maybe you should think about which is more "risky" to voiding your warranty. Is it the flash counter or the dealership seeing your DME being on a software version that is 1yr older/newer than the rest of your ECUs?

[M3anPower]

Originally Posted by BuLoOoSki

Glad it all worked out for you man

The reason BM3 didn't attempt to flash the first time you tried flashing after switching to VF was because it detected you were now on a different software version than what you activated BM3 with. So it prevented you from flashing because of that software mismatch. This could have been resolved two ways: Ask PTF to reactivate your account and update your info to account for your new software version (which you should do in the case if say a dealership updates your entire car to a newer i-level). Your second option (which in your case is the right option since your DME was updated to another version by the tuner, but you could also have gone with the first option), is have your other tuner flash you back to stock and to the same version you were on originally while still maintaining OBD unlock. Unfortunately for you VF flashed you back to stock but locked your DME, which personally I think they shouldn't have as you came to them with an unlocked DME. You should have flashed a stock map with their tool, but the same way you would have flashed a "tuned" map in order to have the frieling software still apply the unlock patch to your bootloader and keep your OBD unlocked.

So when you came to flash with BM3 the second time with a LOCKED DME the flash failed obviously, since BM3 still doesn't support OBD unlock yet. To recover that you needed to do a full flash of a stock map via E-sys to recover your DME.

Your situation brings an important point IMO which I think people should give more thought to. People seem so concerned with flash counters, but don't seem to care about software version. With BM3, they literally create a map for every car based on the software version your car is on. They do not change your DME software version at all whether your flashing a tuned map or back to stock. Almost every other tuner not using BM3 works on a single software version and create ALL their tunes based on that software. So all their customers are on the same software version which for some could mean a software upgrade and others could mean a software downgrade. Some of those tuners do flash you back to your stock software version when you want to return back to stock, but others (which I shall refrain from naming) will not take you back to your original software version even when flashing you back to stock.

Most customers don't know that, but they should be aware. Because there are potential downsides of being on a different software version in one ECU and being on a completely different software version in your other related ECUs (Most of the ECUs in the car are interconnected). But besides all that, for those who are so concerned about their flash counter being a giveaway to the dealership that you are tuned, maybe you should think about which is more "risky" to voiding your warranty. Is it the flash counter or the dealership seeing your DME being on a software version that is 1yr older/newer than the rest of your ECUs?

Who are most customers and most tuners? VF doesn't represent the entire tuning facilities and if one or two customers have no back ground in tuning facilities they also don't represent "most of the customers"..

dude you have to stop bashing around and start giving credits. I can quote at least 10 of your posts talking about "most customers and most tuners"... I like your posts but come on...

[Jaymax85]

Alex at alpine is amazing, I have used him twice in the past and will continue to use him.

[aboulfad]

Wow! Your story is like a mini-series "I've bricked my DME" with a happy finale Congrats and amazing how ALL vendors pitched in to support you

[ptper]

So, VF/Hex will not take you back to your original software version even when flashing you back to stock?

[rosenbergendo]

Alex did coding on my car and was ridiculously good at customer service and the results were fast and awesome! If I were to do an OBD flash he would be my guy without question!!

[Endeav]

Glad you got this fixed without having to remove the DME again - while it isn't the worst job in the world, it's also not one of the most fun things to do haha.

[BuLoOoSki]

Originally Posted by ///M1990

Who are most customers and most tuners? VF doesn't represent the entire tuning facilities and if one or two customers have no back ground in tuning facilities they also don't represent "most of the customers"..

dude you have to stop bashing around and start giving credits. I can quote at least 10 of your posts talking about "most customers and most tuners"... I like your posts but come on...

I believe my exact sentence was "Almost every other tuner not using BM3...", and I think that sentence is self explanatory and answers your question of who are most tuners. The reason I used the word "Almost" and not "All" is to give the benefit of the doubt just in case there might be one other outlier (which I highly doubt). I'm not sure why you called out VF in particular though, I surely didn't name out anyone. If I mentioned VF's name in the first part of my post it was in explaining to the OP why his car wouldn't flash with BM3 when he was switching between the two tunes. But in the second part of my post I made sure not to name anyone so that nobody would come and tell me I was bashing anyone in particular But it clearly didn't stop you from saying that

I give credit when credit is due, not that any person/tuner/company needs my credit or stamp of approval You can go back as far as you'd like to my posts and look for yourself. And not that I need to explain myself, but you'll see in the BM3's thread I've had MANY posts where I'm pointing out issues/bugs with their tune in efforts to have them improve their product. So I'm not siding with anyone. But I've learnt from being on this forum for a long time that many people don't speak up about their issues with products. So back to my BM3 issue posts for example. I remember contacting PTF with things that I thought should be improved/fixed, and sometimes there response was that that issue seems to be isolated to me as nobody else has mentioned anything about it. But guess what? I post about it in their thread and half a dozen people all of a sudden chime in that they've had that issue as well.

So the point isn't to bash anyone, but the purpose of my post was to bring light to something that isn't clearly communicated to customers and many people are simply not aware of. Just trying to be helpful buddy

[BuLoOoSki]

Originally Posted by Endeav

Glad you got this fixed without having to remove the DME again - while it isn't the worst job in the world, it's also not one of the most fun things to do haha.

Agreed! Especially getting to those damn DME connectors...or maybe my hand is just huge

[proTUNING Freaks]

Hey D glad you got it sorted with Alex! I suspected ESys would get it back as you'd flash the bootloader too. Once BM3 has the OBD unlock released it'll also flash that area but right now it doesn't as we didn't want to risk people locking their DMEs up without realizing what they did. If there's a button, someone out there will click it to see what happens, no matter what we put in a warning dialog about not doing it Bringing servers down to push a code change to try and help out yesterday afternoon had others screaming at us almost immediately even though it was less than a 60sec outage LOL!

