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      11-19-2017, 10:58 AM   #1
Rangerrotty
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Accident in Carfax history

I am interested in a nicely optioned 2016 M3 with just under 25,000 miles being sold by a "local" BMW dealer. My question is, with all things being equal to a car without an accident on the Carfax, what impact to the sale price does that make? 5%, 10%, other? I assume all the damage was repaired, but I have not seen the car in person yet.

Here is what the Carfax says:

Accident reported
Involving front impact
It hit a tree
Vehicle ran off road
Front primarily damaged
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      11-19-2017, 11:07 AM   #2
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I wouldn't buy this car
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      11-19-2017, 11:10 AM   #3
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Determining the impact to MSRP is going to depend on the buyer. I personally would never buy any car that has been in an accident. This accident appears to be somewhat significant. I would use that to your advantage and ask for a substantial discount. If they say no; who cares. Walk out and tell them to call you in a month when it is still sitting there.
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      11-19-2017, 11:25 AM   #4
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Dude, hitting a tree is no joke.

There's almost 100% shit wrong with the engine that hasn't surfaced yet.
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      11-19-2017, 11:32 AM   #5
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Don't be too desperate to get any car.
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      11-19-2017, 11:45 AM   #6
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Surprised it wasn't a write off.
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      11-19-2017, 11:58 AM   #7
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Agree with others in that I wouldn't buy it. However to answer your question, I think the price impact should be more than 5% - 10% unless really minor with proof it is really minor. I'd think more like 20% - 25%, possibly more for a major accident like the one this car sounds like it was in.
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      11-19-2017, 12:17 PM   #8
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Carfax accident will affect the market value. This vehicle should be priced on the lower end of the range against vehicles with comparable equipment and mileage. Do research, have the car inspected privately, etc. I wouldn't go in haggling the dealer on price if you haven't done your homework.
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      11-19-2017, 12:19 PM   #9
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Never ever ever buy a car with a record... insurance companies scam people and give loss of value claims of $1k... lol

The car automatically loses 5-10k based on perception alone, and that is if you are lucky enough to find a buyer... are you sure you want to be that buyer and always deal with that record?
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      11-19-2017, 01:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerrotty View Post
I am interested in a nicely optioned 2016 M3 with just under 25,000 miles being sold by a "local" BMW dealer. My question is, with all things being equal to a car without an accident on the Carfax, what impact to the sale price does that make? 5%, 10%, other? I assume all the damage was repaired, but I have not seen the car in person yet.

Here is what the Carfax says:

Accident reported
Involving front impact
It hit a tree
Vehicle ran off road
Front primarily damaged
I wouldn't come near that car with a 10 foot pole!
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      11-19-2017, 01:55 PM   #11
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I wouldn't buy this car either but let's be logical here :

If u want an M3 to daily drive and you are on limited budget this car may be a good opportunity to negotiate a significant discount.

Second, there are many good cars that have had minor accidents that are still worth buying. Think about a small and documented accident to the rear bumper that was repaired at a reputable shop and the owner can provide pictures pre-repair.
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      11-19-2017, 02:10 PM   #12
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this is why you lease a car, cuz if you buy, and you get in an accident, carfax will kill the value. Great for buyers, not so great if your selling.
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      11-19-2017, 02:35 PM   #13
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$10,000 less than whatever the dealer is selling it for
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      11-19-2017, 02:51 PM   #14
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I agree with others. That accident seems serious. Now, it could just be that it was a light accident, but based on that description, it's scary enough to avoid it. Think of how many here are being put off by it.

Now if somehow you find it was a light accident where, say, only the bumper hood an radiator were involved, I would not worry about it, but I still would ask for a steep discount because that will be a VERY hard car to sell later on.
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      11-19-2017, 03:16 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerrotty View Post
I am interested in a nicely optioned 2016 M3 with just under 25,000 miles being sold by a "local" BMW dealer. My question is, with all things being equal to a car without an accident on the Carfax, what impact to the sale price does that make? 5%, 10%, other? I assume all the damage was repaired, but I have not seen the car in person yet.

Here is what the Carfax says:

Accident reported
Involving front impact
It hit a tree
Vehicle ran off road
Front primarily damaged
Hereís reality.

The problem with Carfax is that it does not list how serious the damage was.

That could be anything from a minor bumper impact to major issue.

And quite frankly, thatís more info than you typically get from Carfax.

I had a driver rear end me recently at a very slow speed....certainly less than 10MPH

It put a minor scratch on the bumper that could have been solved for less than $400 if BMW Specs did not require a new Bumper if painting or repair near lane change warning sensors.

As the other driver was ticketed, it shows on CarFax as a rear end collision.

Yours could be just as minor.

However, after discussing it with the Used Car Manager at a BMW Dealership (who clued me into Carfax Issues) he says the buyers at Auto Auction punch in a VIN and just see a Carfax reported accident and donít bid. They do not have the time to get into damage reports at the pace of an auction.

He estimated that my car would bring in $3000 less at auction because of the CarFax report.

And thatís the issue with CarFax Reports

BTW, I had a Viper that I had to sue Chrysler for non-payment of Warranty work. After 4 years of the court system and a Viper sitting undrivable, they were order by a Court to buy it back.

They sold it to a Chrysler Dealer and never disclosed it was a Buyback. Dealership called me to answer some questions about alarm system. Was upset he called because he then had to disclose.

