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      07-12-2013, 05:56 AM   #67
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Thanks to BMW delivering one disappointment after another. I am not so sure if I have the same enthusiasm any more. I am glad that I can at least see that they retained the hood bulge.
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      07-12-2013, 09:00 AM   #68
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Exhaust note

People all seem to be harping on the fact that the new M's motor won't sound sporty enough or "loud" enough for their tastes.

The I6 is a nice sounding motor, and there are typically lot of aftermarket exhaust options to make the car as obnoxiously loud as you want. I remember when the E36M3 came out, there was a wave of aftermarket exhaust purchases, followed shortly thereafter by a wave of very inexpensive, slightly used aftermarket exhaust sales as wives and girlfriends across the country reinforced a more pragmatic view. I was single and driving my E36 on tracks a lot, and I bought a slightly used B&B triflow for $200 from a guy who was selling *three* different exhausts that he had tried, all of which were too loud to live with. It was OK for me alone, but annoying (almost a bit embarrassing) those few occasions when the car was loaded with three guests. Not so cool for double date night if you had to drive

"Hey, it sounds like you could use a new muffler."

"Er, this IS a new muffler."

Yes the V8 has a note that a 6 can't match. I still remember the awesome wail of the GTRs when they ran, but the 6s have a music all their own. I'm getting ready to bolt a Corsa onto my own I-6. (though I'm also eyeing a used E90M as an upgrade after they depreciate next year).

At least we're not driving Toyotas
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      07-12-2013, 09:38 AM   #69
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I would understand BMW's decision to go back to I6 if all competitors did the same but guess what the new AMG and RS5 are still V8s!!

BMW has to realize that we all know that this new car will handle better than all competitors, but they have to understand that only 10% of people will track their cars and worry about that 0.4 seconds, most people just want a fun car on the road that has its own stand and sound.
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      07-12-2013, 12:08 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
Yes the V8 has a note that a 6 can't match. I still remember the awesome wail of the GTRs when they ran, but the 6s have a music all their own. I'm getting ready to bolt a Corsa onto my own I-6. (though I'm also eyeing a used E90M as an upgrade after they depreciate next year).

At least we're not driving Toyotas
The GTR had a flat plane crankshaft P65 engine, unlike the cross plane crank of the S65 engine. Same as a Ferrari V8 has, and why a Ferrari 458 does NOT sound like your regular V8...

To me (as a European) I'm glad BMW went with a cross bank exhaust on the M5 so it doesn't sound just like any other V8. The S65 sounds really great and will be a hard act to follow, but IMHO there is something about BMW and straight sixes.

Classic M cars have been straight six engines, incl. M1, 1M, E36 M3, E46 M3, E28 M5, E34 M5. To me the BMW straight six has a great sound and I'm sure (or at least hope ) the next M3/M4 will sound better in person than it does on videos taken with simple cams and poor microphones...
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      07-12-2013, 07:34 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transfer View Post
lol. BMW's turbo engines might not have much throttle lag, but in comparison to my M3, they have minutes of lag. And we're not talking about just stoplight racing but at speed when you stab the throttle of the M3, it instantly changes power to the ground. Go ahead and drive one and coast at 40mph in 2nd gear then stab the throttle and watch what happens. I guarantee you the turbos don't do that. BMW might pull some magic on the new M3/4 with an electric turbo, but for now, the turbos have some lag in comparison to the E9x M3.

I'm sure this new M will be a fast car but it won't share the same driving dynamics and emotion of past generations.
I agree with you about the instant throttle response of the NA cars. However, there is nothing wrong with the driving dynamics or emotions of my 1M. Instant throttle response can't hide the extra 300 lbs that the E9x M3 is carrying.
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      07-12-2013, 09:11 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wisesoul View Post
I hope this was sarcastic lol, the E46 M3 had an I6 and a power dome. It was never for clearance back then, it looks badass.
The powerdome was for clearance due to the bigger intake manifold with individual throttle bodies.
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      07-12-2013, 10:29 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jblack4083 View Post
The powerdome was for clearance due to the bigger intake manifold with individual throttle bodies.
Hmm, doesn't make sense. The engine sits nicely under the strut tower bar (which itself isn't protruding from the engine bay at all) with plenty of intake manifold clearance.
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      07-12-2013, 11:51 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
People all seem to be harping on the fact that the new M's motor won't sound sporty enough or "loud" enough for their tastes.