[GlazierGlaze]

Sounds like VF doesn't know what they are doing over there. Random files and limited explanations...

Team BM3 for the win.

[sycd]

Great to know your car is back from the dead. Which tune did you get from Alex and how is the performance, etc?

[bracer]

Interesting on the software versions. It would probably be nice to know what version of software their tunes are based off of. Seems like ideal would be if their tune was based on the latest software and then you would have all the other ECU's updated to the same before hand.

[BPMSport]

The DME was never in a bricked state at all - just to be accurate terminology wise.

If it failed at the end it simply means there was an SVK mismatch and the data area was not accepted.

It's easy to bring this back to life - the DME was never bricked to begin with - it was a software mismatch.

Updated software won't cause any issues as long as it's prepared and loaded correctly.

Special attention should be paid to checksum correction when returning to stock.

Glad you got the car running.

[MNoob]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

The DME was never in a bricked state at all - just to be accurate terminology wise.

If it failed at the end it simply means there was an SVK mismatch and the data area was not accepted.

It's easy to bring this back to life - the DME was never bricked to begin with - it was a software mismatch.

Glad you got the car running.

remember, it depends on how knowledgeable you are with this stuff. if my cell phone battery dies I'm ready to call it bricked.

[BPMSport]

Originally Posted by MNoob

remember, it depends on how knowledgeable you are with this stuff. if my cell phone battery dies I'm ready to call it bricked.

A brick means 0 communication

If a DME is "bricked" it will not communicate via OBD at all.

I guess you can accurately say your cellphone is brick until you plug the charger in :

[BuLoOoSki]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

The DME was never in a bricked state at all - just to be accurate terminology wise.

If it failed at the end it simply means there was an SVK mismatch and the data area was not accepted.

It's easy to bring this back to life - the DME was never bricked to begin with - it was a software mismatch.

Updated software won't cause any issues as long as it's prepared and loaded correctly.

Special attention should be paid to checksum correction when returning to stock.

Glad you got the car running.

Thanks for the insight.

[VF-Engineering]

Stepping in to offer additional clarification so people don't have
to make assumptions on our behalf...


Our HEX Tuning software is typically based on the latest software
version from BMW whenever possible. We are usually never more
than one ISTEP behind BMW, and if/when we are, it's because we
are working on validating the latest versions to ensure that the
most recent updates do not create a conflict with our current
tuning strategies.



It needs to be understood that our software is developed as an
aftermarket solution which adds desirable features along with
increased power and improved performance for your vehicle.

Any discussion regarding how to return to stock without being
noticeable by BMW, or to preserve your factory warranty, is not
something we engage in. In fact we generally try to discourage
those discussions as it's a disservice to give false hope to any
customer who is trying to preserve their factory warranty.



That being said, the ability to flash your car back to stock is for
the ability to return to stock power when desired, or the purpose
of diagnostic functions when/if an issue were to present itself.
For that reason the stock file provided is going to be the latest
software version that our tuned software is based on.

For responsible owners who understand that BMW should not be
held accountable for warranty coverage on modified vehicles, the
end result is Stock and Tuned software on the latest BMW software
version. This includes all of our Stage Levels, as well as 'Features
Only', 'ZCP' & 'CS' Power Levels, Stage ONE/TWO/TWO+, etc...



For those with genuine concerns with how to protect yourself from
potential warranty issues you have two responsible choices.

1) Leave your car stock and BMW will never have any reason to
deny a warranty claim.

2) Pick experienced and responsible tuners who develop and test
their own products with a reputation for reliability, knowing that
in the rare but unfortunate case of a warranty delial, you're not
only reasonably informed but prepared to "Pay to Play".


------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by GlazierGlaze

Sounds like VF doesn't know what they are doing over there. Random files and limited explanations...

This is obviously not the case as I'm willing to bet that we've
successfully flashed more F-series vehicles than any other tuner
on this forum.

Additionally, we offer a 30-day money back guarantee, which the
OP has utilized on two separate occasions knowing that the process
requires his vehicle to be flashed back to FULL Stock before any
refund can be issued.

He was advised in advance that "Stock" means Stock, and that we
cannot guarantee his return to BM3 without having to start from
scratch by removing and unlocking his ECU. (this was explained
before even attempting to use our OBDII Port Flashable software
the second time)

His results yesterday from trying to flash his stock ECU with BM3
software that requires "patching/unlocking" is exactly what would
have happened to ANY stock vehicle as our software had already
been removed from the equation.

[aboulfad]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

The DME was never in a bricked state at all - just to be accurate terminology wise. ...

Very true, few days ago, a friend got his DME really bricked, and all you hear was relays ticking and ISTA/Esys would NOT see DME, he had to bench flash it to bring it back to live! It turned out to be a bad tune file from a vendor not on these boards...

[BPMSport]

Originally Posted by aboulfad

Very true, few days ago, a friend got his DME really bricked, and all you hear was relays ticking and ISTA/Esys would NOT see DME, he had to bench flash it to bring it back to live! It turned out to be a bad tune file from a vendor not on these boards...

If that's the case it likely failed flashing before 90% completion. In order for a tune file to corrupt the DME to this point, there must have been a serious oversight in what was being programmed!

[aboulfad]

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

If that's the case it likely failed flashing before 90% completion. In order for a tune file to corrupt the DME to this point, there must have been a serious oversight in what was being programmed!

OT, Yep, agreed and questionable too as he has a special flashing tool, he then had to drill a hole in his DME to bench flash as his previous attempt of opening the previous DME damaged some SMD components That’s some bad luck and another mini series, “I really bricked my DME“