AMS claims M3/M4 Nurburgring Lap Time of ~7.50min !

[BMW M3 CRT]

Originally Posted by krx927

Can you please elaborate your claim about Sport Cup tires? Standard configuration for M3 were always Michelin Pilot Sport 2...

I have never seen a reference of Sport Cups when they were talking/writing about this 8:05 lap done by Sport Auto (Horst von Saurma).

All M3s (until 2009?) with 19" wheels came in Germany (and EU) standard with the Semi-tyre Michelin Sport Cup+ ... specially developed for the E9xM3.

Only with the standard 18" wheels you got PS2s !!!

Edit:
... on june 13th come the SPORTAUTO with the "Supertest" of the new M4 ... than we definetly have an(the) NOS-time.

[M1E]

Originally Posted by coloradoe92m3

To be fair 805 was with 6 speed for e92 as wellas on pPS2 tires. The f80 is likely with dct and super sports. Given tires alone could make up 10 seconds, I'm not sure we looking at a true huge gain

No. The 8:05 min E92 Supertest was done with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup, wich is a smi slick tyre.

Anyway, if BMW refers to the 8:05 and says 15 s faster, I am sure they mean 15s faster with same semi-slick tyres.

If not, the car would be easy 20s faster, cause semis give at least 5 s advantage!
Would be a nice surprise!!!!

[BMW M3 CRT]

Originally Posted by krx927

Can you please elaborate your claim about Sport Cup tires? Standard configuration for M3 were always Michelin Pilot Sport 2...

I have never seen a reference of Sport Cups when they were talking/writing about this 8:05 lap done by Sport Auto (Horst von Saurma).

http://www.sportauto.de/rundenzeiten...?p=6&sort=Heft

M3

"Mit Sportreifen"

[jangel]

I think the information is not correct because the M3/4 have to do better time in nurburgring

Via Chris Harris on Twitter:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harris
M3/4 stat. Portimao lap 2mins 2.86 sec. 4.5 seconds faster than E92M. Unofficially, just 1sec slower than a GT3 (assuming 997).Hacer clic para expandir...

[Boss330]

Originally Posted by krx927

Can you please elaborate your claim about Sport Cup tires? Standard configuration for M3 were always Michelin Pilot Sport 2...

I have never seen a reference of Sport Cups when they were talking/writing about this 8:05 lap done by Sport Auto (Horst von Saurma).

They actually write quite a bit about the Sport Cup 19" vs the PS2 18" tires and compare two times set by both tires.

So the E92 Nürburgring time was definitely set on Sport Cup + tires

http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...d-1036129.html

http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...29.html?show=4

[Boss330]

Originally Posted by jangel

I think the information is not correct because the M3/4 have to do better time in nurburgring

Via Chris Harris on Twitter:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Harris
M3/4 stat. Portimao lap 2mins 2.86 sec. 4.5 seconds faster than E92M. Unofficially, just 1sec slower than a GT3 (assuming 997).Hacer clic para expandir...

Just 1 sec slower than a GT3!!!!

[Never Convicted]

Originally Posted by FogCityM3

Actually I've never seen a publication post a lap time of the E92 on that track..actually there are very few publication tests on the track of any car. Will be interesting to see, a true apples-to-apples comparison, which I must admit I haven't been seeing much of between the weight, nurburgring, and M5/M6 vs M3/4 threads.

If you go to his Twitter page, lap of 2:02.86, beat the E92 by 4.5 secs. I took it to mean he drove both. From his posts I think his video review will come week after next. 4.5 in under 3 miles...that's huge. But maybe he didn't like the sound, and still prefers the E92. Circle the wagons.

[krx927]

Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT

http://www.sportauto.de/rundenzeiten...?p=6&sort=Heft

M3

"Mit Sportreifen"

Originally Posted by Boss330

They actually write quite a bit about the Sport Cup 19" vs the PS2 18" tires and compare two times set by both tires.