The I6 is a nice sounding motor, and there are typically lot of aftermarket exhaust options to make the car as obnoxiously loud as you want. I remember when the E36M3 came out, there was a wave of aftermarket exhaust purchases, followed shortly thereafter by a wave of very inexpensive, slightly used aftermarket exhaust sales as wives and girlfriends across the country reinforced a more pragmatic view. I was single and driving my E36 on tracks a lot, and I bought a slightly used B&B triflow for $200 from a guy who was selling *three* different exhausts that he had tried, all of which were too loud to live with. It was OK for me alone, but annoying (almost a bit embarrassing) those few occasions when the car was loaded with three guests. Not so cool for double date night if you had to drive

"Hey, it sounds like you could use a new muffler."

"Er, this IS a new muffler."

Yes the V8 has a note that a 6 can't match. I still remember the awesome wail of the GTRs when they ran, but the 6s have a music all their own. I'm getting ready to bolt a Corsa onto my own I-6. (though I'm also eyeing a used E90M as an upgrade after they depreciate next year).

At least we're not driving Toyotas
I know someone who has always had both. And when that person absolutely must get there no ifs or buts because $$$ is at stake (job related reasons) guess which keys said person grabs? Yeah love BMWs, but with my previous M3, and my current E92 for most of its first 3/4 of its life atleast... word reliable doesn't even come close to discribing them; So until proven different I will still own something else along with my BMWs.
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      07-14-2013, 12:05 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rioter
Quote:
Originally Posted by James T. Kirk View Post
I admire your optimism, but there's also the inevitable turbo lag that may plague this next generation.
.


Ahh yes. It may be plagued with the same nonexistent turbo lag that their existing turbocharged engines suffer from.
Uhh. Next time in your car: depress throttle ever so slightly, wait and feel for that sudden surge of torque that is not instantaneous. That sir is turbo lag. You must recalibrate your butt.

IT EXISTS.
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      07-14-2013, 12:09 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcva View Post
Yes the V8 has a note that a 6 can't match. I still remember the awesome wail of the GTRs when they ran, but the 6s have a music all their own. I'm getting ready to bolt a Corsa onto my own I-6. (though I'm also eyeing a used E90M as an upgrade after they depreciate next year).

At least we're not driving Toyotas
The GTR had a flat plane crankshaft P65 engine, unlike the cross plane crank of the S65 engine. Same as a Ferrari V8 has, and why a Ferrari 458 does NOT sound like your regular V8...

To me (as a European) I'm glad BMW went with a cross bank exhaust on the M5 so it doesn't sound just like any other V8. The S65 sounds really great and will be a hard act to follow, but IMHO there is something about BMW and straight sixes.

Classic M cars have been straight six engines, incl. M1, 1M, E36 M3, E46 M3, E28 M5, E34 M5. To me the BMW straight six has a great sound and I'm sure (or at least hope ) the next M3/M4 will sound better in person than it does on videos taken with simple cams and poor microphones...
You are sort of correct but i see a flaw in your classic M cars have straight sixes.

You left out the classic of all classics the original e30 which only had four cylinders. To include this car into your mix, your statement should read:

ALL M CARS HAVE BEEN N/A.
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      07-14-2013, 06:30 PM   #77
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sounds good but man those mirrors are out of place imo.
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      07-16-2013, 03:14 AM   #78
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the high revving and sound of this s65 is WHY i wanted this M3. I am CAR enthusiast, not a BMW M enthusiast only. I don't just buy a M powered car because its a M powered car. with that said.my last car was American muscle (most likely ever going back muscle) ,before that was Japanese sports car. So i am somewhat open to different engines.

I think from the renders and the concept the new M4 is going to look very sharp and sexy. I am ok with a power level around 450HP. IF this engine is not something special and just typical sounding I6. Then i am not getting one.
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      07-16-2013, 09:42 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monkawekrue View Post
sounds good but man those mirrors are out of place imo.
Because they are still camouflaged.
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      07-16-2013, 07:43 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason View Post
Because they are still camouflaged.
i see said the blind man, thought they were just going to be LCI big lol
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      07-19-2013, 12:44 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Sometimes I wish the same but then I think about how frustrating it would be when my recommendations to make the car ever more hardcore would consistently be voted down by management...
yep. exactly...
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