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      08-25-2017, 06:51 PM   #67
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Id say the chances for success with a lemon law lawyer would be very high...I would have lawyered up in this situation a long time ago...you have been more than patient here....many lemon law lawyers will not even charge anything up front.
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      08-25-2017, 11:59 PM   #68
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Id say the chances for success with a lemon law lawyer would be very high...I would have lawyered up in this situation a long time ago...you have been more than patient here....many lemon law lawyers will not even charge anything up front.
As stated previously above, the chances are pretty low that this car is protected by the lemon law since it was a used car when purchased.

I would keep working on BMW firmly and politely until you receive the satisfaction you deserve. If you have test driven a new and a used M3 on their lot that do not exhibit the same problem as yours, I think that is clear evidence that your car has a legitimate problem.
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      08-26-2017, 08:08 AM   #69
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It's very odd that they would start off replacing the transmission, but nonetheless you now have a new transmission and a new diff -- major potential wear items in the drivetrain.

If you have any desire to keep this car, try to work with BMWNA on getting a new driveshaft/couplings/etc, and have it properly installed. Perhaps you'll be able to convince them to follow that one step further given the experience of others here from various different countries.

As an old engineer/car nut for ages for an issue like this one, if I was starting to troubleshoot this issue and the vibration *only* occurred during load of light acceleration through that speed range, I would almost completely rule out bent wheels/tire issues. If steady state conditions (constant speed, either coasting or maintenance throttle) revel no vibration, but it immediately appears on light acceleration that would point me to drivetrain *or* (in modern cars) potentially software and fuel/ignition issues -- this is what gets complicated so quickly on a modern car trying to isolate electrical and/or mechanical issues in the fuel delivery system and ignition versus a potential software issue. Most likely they'd load the latest programming and go from there on the fuel/ignition troubleshooting. An experienced tech/engineer might could develop a gut feel of whether its engine or drivetrain related just by feeling it happen. Of course datalogging what's going on with these is an easy and first step, and could quickly rule out the engine output as a problem.

Looks like BMWNA MSRP on the driveshaft is $3139, and one could buy it from BMW Morristown online for $2354; hence dealer cost on that part is around $1950-2100 range. BMWNA's cost for the part from BMW AG is therefore in the range of $1600-1700. Someone could likely find out what the book rate is for changing out the driveshaft, but let's hope it's not more than 3hrs. BMWNA reimburses dealers at some fraction of their labor rate, so let's guess that is $75/hr for this dealer.

Hence it might cost BMWNA $1700 plus $225, or about $2000 to replace that driveshaft. It doesn't seem like too much to ask when you point out that it is a small fraction of what's already spent, and this has a high potential to fix the car.
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      08-26-2017, 02:15 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by exo-shell View Post
There is a difference between a performance car and a dedicated race/track car. At the Performance Centers, they aren't using the cars to pick up the kids from daycare and once in a while have a go on the track. They are literally being beaten on real race tracks all day every day. There isn't a race car on the planet that doesn't have transmissions, driveshafts and other components replaced due to wear and tear.

I think there are a lot of unreasonable expectations that a BMW can be continuously abused on the track then everything should be honky dory after that. Yes, the M cars perform great on the track; it's not free from wear and tear though.
Grew up around all types of cars due to my father. The best cars we beat and at the end of the day put away ride hard and the car kept giving. That's what it's to do. Yes parts break, but if you make a solid product you should not worry. Much like a diesel truck, bought cause you can beat it pull anything and get 300,000 miles off it. It's built to do that !
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      08-26-2017, 04:55 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBeard420 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by exo-shell View Post
There is a difference between a performance car and a dedicated race/track car. At the Performance Centers, they aren't using the cars to pick up the kids from daycare and once in a while have a go on the track. They are literally being beaten on real race tracks all day every day. There isn't a race car on the planet that doesn't have transmissions, driveshafts and other components replaced due to wear and tear.