So the E92 Nürburgring time was definitely set on Sport Cup + tires

http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...d-1036129.html

http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...29.html?show=4

Gents I did not know that. Thank you very much for the info. You cannot imagine how happy this makes me

Based on this we can calculate the full lap time on stock 18" with PS2 as follows:
+ 7 sec because Sport Auto is testing on shortened track
+ 7.5 sec - benefit of Sport Cups over PS2 taking in consideration the lap time difference of these 2 tires they suggest for Hockenheim
= 8:19.5

The first and only time I was on the Ring with my stock M3 I did 8:32 for whole lap on pretty worn PS2s...

[Envyscorpio]

I got a feeling BMW is designing cars and packages with how many seconds off from the Nurbergring.

Nai stop! 10 seconds off is reached. Save the next 5 sec for the comp package!!!

Big track, lots of high speed sections, I was hoping for some massive time reduction with 100lb more torque and similar weight as the E46. Remember E46 CSL did the same time with cup tires and oh 100hp/150lb tq less?

[M3 Montreal]

Wasn't the 8:05 lap time of 2007 using a manual transmission?

Was this new lap set with a DCT?

Doesn't a DCT avg about 1.5 seconds quicker on an approximate 2 min track?

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by M1E

No. The 8:05 min E92 Supertest was done with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup, wich is a smi slick tyre.

AH HA!!! So without Pilot Sport Cup tires, what would the time have been then? I thought SportAuto took the cars they test right off the showroom floor? Apparently not! Lol!

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by krx927

The first and only time I was on the Ring with my stock M3 I did 8:32 for whole lap on pretty worn PS2s...

On my last lap at the Nurburgring with a stock F10 M5, I got a 7:59 time. Michelin PSS's were used.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by ChesterM4

+1000

Boss & RIPM5 you guys are over this stuff like a rash. You've great cars guys, people claiming good times in the new M3/4 is not an attack on you or your cars. How petty do you need to be to change your sig to put down the excellent new cars, very low class man.

You guys really can't take a joke can you? Lol! Boss330 doesn't even own an M5. He's one of the most knowledgable and respected car enthusiasts around here. GMD2003 is also exceptionally knowledge about all cars. We're all just enthusiasts like you dudes are. Show us a post where we say anything directly bad about the M4 or M3? Lol! Now if one of came on here and said: "Oh the M4 sucks because it doesn't have the Bang & Olufsen Sound System, I'll never drive one," then sure flame away. Like I've stated many times before, the new M3 and M4 are fantastic cars and it's the first M3 I've ever really wanted. Can't we share our thoughts and state facts too, without it seeming like we are attacking the community? You really should have seen the hate some people got over on M5Board, when comparing the E60 M5 to the F10 M5. In the end we're all just enthusiasts with passion. There's a lot of cars which I think are better than the M5 too. So just chillax bro, no one is trying to fight you. Peace and love dude.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

You guys really can't take a joke can you? Lol! Boss330 doesn't even own an M5. He's one of the most knowledgable and respected car enthusiasts around here. GMD2003 is also exceptionally knowledge about all cars. We're all just enthusiasts like you dudes are. Show us a post where we say anything directly bad about the M4 or M3? Lol! Now if one of came on here and said: "Oh the M4 sucks because it doesn't have the Bang & Olufsen Sound System, I'll never drive one," then sure flame away. Like I've stated many times before, the new M3 and M4 are fantastic cars and it's the first M3 I've ever really wanted. Can't we share our thoughts and state facts too, without it seeming like we are attacking the community? You really should have seen the hate some people got over on M5Board, when comparing the E60 M5 to the F10 M5. In the end we're all just enthusiasts with passion. There's a lot of cars which I think are better than the M5 too. So just chillax bro, no one is trying to fight you. Peace and love dude.

Maybe I was having a bad day. Thanks for keeping the reply civil. I notice you've removed your recent M3 baiting sig though.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Boss330

Just 1 sec slower than a GT3!!!!

1 second on a two minute lap is huge! Plus the 997 GT3 is 10 years old at this point so not impressive at all unless comparing to the e9x m3.

