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      05-25-2013, 01:18 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dantm3 View Post
So the last e46 m3 in 2006 has a base price msrp 48900.00 and the 2008 e90 has a base price msrp 53800 and coupe was 56600.00. So the MSRP jumped 10% almost exactly to the sedan and 15% for coupe... they will include more standard features too normally... so if final 2011 e90 was roughly 55900.00 if pricing stays consistent in model jump we are looking at 10% increase to roughly 61490.00 for sedan and 64350 for coupe
Excellent analysis, IMHO.
However, on the MSRP pricing of the M4, 15% of the base MSRP of e92 is about $9,000 (60,100 x .15). That would put the base MSRP of the M4 at about $69,000, wouldn't it? I'm never really sure of my math.
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      05-25-2013, 01:32 PM   #24
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Solstice numbers are not unreasonable. If you build a 2013 e92 M3 on the BMWUSA web site, you will be 70k+ without some of the more expensive options. It's reasonable to believe the new M3/M4 will command a premium over the current models. 5-10% based on the e90/f30 335i pricing
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      05-25-2013, 02:16 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhoggm3 View Post
I don't count the RS5 as an F80 competitor due to cramped interior room. RS6 would be more comparable, and then the price is stratospheric. S6 is so much heavier...

You see my conundrum. I'm still waiting for the F80.
You don't have to count the RS5 as an F80/F82 competitor, but it is. They're similar class vehicles. You might argue that the RS5 has a bit less space than the F82 will (.. not sure how we know this) but the A6/S6/whatever are in a completely different class that competes with the 5 series.
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      05-25-2013, 05:43 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhoggm3 View Post
I don't count the RS5 as an F80 competitor due to cramped interior room. RS6 would be more comparable, and then the price is stratospheric. S6 is so much heavier...

You see my conundrum. I'm still waiting for the F80.
RS4 vs. F80, RS5 vs. F82...it makes sense...
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      05-25-2013, 11:30 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhoggm3 View Post
I don't count the RS5 as an F80 competitor due to cramped interior room. RS6 would be more comparable, and then the price is stratospheric. S6 is so much heavier...

You see my conundrum. I'm still waiting for the F80.
I don't quite get your rational

IMO:

A3 = 1 series
A4 = 3 series
A5 = 3 series coupe or 4 series
A6 = 5 series
A7 = 6 GC
A8 = 7 series

So the RS4 is the E90/F80 M3 competitor and the RS5 is the E92/93 M3 / M4 competitor... RS6 is the M5 competitor, No?
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      05-26-2013, 07:14 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mak135i View Post
Solstice numbers are not unreasonable.
Not for a base price, which is what the people who were replying to him had assumed he meant until he clarified in a later post.

When comparing car prices it is typical to use base prices or prices for similarly equipped vehicles. Since we can't do the latter yet, base prices are probably the least confusing and ambiguous for the sake of discussion.

Of course, we can still keep in mind that the new car will have standard equipment that the old one did not such as IDrive (like pretty much all BMWs do now, except 1/2 Series). EDC may very well be standard on the new cars as well, but I would not bet on that yet. The DCT transmission could also become standard with the manual being a no-cost option. But again I am not ready to call that either way. However if all of these things do become standard, a near-$70k base price for an F80 M3 makes even more sense. That is at least $5k in options for the E9x (hard to say exactly since you can't get IDrive without navigation for E9x).
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      05-26-2013, 09:09 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
...... if all of these things do become standard, a near-$70k base price for an F80 M3 makes even more sense.
Which would would make the ED base invoice around $60k.
Hey, we got this whole thing figured out already!
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      05-26-2013, 10:03 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
I don't quite get your rational

IMO:

A3 = 1 series
A4 = 3 series
A5 = 3 series coupe or 4 series
A6 = 5 series
A7 = 6 GC
A8 = 7 series

So the RS4 is the E90/F80 M3 competitor and the RS5 is the E92/93 M3 / M4 competitor... RS6 is the M5 competitor, No?
I understand that's been the traditional pairing. I use the car for business and for hauling two, 6'+ teenagers around. The additional rear seat room of the new 3-series is a game changer for me and for those like me. It puts this lightweight, better-handling vehicle in a position to compete with the A6.
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      05-26-2013, 10:42 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhoggm3 View Post
I understand that's been the traditional pairing. I use the car for business and for hauling two, 6'+ teenagers around. The additional rear seat room of the new 3-series is a game changer for me and for those like me. It puts this lightweight, better-handling vehicle in a position to compete with the A6.
Goddamit.

The A4 = 3er. A5 = 3 coupe. A6 = 5er.

The 3 series can't compete with the A6. The A4 competes with the 3er. There is no RS4 in 'murica.

If you look at it this way, the A4 and A5 share the same platform -- B8. Just as the F30 and F32 are. Jesus...