I think there are a lot of unreasonable expectations that a BMW can be continuously abused on the track then everything should be honky dory after that. Yes, the M cars perform great on the track; it's not free from wear and tear though.
Grew up around all types of cars due to my father. The best cars we beat and at the end of the day put away ride hard and the car kept giving. That's what it's to do. Yes parts break, but if you make a solid product you should not worry. Much like a diesel truck, bought cause you can beat it pull anything and get 300,000 miles off it. It's built to do that !
I got a couple more events at the PC this year. I'll be sure to let them know they're doing it wrong and maybe they should build em like diesel trucks.

Seriously though, I miss those simpler times too; where a tear down and rebuild in the garage was no big deal. Now, all the software and super tight tolerances for components today results in a narrower range of usability before failure. For gearheads, that's the trade off to have these precision machines.
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      08-29-2017, 05:06 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by noone View Post
Unfortunately, they took him. He also paid market price (not below market) for that car.
Crazy, right? You don't even want to know what the Porsche driving school GT3's sell for. Last year they sold for over sticker at auction!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dazman View Post
Could the issue be related to the CF shaft and that's why they are moving to steel?
It could definitely be the shaft, but that's not why they're moving to steel. New Euro emissions laws are going to require petrol cars to have exhaust particulate filters like the modern diesels have starting in 2018. F8x will be in production until 2020ish and therefore will have to meet the new standard. There is nowhere to install such a filter so the only feasible option mid-production cycle was to make the driveshaft a smaller diameter to make room for it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
It's very odd that they would start off replacing the transmission, but nonetheless you now have a new transmission and a new diff -- major potential wear items in the drivetrain.

If you have any desire to keep this car, try to work with BMWNA on getting a new driveshaft/couplings/etc, and have it properly installed. Perhaps you'll be able to convince them to follow that one step further given the experience of others here from various different countries.

Looks like BMWNA MSRP on the driveshaft is $3139, and one could buy it from BMW Morristown online for $2354; hence dealer cost on that part is around $1950-2100 range. BMWNA's cost for the part from BMW AG is therefore in the range of $1600-1700. Someone could likely find out what the book rate is for changing out the driveshaft, but let's hope it's not more than 3hrs. BMWNA reimburses dealers at some fraction of their labor rate, so let's guess that is $75/hr for this dealer.

Hence it might cost BMWNA $1700 plus $225, or about $2000 to replace that driveshaft. It doesn't seem like too much to ask when you point out that it is a small fraction of what's already spent, and this has a high potential to fix the car.
Perhaps the OP could convince BMW to just pay the dealer the labor to just swap a driveshaft from another car and see what happens. I think this would be a reasonable expectation considering the history and prior repair attempts. Have you seen the complete service and repair history on the car? I'm curious if the driveshaft had ever been disconnected for any reason prior to you buying the car. And do we know if this car was effected by the diff recall? OP, If you can send me the VIN I can try to see what history shows up.

Side note, in most states manufacturers are now required to pay MSRP/retail labor rate to dealers for warranty repairs. The difference is the labor time that dealers charge clients for customer pay work vs what warranty book time is. Retail clients are usually paying b/t 1.5-1.8 times the warranty labor time. So if BMW pays a dealer 3 hours to do a repair based on their book time, most dealers are going to charge their retail clients 4.5 hours to do the same job. But BMW still pays MSRP for the part and the same labor rate as retail clients do. In most states anyways. There are still a few states out there that really like to deprive their residents of fair wages at the behest of corporations.
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      08-31-2017, 05:14 AM   #73
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I have the same exact issue. Vibration starts at about 67 mph, peaks at 72mph and is gone at 78 mph. Only occurs during acceleration.

Purchased the car new. 2017 M3 with comp pack. Anyone else have this issue? Is there a common denominator as to which cars have this problem?

Very annoying and uncomfortable to say the least. Not normal for sure.
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      08-31-2017, 11:04 AM   #74
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Vibration in a specific gear or in all gears from 3rd onwards?

Up slope and down slope too?

At cornering?

Full throttle or partial or both?
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      08-31-2017, 11:19 AM   #75
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Quote:
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Car was bought in GA so do you need to file in GA? I'd stick the car back to United BMW not Hendrick. Either way good luck.
Im pretty sure United BMW in Atlanta is the only dealer that sells these Perf Center cars but I may be wrong.