[See5]

Originally Posted by FogCityM3

I remember reading this whole expose on Nurburgring times and how like at least 4 different distances are recorded and how factory drivers actually have 'ringers' - one example was the Cadillac CTS-V, which had a roll cage, suspension stiffened, and higher boost to deal with the higher elevations of the Nurburgring, with the goal being to beat the M3 (which it did by a few secs, but M3 was tested by Sport Auto)
.

I'd like to evidence of this. GM typically runs bone stock cars at the Nurburgring with Sparco seats and a rollcage for crash safety. Otherwise they are bone stock from my understanding. I remember that CTS-V being an automatic model as well. Whatever the case, it usually backed up its performance on the street and in other track tests.


As for the F80/82, wouldn't be surprised to see it in the 7:40's if they did a true all out lap. It seems to be a very quick car.

[krx927]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

On my last lap at the Nurburgring with a stock F10 M5, I got a 7:59 time. Michelin PSS's were used.

You must give me a ride, I might learn something!

[tallshortguy]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

1 second on a two minute lap is huge! Plus the 997 GT3 is 10 years old at this point so not impressive at all unless comparing to the e9x m3.

Why do you have to continually embarrass yourself like this? I will say, I do appreciate you correcting your previous mistake and making a porsche comparison again.

Anyways, the 997 GT3 was DEBUTED in 2006, and revised in 2009/2010. So unless you're using a different calender or just think this is the year 2017 or 2020, no the 997 GT3 Harris was referring to is not "10 years old". For a self proclaimed big porsche fan you sure seem to miss out on a lot of facts about them.

So let me get this straight, you think that the M4 being only 1s slower around a track than a $115k car, that is porsche's flagship track car with more horsepower than the M4, is not impressive? Oh well I guess you know better than Chris Harris and everyone else on the planet.

Well at least we know it's faster than the 991 since the engine would likely catch fire half way through the lap. I think that's something we can both agree on?

[turbo8765]

Originally Posted by See5

I'd like to evidence of this. GM typically runs bone stock cars at the Nurburgring with Sparco seats and a rollcage for crash safety. Otherwise they are bone stock from my understanding. I remember that CTS-V being an automatic model as well. Whatever the case, it usually backed up its performance on the street and in other track tests.


As for the F80/82, wouldn't be surprised to see it in the 7:40's if they did a true all out lap. It seems to be a very quick car.

Most of GM's laps are done stock incl stock seats and no cage.

[jangel]

Originally Posted by tallshortguy

Why do you have to continually embarrass yourself like this? I will say, I do appreciate you correcting your previous mistake and making a porsche comparison again.

Anyways, the 997 GT3 was DEBUTED in 2006, and revised in 2009/2010. So unless you're using a different calender or just think this is the year 2017 or 2020, no the 997 GT3 Harris was referring to is not "10 years old". For a self proclaimed big porsche fan you sure seem to miss out on a lot of facts about them.

So let me get this straight, you think that the M4 being only 1s slower around a track than a $115k car, that is porsche's flagship track car with more horsepower than the M4, is not impressive? Oh well I guess you know better than Chris Harris and everyone else on the planet.

Well at least we know it's faster than the 991 since the engine would likely catch fire half way through the lap. I think that's something we can both agree on?

only 1 thing
the GT3 equipped stock michelin pilot sport cup
the difference in portimao between car with semislick and other with PSS may be 4 seconds as well

[FogCityM3]

Wrong again, at that time that was the only tire available as PS2s weren't made for that size in the very early runs in Europe. So those were showroom floor tires. Subseqent tests of PSS and ZCP at Hockenheim acheive similar times to non ZCP and Sport Cup.

Originally Posted by RPiM5

AH HA!!! So without Pilot Sport Cup tires, what would the time have been then? I thought SportAuto took the cars they test right off the showroom floor? Apparently not! Lol!

[ASAP]

Just an FYI-

Humongous difference between PSS/PS2 and Pilot Sport Cup. The latter aren't even recommended for street driving or adverse / cold weather conditions. Look at the profile of a Pilot Sport Cup.

Sorry but I can't take records done on the following tires for an all out street car... the perf difference is huge.