[swamp2]

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

albeit even if temporarily...that made me think; isn't all power temporary? I mean whatever number we pick, isn't it at a given rpm, including the peak power?

For an ICE power is indeed a function of rpm, load and throttle position thus power is a very dynamic concept. However, in choosing a single and simple metric that best informs us about a vehicles performance, peak power reigns supreme (of course peak power divided by weight).

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

Questions:

1) How do we benefit from "peak" power frequent enough in real world driving, since it is reached at the top end of the revs in good NA engines like the S65?

The average power throughout the rpms (but as a function of time, not rpm!) actually used is indeed more important. However, given that power varies and is generally linear/rolling off to flat or in some cases decreasing with higher rpm (say 1M and Z06 Corvette in particular), the peak value is still the best simple metric to use. In other words the average power across rpms actually used in a WOT performance run will correlate very well and quite linearly with the actual peak power. It is not a perfectly predictive number but a very good one.

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

2) Why exactly peak power is "substantially more important" unless of course we live around Nurburgring or our daily commute pass to/from unlimited sections of autobahn?...which would be great by the way!

It is important because almost all folks are interested in the maximum possible performance. Peak power simply tells us the most about the maximum performance attainable with a given engine (and again weight). It is certainly all about the rpm range(s) actually used. The power or torque an engine makes (less the effects of drag racing discussed a bit below) outside of the rpms actually used are truly irrelevant. Thus on a track or road course what the S65 in the M3 is doing below about 5000 rpm is truly meaningless. It could literally make 10 ft lb or 10 hp at those rpms and it would not matter - those rpms are never "used". For those unwilling to fully depress the gas pedal or use the rpms near redline then all bets are off. I commonly refer to this as "lazy driving". Folks are generally concerned about the maximum possible performance but some of those don't want to use the car as designed and use the redline. The same comment obviously applies to choosing the right/best gear, it basically the same concept. Not being willing to use the available performance envelope in a sports car just makes very little sense to me.

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

3) How exactly an engine (N54T) which produces not only more torque (around 60% more) but also more hp from idle to around 6250 rpm vs. a magnificiant NA engine, and only after that it starts falling back (vs. the other engine, the S65 of course) for the last 750 rpms left, can be performing less in a variety of situations in real world driving where you are supposed to be driving around different rpms and not at a single rpm, especially not around top of the rev? This even before we also take into consideration weight and power to weight factors.

Yes, for "lazy driving" turbos and specifically the N54/N55 can be great engines. I've mostly covered this question already above. The rpms you use are the relevant rpms. Dynos are a whole other ball of wax... Generally I trust them about as far as I can throw the paper they are printed on. Just too many variables and too much non real world effects (temperature, flow). That being said I don't doubt the 1M (when on overboost) can produce more power in some rpm range than the M3. However, I seriously doubt it does so up to 6750 rpm. Probably closer to 6k than 7k. This along with weight contribute to making the car a solid low speed low rpm performer compared to the M3. The problem with the N54/N55 is its complete lack of ability to breath past about 5250 rpm and you really feel this and it hurts the cars performance.

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

4) How do you explain the fact that despite being more tricky to launch effectively, a 1M manages to stay (slightly) ahead of a manual M3 untill the end of its third gear (around 180 km/h) and starts falling behind only after around 200+ km/h, according to people who owned or still own both, are these people simply lying or don't know what they talk about? Or, is it maybe one of them is way underrated and/or the other overrated, who knows, and simply taking those BMW advertised hp/tq numbers as a base for sound calculation maybe is the very reason of reaching misleading conclusions?

The 1M is indeed underrated as is the 335i and the new M5 as well. The 1M and E92 M3 are very close in performance because their power to weight ratios are quite close. In a drag race (from stop) the 1M is likely to pull just a hair ahead for a few hundred feet (maybe even 400 or 500 feet). Why, because it produces more power at the wheels for just some time at low speeds and low rpms. Any contests beginning from about 40 mph and up (more typical of a track/road coarse) and the M3 has the advantage. I suppose you could say that the 1M's high torque at low rpm is in part "responsible" for its drag racing capability over the M3. In this case peak power to weight does not quite capture who would best whom for all types on contests. Now that being said by the end of the 1/4 mile the M3 will typically be ahead and trap faster.

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

5) Did you ever drive a 1M or a 335is or a Z435is, I mean long enough and not as a passenger, to understand their driving/delivery characteristics, preferably a 1M, since it also has the parts and bits that makes it more comparable/similar to your car?

Yes, I have "beat on" a 1M with enough seat time to understand and extract its maximum performance. It's a nice car for sure, but has massively less character especially in regards to its engine and transmission (M-DCT in particular). The sound is also nowhere close. As much as I sort of wish acoustics wasn't as important to me as it is, there is a real thrill with the M3 near redline, WOT with an aftermarket exhaust. Simply exhilarating. Have you experienced this?

Originally Posted by ozinaldo

I enjoy your posts and strong logic and knowledge behind them, I really do and am not here to contest you, also am a fan of S65 and M3, could be my choice if it would be smaller in size and with less weight. It is plain and simple: the more I read from you the more I started getting curious; how do you answer these questions to yourself, I am very curious to hear. Do you say that what we experience out there all day is an illusion?

Thanks in advance.

Thank you! Good post and good questions! Saludos.