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      11-29-2017, 05:06 PM   #45
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      11-29-2017, 05:15 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
That's interesting, but I have had my previous m3 bolsters crack and tear after use. My nappa on the c63 also started to wear and dry l until I applied conditioner to stop it from further damage.
I have a 'vert and drive with the top down every day and haven't cleaned my interior in 3 years. six times / day I smash and slide sideways over the left drivers bolster. there is zero wear, cracking, fading, or any issue whatsoever.

Nor have I ever had a leather problem with any BMW or Audi in 20 years.

What the fuck are you doing to your leather?
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      11-29-2017, 06:04 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
I have a 'vert and drive with the top down every day and haven't cleaned my interior in 3 years. six times / day I smash and slide sideways over the left drivers bolster. there is zero wear, cracking, fading, or any issue whatsoever.

Nor have I ever had a leather problem with any BMW or Audi in 20 years.

What the fuck are you doing to your leather?
I like the things I own to be pristine, but I'll put my money where my mouth is-

How many miles is your car? Mine is about at 30k miles, if your drivers seat is in better condition than mine, I'll buy you a steak dinner.

I'm at Ruth's Chris in Pasadena tonite, or another nite in the OC, let me know.

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      11-29-2017, 06:06 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
That's interesting, but I have had my previous m3 bolsters crack and tear after use. My nappa on the c63 also started to wear and dry l until I applied conditioner to stop it from further damage.
The painted top coat can tear/crease and degrade through wear and in contact with abrasive materials such as denim jeans, rivets on pockets seams etc..

If you bounce your back side into the bolster every time you get into the car the the painted leather will crack and tear under the stress.

But hey it's your car and your money, so if it makes you happy to buy a product then good for you.

I have an 11 year old Z4c with very soft individual nappa leather that I've owned from new, the leather has always been cleaned but never conditioned (because you can't condition a painted leather as you'll never get to the leather) and it's as soft as the day I bought the car.
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      11-29-2017, 06:14 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wills2 View Post
The painted top coat can tear/crease and degrade through wear and in contact with abrasive materials such as denim jeans, rivets on pockets seams etc..

If you bounce your back side into the bolster every time you get into the car the the painted leather will crack and tear under the stress.

But hey it's your car and your money, so if it makes you happy to buy a product then good for you.

I have an 11 year old Z4c with very soft individual nappa leather that I've owned from new, the leather has always been cleaned but never conditioned (because you can't condition a painted leather as you'll never get to the leather) and it's as soft as the day I bought the car.
My wife's '15 GS350 F sport with the sport buckets with 27k miles is showing wear and issues on the drivers side bolsters at 27k miles. She's not as particular as I am, so she doesn't care.

I've experienced with a lot of company leased bmw's before in my past life and they were all not taken care of and the leather bolsters were all worn after 3 years of driving.

Seeing just the number of threads discussing leather wear should tell you all you need to know.
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      11-30-2017, 12:38 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
I like the things I own to be pristine, but I'll put my money where my mouth is-

How many miles is your car? Mine is about at 30k miles, if your drivers seat is in better condition than mine, I'll buy you a steak dinner.

I'm at Ruth's Chris in Pasadena tonite, or another nite in the OC, let me know.

sah-WEET! I'll take a few pics in the morning.

I'm not in the OC this week but next time I am I'll settle for drinks and poke outside at Las Brisas in Laguna Beach.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      11-30-2017, 01:19 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
sah-WEET! I'll take a few pics in the morning.

I'm not in the OC this week but next time I am I'll settle for drinks and poke outside at Las Brisas in Laguna Beach.
sure man, no problem.

I took one before sundown. Check out my bolsters- beat this!

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Mileage: 29,929

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Views: 230
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Last edited by dkhm3; 11-30-2017 at 01:40 AM.
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      11-30-2017, 02:05 AM   #52
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Here is a close up of my wife's gs350 f sport seats (untreated) shot with an iphone with flash- you can see the leather is starting to tear by the seams, nevermind the number of cracks:

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This is a picture of my 30,000 mile m3 driver side bolster (treated) with an iphone and flash:

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Here's her passenger side bolster (untreated) to compare how similar her nappa leather texture is to our m3 and what it looked like with less wear:

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This is her mileage which is less than mine:

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Last edited by dkhm3; 11-30-2017 at 02:49 AM.
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      11-30-2017, 06:46 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
sure man, no problem.

I took one before sundown. Check out my bolsters- beat this!

Attachment 1729900

Attachment 1729902

Mileage: 29,929

Attachment 1729901
Yes...
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      11-30-2017, 07:43 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Encanto View Post
Yes...
Hey man, my ocd helped me retire at 39 with constant revenue, never touching my savings.

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      11-30-2017, 07:54 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
Hey man, my ocd helped me retire at 39 with constant revenue, never touching my savings.