Ran a CarFax on VIN 3 years later.

Reported Clean....no issues.
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      11-19-2017, 03:25 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kabrichx View Post
Hereís reality.

The problem with Carfax is that it does not list how serious the damage was.

That could be anything from a minor bumper impact to major issue.

And quite frankly, thatís more info than you typically get from Carfax.

I had a driver rear end me recently at a very slow speed....certainly less than 10MPH

It put a minor scratch on the bumper that could have been solved for less than $400 if BMW Specs did not require a new Bumper if painting or repair near lane change warning sensors.

As the other driver was ticketed, it shows on CarFax as a rear end collision.

Yours could be just as minor.

However, after discussing it with the Used Car Manager at a BMW Dealership (who clued me into Carfax Issues) he says the buyers at Auto Auction punch in a VIN and just see a Carfax reported accident and donít bid. They do not have the time to get into damage reports at the pace of an auction.

He estimated that my car would bring in $3000 less at auction because of the CarFax report.

And thatís the issue with CarFax Reports

BTW, I had a Viper that I had to sue Chrysler for non-payment of Warranty work. After 4 years of the court system and a Viper sitting undrivable, they were order by a Court to buy it back.

They sold it to a Chrysler Dealer and never disclosed it was a Buyback. Dealership called me to answer some questions about alarm system. Was upset he called because he then had to disclose.

Ran a CarFax on VIN 3 years later.

Reported Clean....no issues.
Morale of the story, don't believe Carfax.
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      11-19-2017, 03:30 PM   #17
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You have to assume worst case scenario with CarFax unless there is clear evidence otherwise and that typically only happens if it is a private party sale. Even then you have to discount because you will eventually need to resell.

Dealers play both sides. Crucify you on trade in for any CarFax blemish and then try to downplay any blemishes when selling. Assume worst case with dealers too.
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      11-19-2017, 05:19 PM   #18
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so many cars out there why bother
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      11-19-2017, 06:16 PM   #19
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I bought a BMW CPO that had CarFax disclosed accident before being CPO certified by the BMW dealer. They bought it cheap, I’m sure, at auction. It looked great and seemed fine mechanically, plus with the CPO (and less than 20k miles on it) I felt assured I could drive it to 100k miles without too much expense. The price they were asking was about 20% or so below comparable vehicles (same make, model, year, mileage).

Well I had some problems show up after a putting on some miles. CPO was critical to getting it all resolved - being still under the original warranty helped as well. The accident didn’t cause or have anything to do with the problems, but it did affect the value.

Before getting the issue resolved with the BMW dealer, I considered trading the car. One BMW dealer refused to make any offer for the car! The local other German car dealer offered me 30% below what I had paid just a few months earlier (and that was over 20% below comparable cars, recall). Point being, with that brand on the CarFax you had better be sure you are going to own it and drive it to get your money’s worth or be prepared to find few if any takers when you want to unload it.

Fortunately my issues were resolved to my satisfaction by the selling BMW dealer. I enjoy a great relationship with them, and have bought several cars from them, all of which helps.
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      11-19-2017, 07:39 PM   #20
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I agree partially not to touch a car with carfax record but it all depends on the damage and how it was repaired, front end damage could be more dangerous but a rear end collision resulting in bumper damage is perfectly fine to buy and the car would loose around 3k value. I found this out with my car with the trade in value received from dealers and had a minor rear end accident. I was thinking of trading in the car with a new CP but later thought that.my car is in excellent condition and CP is not worth it basically being the same car.

In a yr or two these cars would appreciate given M3 production would stop and unless the car was in a big accident they are safe to buy
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      11-19-2017, 07:57 PM   #21
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As others have said a tree is no joke. BUT..... that doesn't mean the car should be out.

Take a look at the car and if the price seems discounted appropriately then bring it to a mechanic and get a better idea as to what happened. Even if its on your own dime you can wind up with a great car (especially if you don't track) at a very discounted cost.

Also if you intend to hold on to the car for a few years and get an appreciable warranty you can easily come out ahead. These cars tank in depreciation and so the margin between say your car and another of similar miles could only be 5k tops when the car itself is worth 25-30k at 5 years. This is assuming you vetted the car and have a good warranty to address problems that can and will arise (keep in mind clean cars have their share of problems too). Then 5 years down the road you end up ahead of all of us. Of course if you are going to flip the car in a year all bets are off.
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      11-20-2017, 02:32 AM   #22
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Its true. Do not always trust CarFax as it can be wrong, I know from personal experience.

My 3er was re-sprayed through insurance. I told my insurance multiple times it is not accident related and just purely road damage/severe rock chips hence why I was doing it. I told them and they told me it would be under comprehensive, thus not show up as damage.

Surprise, surprise about half a year later as I was in the process of selling the 3er. It showed up on CarFax as Damaged. I have paperwork to prove otherwise however it is always on CarFax. CarMax told me they know it isn't damaged because of the body structure wasn't fixed but it was reported so they cannot do anything about it. The hilarious thing about this is, it wasn't on CarFax report 3 months prior, so it showed up after. I don't know why.

Do not always trust CarFax. It doesn't give you enough information. It isn't good enough most of the time. However if the car is truly REALLY damaged aka it was written off by Insurance for certain, don't buy it.
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