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      05-21-2014, 12:33 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeFromPA
If the showroom stock F80 m3 matches the e46 m3 CSL, which was basically track prepped and running a DOT track tire, that's just an amazing achievement.

P.s. Bear in mind that there are track prepped e36's that would probably run a 7:50 on the ring today, among other cars that with preparation can do that. To achieve it in a stock everyday car on stock tires is what impresses me.
These track prepped e36s must have a serious power bump to do this. I don't think a 240 hp car at that weight level can run that time.
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      05-21-2014, 12:36 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
I am certain it will be slower than 7:50 , in this article they are just repeating the BMW marketing line about 7:50 because that is 15 seconds faster than the E92 M3 . Lets just wait and see what it actually runs before we start popping champagne corks lol . It might be 7:58 , it might be 7:51 but the super test time is ALWAYS slower than what manufacturers claim . So it's unfair to compare other cars super test times with a quoted time . Just wait a month and we shall see what it is .
That's not manufacturer's claim, BMW never said 7:50. They only said 15s faster in their tests which they never release anyway. Magazine times are slower than factory test times, obviously. BMW doesn't release factory times so I'm not sure what you're getting at. Generally speaking the gap between times of one model over the next is consistent.

Also, the summary says

"Around the Nordschleife both the M3 and M4 have set nearly identical 7:50 times with various drivers."

What part of that is repeating "BMW marketing"? I can't read German and maybe you do so I'm not aware of what part of that article you're referring to that indicates the time is not based on their tests.
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      05-21-2014, 12:40 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
These track prepped e36s must have a serious power bump to do this. I don't think a 240 hp car at that weight level can run that time.
Maybe he means the Euro-spec E36 M3 which came with 321bhp. The neutered 240bhp US version was a waste of a great chassis.
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      05-21-2014, 12:46 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallshortguy
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
I am certain it will be slower than 7:50 , in this article they are just repeating the BMW marketing line about 7:50 because that is 15 seconds faster than the E92 M3 . Lets just wait and see what it actually runs before we start popping champagne corks lol . It might be 7:58 , it might be 7:51 but the super test time is ALWAYS slower than what manufacturers claim . So it's unfair to compare other cars super test times with a quoted time . Just wait a month and we shall see what it is .
That's not manufacturer's claim, BMW never said 7:50. They only said 15s faster in their tests which they never release anyway. Magazine times are slower than factory test times, obviously. BMW doesn't release factory times so I'm not sure what you're getting at. Generally speaking the gap between times of one model over the next is consistent.

Also, the summary says

"Around the Nordschleife both the M3 and M4 have set nearly identical 7:50 times with various drivers."

What part of that is repeating "BMW marketing"? I can't read German and maybe you do so I'm not aware of what part of that article you're referring to that indicates the time is not based on their tests.
BMW also said the M5 did 7:55 in their testing , and it ran a 8:03 Super test time .
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      05-21-2014, 12:47 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
In the same magazine, they celebrate the 200th Supertest (a Porsche 918 Spyder is the 200th test car...).

As part of this they have done some comparisons/statistics on how the cars have evolved. They do a separate story on some brands, and has one article on BMW M3 supertests...

Nürburgring lap times:

E30 M3 - 08:50
E36 M3 SMG - 08:35
E46 M3 - 08:22 (Michelin Pilot Sport)
E46 M3 CSL - 7:50 (Michelin Sport Cup, semi slicks)
E92 M3 - 8:05 (Michelin PSS)
E92 M3 GTS - 07:49 (Pirelli P Zero Corsa)

The very first car to do the Supertest was the E36 M3 in 1997 (they did a Supertest of the E30 in 2010).

They write that considering the tires that was available 17 years ago, the E36 time is very respectable. And that the CSL's tires was awesome in the dry (the first production car to run on semi slicks), but that in the wet they were like playing russian roulet...
Sorry ... but not totally correct - the 2007er Supertest time of the E92 M3 was done with Michelin Sport Cup+ tyres ... definetly an SEMI, specially developed for the BMW E9x M3 - and an Sport Cup with better wet handling performance !!!
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      05-21-2014, 12:49 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
Thanks Boss.