About a month ago they gave me a ridiculously low trade offer on my pristine 16 M4 with 6000 miles (like slap in the face ridiculous, 15k under another local dealer). Their whole reasoning was they got these "pristine" Perf Center cars super cheap and could offer them with CPO finance rates and full maintenance.

They definitely don't sell them at a big discount tho I've seen some listed in the 70s with 5k miles.

Ive taken my business to another local dealer after buying my last 4 M cars from United.
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      08-31-2017, 11:31 AM   #76
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Many BMW dealers buy these at dealer only Manheim auctions and resell them. Not just BMW United. There are 2 of these M3s for sale at 2 different dealerships within 20 miles of me.
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      08-31-2017, 11:32 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKM32017 View Post
I have the same exact issue. Vibration starts at about 67 mph, peaks at 72mph and is gone at 78 mph. Only occurs during acceleration.

Purchased the car new. 2017 M3 with comp pack. Anyone else have this issue? Is there a common denominator as to which cars have this problem?

Very annoying and uncomfortable to say the least. Not normal for sure.
I'm curious to hear if others can test and report if they experience similar.
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      08-31-2017, 11:38 AM   #78
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I'm curious to hear if others can test and report if they experience similar.
No problems with mine. Got mine brand new in June.
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      08-31-2017, 11:41 AM   #79
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Many BMW dealers buy these at dealer only Manheim auctions and resell them. Not just BMW United. There are 2 of these M3s for sale at 2 different dealerships within 20 miles of me.
Maybe United is the only one who gets them direct from the perf center. Or maybe they just lied. Either is possible.
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      08-31-2017, 12:26 PM   #80
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Maybe United is the only one who gets them direct from the perf center. Or maybe they just lied. Either is possible.
Nope. They bought them from Manheim and BMW NA sold these cars to them.
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      08-31-2017, 12:47 PM   #81
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Nope. They bought them from Manheim and BMW NA sold these cars to them.
Maybe United just loves these performance center cars more so than other dealers?
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      08-31-2017, 01:25 PM   #82
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Filter on every single 2016 BMW M3 for sale on Autotrader.com. Look for the competition wheels in the pics of the results. Then click on the CarFax on each. Literally, almost every single 2016 with the competition package for sale right now is a previous M School car. Check it out yourself! BMW NA just dumped a fleet of these M School cars on the market over the last 2 months and they are at BMW dealerships across the country.

Last edited by noone; 08-31-2017 at 01:35 PM.
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      08-31-2017, 01:39 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mose121 View Post
Perhaps the OP could convince BMW to just pay the dealer the labor to just swap a driveshaft from another car and see what happens. I think this would be a reasonable expectation considering the history and prior repair attempts.
I?d say there?s pretty much zero chance of this happening.

No dealer is going to intentionally dismantle a car they are hoping to sell in an effort to resolve an issue BMWUSA is ultimately responsible for.
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      08-31-2017, 01:41 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Thescout13 View Post
Maybe United just loves these performance center cars more so than other dealers?
I just verified with my friend who used to work there and was the M specialist. They got some through Manheim and some directly from the Perf center.
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      08-31-2017, 04:46 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmic Man View Post
Vibration in a specific gear or in all gears from 3rd onwards?

Up slope and down slope too?

At cornering?

Full throttle or partial or both?
Occurs both full and part throttle. Easy to reproduce part throttle but difficult full throttle because you blow past the window too quickly.

Havent tried the others.... will do it and post back.
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      08-31-2017, 04:49 PM   #86
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No problems with mine. Got mine brand new in June.
Didnt start until about 7k miles for me.
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      08-31-2017, 05:20 PM   #87
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at this point I would either dump the car, or pay for a new driveshaft. If the new driveshaft solves the problem, I would go after BMW for reimbursement (after they give you the extended warranty)
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      08-31-2017, 06:14 PM   #88
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I would ask United to give you your money back for the car and return it.
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