Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott
This definitely puts you in the minority of reviewers & people I've driven them with 
I literally haven't met anyone nor read or watched any review that put *ANY* Cayenne as more engaging than the X5m, with the key being, when lit up. If I'm mistaken, let me know - That's DEFINITELY NOT to say any one person's opinion is better than another, but it's more like movie or music reviews: once you get to know what a reviewer likes you can gauge if you'll like it. So either I'm an outlier and missed all of the Cayenne-better-than-X5M reviews or you're the outlier and we just like different things about a vehicle.
I will say I NEVER track & am road course only, plus most of my routine fun comes from Canyon Carving - which is how I judged the C-GTS & X5M. I suspect given your track experience we might be looking for WAY different things ... In a canyon scenario, the Cayenne feels super smooth whereas the X5M feels giggly batshit; it's the vehicle that's always pushing you to go just a stitch faster around the next curve, just a bit more nutty; and straight line acceleration in the C-GTS is just flat out no comparison to the X5M
This pic tells that tale:
This is Cayenne Turbo getting beat by stock X5M & M50i ... it's just out-classed.
Clearly there's some feel-aspect of the Cayenne GTS in corners that you feel outweighs the fairly large power & acceleration deficit and raw cornering capability of the X5m?  Or what would say the GTS is so much better at that it overcomes the power deficit? Say more about "engagement" - what exactly do you mean in an example back to back?
For me the Cayenne driving feel - the "engagement" - is an addictive smoothness in corners and recovery ; in canyon-carving, kind of a feel of up-down-over-around ease that puts a smile on your face ... but it doesn't rib-nudge me.
Versus the X5M, to my butt, has a that-wunt-nuttin feel when you light it up around a corner - maybe that's what you're calling "not engaging"? For me that *IS* engaging! It's a challenge: try-the-next-one-harder. And then again. And again. And frankly I get way too scared before I'm even close to the limit of that car, so I walk away thinking next-time...next-time.
So maybe that's the difference? The Cayenne is slower, but smoother whereas the X5M's number feel challenges me but disappoints you? I could see that.
Overall, that's why, had I been able to find a decent dealer & deal, I woulda gone Porsche - simply because I've never gotten any real it's-mine seat time in a Porsche. |
I think maybe we define "engagement" different. I'm so over numbers, drag races and lap times. Especially the stupid ass Nurburdskjnfjksdnjnsjkdfn lap time/records. I've come to the realization I can't use all the car is capable on the track because I'm not that good of a driver and never will be. Nor can you or should get to the limits on the road. You know I've had a lot of cars and I'd rank them like this in the fun to drive/engagement ranking. CGTS 4.0 (MT), GT350 (MT), tie between the M4 CS (DCT) and ZL1 1LE (MT), C63s (MCT 9) and every other version of F80 M3/4 (comp, base MT/DCT etc) I ever had. Notice something here? On paper the Porsche and the Ford are probably the slowest in every acceleration test and not the best skid pad numbers. Nor the best lap numbers. What they are is just fun as hell to drive. The steering and chassis just communicate to you, they don't sound like shit and they aren't filled with gimmicks like every BMW on the road and badged to the hilt just so everyone knows you are in a non M, faux M or real M. Sorry for the run on sentence.
Aside from my M4 CS, I've been disappointed in every single BMW I've ever owned, leased or test driven. Aside from the M2 being literally the only other caveat. The ones I've been disappointed in all have the exact same things in common and they might as well be the same car. Stupid fast, switched to boring ZF8 transmissions, heavy steering to try and hide the fact it isn't saying shit to you through the steering wheel. Soft brakes and pedal feel unless you pony up for carbon ceramics of which I don't like for DD reasons and replacement costs. Uncomfortable seats and gadgets up the wazu that nobody hardly uses including the digital dash. Probably the most important is suspension tuning. They are either too harsh or too soft, no real goldilocks zone like the CGTS and GT350 have/had (the M4 CS being the only exception here/maybe the M2). Or the Macans/Cayennes I've driven. I'll say MB can be the same way but the AMGs are still fun to drive in the way that I like them. Every F80/82 I've owned would crush my wife's C63S on the track and I'd never give it up for another one, ever. Porsches can be gimmicky to if you go crazy on the option sheet, but they can also still be optioned for just fun driving still.
If I wanted a car that had the highest limits ever and was bonkers crazy etc etc I would've never given up my ZL1 1LE. I admit, I still miss that thing sometimes and my GT350 for fun driving. Neither come close to the Porsche which is the slowest accelerating and not the highest cornering limits. I don't know how they do it but nothing else compares to me except for the rare car like some of the US companies are doing and some MBs.
Any way, now I'm rambling, hopefully that explains my thought process. You probably have enough money for two retirements so go crazy and get something different and really fun. If you really do like the X5M and think it is the most fun car to drive for your purposes then that's cool to. I have this feeling though you are settling though because you are afraid to approach that hot crazy girl in the bar.