7.50 is right in line with what many of us predicted. The future "ZCP" will be deep into 7.4x.
Note that from what I read in the article, they have not actually tested the cars on the 'ring, they only refer to what various BMW test drivers were able to achieve.
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      05-21-2014, 12:50 PM   #51
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Thanks BOSS for sharing. That was a fun read .

Last edited by CanAutM3; 05-21-2014 at 01:10 PM..
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      05-21-2014, 12:55 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
I believe the E92 M3 GTS achieved a time of 7:48 on PS2 (or perhaps PSS, not sure), right?

CSL was impressive though, given that was ten-plus years ago.
M3 GTS was with Pirelli P-Zero Corsa

http://www.sportauto.de/supertest/bm...88.html?show=4

Last edited by CanAutM3; 05-21-2014 at 01:06 PM..
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      05-21-2014, 12:57 PM   #53
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      05-21-2014, 01:03 PM   #54
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thanks for sharing....but no boost guage in idrive? might have to fast and furious style it on the A pillars (gosh i hope no one does this)

beats m5/6 on nordschleife.....wait for the zcp
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      05-21-2014, 01:06 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT View Post
Sorry ... but not totally correct - the 2007er Supertest time of the E92 M3 was done with Michelin Sport Cup+ tyres ... definetly an SEMI, specially developed for the BMW E9x M3 - and an Sport Cup with better wet handling performance !!!
That's correct, I have edited my post to state Michelin Sport Cup + tires for the E92 M3
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      05-21-2014, 01:07 PM   #56
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Now if only someone took a 1M on PSS tires around. haha
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      05-21-2014, 01:09 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
BMW also said the M5 did 7:55 in their testing , and it ran a 8:03 Super test time .
And like I said, factory times are almost always faster than magazine times. BMW has not released times for the new M4/3, just that it's 15s faster than their e9x M3 factory tests. iirc sport auto tested the old M3 at 8:05. Thus if the gap is consistent then that's how people got 7:50, an entirely feasible number.
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      05-21-2014, 01:10 PM   #58
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Takk for artikkelen. Har du bestilt bil?
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      05-21-2014, 01:11 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by milhouse View Post
Takk for artikkelen. Har du bestilt bil?
Nei...
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      05-21-2014, 01:16 PM   #60
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its good for a "turbo engine" . i guess when the engine goes turbo everyone gives it a handicap.
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      05-21-2014, 01:21 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3guy3 View Post
its good for a "turbo engine" . i guess when the engine goes turbo everyone gives it a handicap.
agree...i've asked before what these types of comments really mean?

can't they just say, "there is turbo lag" ?
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      05-21-2014, 01:21 PM   #62
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Just added this part to my OP (also from the AS review):

"That the new M3/4 has been developed on the Nürbrurgring is easily detectable on the topographically challenging track here in Spain. While other cars struggle with a unstable rear end over the crests and undulations, the new M3/4 convinces with it's balance and agility. There is no malice from the car driving on the limit"
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      05-21-2014, 01:24 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
agree...i've asked before what these types of comments really mean?

can't they just say, "there is turbo lag" ?
Why should they? Every turbo engine has lag in some sort. Just saying it has lag would be like saying the manual transmission version has a clutch pedal
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      05-21-2014, 01:25 PM   #64
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BOSS!! Great read! I am not reading anything else until après June 23!
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      05-21-2014, 01:26 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
BMW also said the M5 did 7:55 in their testing , and it ran a 8:03 Super test time .
The M5 did a 8:05 Supertest time.

I have not read that BMW claimed a 7:55 time anywhere? Do you have a link or source for that claim?

BMW usually don't go public with Nürburgring lap time...
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      05-21-2014, 01:29 PM   #66
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Hmmm, well on this note I am keeping my Dakar E92 and picking up a SO M4. Query solved.



Quote:
Originally Posted by V1.47fan View Post
That's right, only praises...

For a turbo car it sounds good but compared to the S655, it doesnt sound that bad, for a turbo car, throttle response is great but compared to the S65, it's not that bad.

For a comedienne Sandra Bernard looks great but compared to Bar Rafaeli, She doesnt look that bad.

Glowing reviews.
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