If anything, S4>335i. (Nappa leather, LSD, etc.)
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      05-26-2013, 12:50 PM   #32
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hi in the last issue of the german car magazine "autobild" they report about the M4.
according to the magazine the M4 will be about 69.500 € in germany so just 1000 more than the E92 coupe
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      05-26-2013, 01:04 PM   #33
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M4 will be between the M3 and M5, a $95,000
M4 would be more expensive than the M5 which has a twin turbo V8. I would guess starting price would be in low to mid $60,000
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      05-27-2013, 11:44 AM   #34
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Cussing brings credibility. Obviously you're right.
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      05-27-2013, 06:49 PM   #35
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BMW's market share dropped 2% this year, mite not seem like much but it moved then from #1 to #2 in Brand Value, i dont think the price is going to be much different then the current M3, also Turbo inline 6 isnt that new to them, a lot more power in this configuration yes, but not the concept, so there is not that much reason to think there going to jack the price up significantly.
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      05-28-2013, 08:41 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibmike View Post
BMW's market share dropped 2% this year, mite not seem like much but it moved then from #1 to #2 in Brand Value, i dont think the price is going to be much different then the current M3, also Turbo inline 6 isnt that new to them, a lot more power in this configuration yes, but not the concept, so there is not that much reason to think there going to jack the price up significantly.
In my mind it´s huge jump to raise red line 7000rpm to ~7800-7900rpm, that reveal in my mind that there will be bigger crank and rod bearings(like S54), watercooled IC, differend cams to allow peak power higher rpm´s, maybe forged pistons and cylinder head which flow better, but we will see, that just speculation.
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      05-28-2013, 09:00 AM   #37
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Don't forget that you likely won't have a $1300 gas guzzler tax with the new M3/M4. That is straight money in your pocket. At least I would sure hope the I6 gets them under that mpg limit.
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      05-28-2013, 11:10 AM   #38
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I talked to the Head service manager today at the local BMW dealer by me and he said he wouldn't advise buying the first model year of the new M3/M4.
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      05-28-2013, 12:28 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ibmike
I talked to the Head service manager today at the local BMW dealer by me and he said he wouldn't advise buying the first model year of the new M3/M4.
Did he share any further details as to why?
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      05-28-2013, 01:32 PM   #40
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People often give the advice to avoid the first year of a car (or other product for that matter) because there are typically updates released later to address shortcomings with the original that were not included in the initial release due to insufficient time. Also, issues and flaws are often found and corrected.

Not only does a service manager have no specific knowledge about the F8x that isn't already public and available in this forum, but s/he also is tasked specifically with selling you inventory that actually exist, and that certainly does not include future products that dealerships do not even have official information about yet. And I say that not to disparage anyone, but just to lay the facts out on the table.

So, my advice to anyone considering the new M3/M4 is to stick to Bimmerpost for the most current information. If there are solid reasons to avoid early cars, you will know about it here first, and it will be impossible to miss such news if it comes to pass.
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      05-28-2013, 02:07 PM   #41
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My F10 was a very early build, one of the first ED slots in 2010. Did it have issues? You bet ya. Did it miss out on some nice added features? Yup, combox for example. Does this discourage me from buying an early M3? Nope.

I luckily got out of the F10 after just six months due to a buyback. I say luckily becuase it was such a disappointment in pretty much every "fun to drive" area compared to my many other BMWs. Issues I can handle since BMW is very good at dealing with them, what I'm concerned about is driving dynamics and the lately elusive "fun to drive" factor.

I really hope that the F80 will be given to auto journalists way in the advance of the official start of production so that we can get a good idea of what it is like to drive. I do think it will be uber awesome. The M3 is the essence of BMW and the M-division has some reputation to repair. There is a good size pool of both F10 incl M5 and F30 buyers who are not finding the car they want and the M3 can be the "collector" of these potential brand strays. A lot is at stake and I expect a superb car.

Last edited by solstice; 05-28-2013 at 02:12 PM.
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      06-12-2013, 05:11 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rconti View Post
They can charge whatever they want for the carbon ceramic brakes, they're still gonna be a colossal waste of money unless you're getting paid for your laptimes (which nobody buying a street M3/M4 is).
I don't think you've driven a vehicle with CC brakes on the street. I played around with a couple 911s, back to back, with CCB and with steel. A particularly rough section of road in western NC was unsettling the steel braked car, while the CBB 911 sailed through. I asked the salesman if there was a suspension difference, he replied "no, the lighter brakes rebound much better from the huge loss of unsprung weight."

This also translates to more efficient acceleration, as the rotating mass is reduced. I'm not sure where I heard it but 1lb of unsprung weight converts to 3 times sprung weight.
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      06-16-2013, 11:12 PM   #43
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If they price it high, then it better be more powerful and torquey than the GTR. Based on the engine choices and hp numbers we know it will not beat godzilla. So if they care at all about the US M3/M4 market (and they do) then it will be priced significantly less than the GTR.
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      06-17-2013, 06:40 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsweet View Post
If they price it high, then it better be more powerful and torquey than the GTR. Based on the engine choices and hp numbers we know it will not beat godzilla. So if they care at all about the US M3/M4 market (and they do) then it will be priced significantly less than the GTR.
Naturally, it won't come near the price of a comparably equipped M5 so there is no danger of it coming near the price of a GTR either.
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