I donít know what that has to do with shiny seats but cool story, bro...
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      11-30-2017, 08:15 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Encanto View Post
I donít know what that has to do with shiny seats but cool story, bro...
I never kid about money.

Did u have something to say about seats?
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      11-30-2017, 08:33 AM   #57
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Quote:
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I never kid about money.

Did u have something to say about seats?
Shiny leather looks bad. Thatís all.
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      11-30-2017, 08:41 AM   #58
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Quote:
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Shiny leather looks bad. Thatís all.
Go to post #29.
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      11-30-2017, 09:21 AM   #59
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i'd just use the opportunity to justify a cheeky m performance v2 swap
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      11-30-2017, 12:52 PM   #60
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Always clean and condition your leather. Any leather. Even your couch. Don't be lazy.
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      11-30-2017, 02:57 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
Here is a close up of my wife's gs350 f sport seats (untreated) shot with an iphone with flash- you can see the leather is starting to tear by the seams, nevermind the number of cracks:
i'll get my pics in a bit but ....

I don't see any 'cracks', I see normal creases which is desirable to me, and I also don't see any tears or anything starting to tear.

Are you thinking the leather should never crease? Because if so, that's called "fabric". Leather is supposed to crease like your skin, which is what makes it soft and supple and desirable. Non-creased leather is fundamentally not "broken in" and unyielding.

Seems like you want leather to behave like fabric which is the opposite of why you get leather.

Great leather, like on a coat or a couch, should have a patina and be creased, feeling butter smooth to the touch.

Auto leather will likely never have that because it's not analine, still creasing should be desirable.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      11-30-2017, 03:05 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
i'll get my pics in a bit but ....

I don't see any 'cracks', I see normal creases which is desirable to me, and I also don't see any tears or anything starting to tear.

Are you thinking the leather should never crease? Because if so, that's called "fabric". Leather is supposed to crease like your skin, which is what makes it soft and supple and desirable. Non-creased leather is fundamentally not "broken in" and unyielding.

Seems like you want leather to behave like fabric which is the opposite of why you get leather.

Great leather, like on a coat or a couch, should have a patina and be creased, feeling butter smooth to the touch.

Auto leather will likely never have that because it's not analine, still creasing should be desirable.
Exactly, like a good pair of tits.

Soft, supple. No sag, no tears. Well used and oiled on occasion.
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      11-30-2017, 03:27 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
i'll get my pics in a bit but ....

I don't see any 'cracks', I see normal creases which is desirable to me, and I also don't see any tears or anything starting to tear.

Are you thinking the leather should never crease? Because if so, that's called "fabric". Leather is supposed to crease like your skin, which is what makes it soft and supple and desirable. Non-creased leather is fundamentally not "broken in" and unyielding.

Seems like you want leather to behave like fabric which is the opposite of why you get leather.

Great leather, like on a coat or a couch, should have a patina and be creased, feeling butter smooth to the touch.

Auto leather will likely never have that because it's not analine, still creasing should be desirable.
Exactly, like a good pair of tits.

Soft, supple. No sag, no tears. Well used and oiled on occasion.
Now you're speaking Gruss' language
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      11-30-2017, 03:51 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by dkhm3 View Post
Exactly, like a good pair of tits.

Soft, supple. No sag, no tears. Well used and oiled on occasion.
I think we probably disagree on what good leather should look like. Here's some analine leather furniture that to me is very high quality and butter smooth. You can also see the color variation as it's dyed not painted like our auto leather, i.e., it's higher quality analine

Ideally this is what my auto seats should look like, but I'm off leather and would rather have fabric







Also, this is what leather cracking (bad) looks like versus above and your pictures which is desirable leather creasing

Plus this is super cheap leather - the painted surface coat should never do this and you can see how in the pics above this would never happen (nor in any of the pics you posted)

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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.

Last edited by GrussGott; 11-30-2017 at 04:09 PM.
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      11-30-2017, 05:20 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
I think we probably disagree on what good leather should look like. Here's some analine leather furniture that to me is very high quality and butter smooth. You can also see the color variation as it's dyed not painted like our auto leather, i.e., it's higher quality analine

Ideally this is what my auto seats should look like, but I'm off leather and would rather have fabric
Ditto. My past 5 cars had leather. It was fun, but man the carbonstructure feels great and you don't slide around. And it's cheaper!! So long as it isn't mouse fur, high quality cloth is my new preference. And I used to HATE HATE HATE cloth!
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      11-30-2017, 07:56 PM   #66
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Quote:
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I think we probably disagree on what good leather should look like.
You're right. I am meticulous in keeping things clean and pristine for my things-

I try to keep things like they were when I bought the car, good for the next guy, except i stomp the gas a lot.

Anyways, always down for you to cover the poke and drinks.

btw, if people think bmw nappa leather is matte, see x5m bmw pic:

Name:  IMG_2241.JPG
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