BMW dealership is holding my M4 for ransom!

[TDotBMW]

What a nightmare of a service experience I am having with Parkview BMW of Toronto.

Back in May, 2018 I brought in my car for service with this dealership for a buzzing/ticking noise when I open the car door and check engine light came on. For the check engine light they told me that they replaced the Valvetronic motor. For buzzing/ticking noise they said that it was normal. Little did I know that those two things were related. I had 13050 KM or so. I was concerned that I got an answer that ticking noises coming from the engine was normal. I was told by the service advisor that I have the history documented and any issues in the future would be covered. I felt comfortable with that answer at the time.

As many of you may know by now, a lot of owners have experienced this buzzing/ticking sound. There was even a PUMA service bulletin for this issue and a later update that included some new programming with the DME.

Regardless, i’ve always had this ticking noise since I can remember.

Fast forward to May, 2022. The car had never been winter driven and from the period of Jan, 2020 to present I have been out of the country. Basically since COVID hit. Even without Covid i would only be back for the summers at most. My brother was always the one who would check up on the car once in a while to see if everything is ok and keep the car loose and driving it around once in a while. The BMW CTEK Battery tender was used frequently. The car suddenly had the check engine light come on and my brother put a scan tool on it to see that it is related to the Valvetronic motor. Of course, the ticking noises are still there as they always had been because I was told it was normal.

I started to search online about this issue and looked like more and more people are having this issue and low and behold consensus online was that it was related to the Valvetronic motor. However, sometimes when the Valvetronic motor fails, it will cause the eccentric shaft to fail. That is why a PUMA bulletin update recommends that both be checked and replaced in addition to DME programming.

I made an appointment with Parkview BMW. Because I am overseas i called the service department and explained the situation that back when I was under warranty they told me this ticking noise was normal (when it’s not) and also as part of the repair would involve yet another Valvetronic motor. The car now has only 15025 KM so that’s 2 valvetronic motors within 2000 KMs. I was looking for a goodwill repair given the circumstances. They told me that they need to first check the issue before they can make a decision. So, I arranged for my parents to help drop off the car for a May 11th service appointment.

At the time I dropped off the car as luck would have it, the battery was weak and the car would not start. My parents arranged for a tow truck to come and they boosted the car and sent it off to Parkview BMW. When they arrived there my parents passed the phone to me I was insisting that this repair should have probably reviewed to be covered under goodwill. I conveyed that to the service advisor who eventually told me he would pass me to the service manager. (He actually passed me to the assistant service manager). I spoke to him and again he repeated that first they need to check the issue.

That was fine. Keep in mind that nobody told me about any diagnostic fees at the time of this. They just told me they need to check the car first. At this point if there was a fee was to be applied I would have been livid.

They confirm the problem to be a failing valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. Not sure exactly how they came to this conclusion. I suppose they hooked up the scan tool. No way they took apart everything to look at the valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. They also said they checked my battery and recommended a new battery. Of course they did. They checked it was low charged and came to this conclusion. Total work order was $4990 for the valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. Another $360 for the DME coding and $2800+ for a new battery. Yikes. On top of that they said because my car is out of warranty they couldn’t help me. Offered an insulting 10% discount.

Was now considering my options with speaking to BMW Canada again and also considering small claims courts. One thing for sure was I was not going to do the repair there. They turned their back on me despite having this documented in the history and promising me that in the future if i had any issues they can revisit it.

I declined their service and prepared to move forward. This is where it gets more interesting. They tell me that I owe them $360 for a diagnostic fee for the coder they hooked up to get the engine fault codes and to check the level of the battery for me. Wow, those both can be probably done in 20
minutes or sooner. I was very surprised they they wanted to charge me that fee considering the circumstances and what I thought was for them to see if the issue was the same (and a simple scan would show it was). Perhaps because I chose not to have the service there they wanted to get something out of it. Never once did anyone mention a diagnostic fee. Nothing was sent to myself or my parents. In fact, no work order was even given to anyone. Nothing was signed. I informed them but they said they told my parents. Total lie!

In Ontario we have a Consumers Protection Act for situations like this and it states that all estimates must be given in writing and authorization must be given by the consumer can only be met if this is provided. This was not done.

Now to add insult to injury the sneaky assistant service manager has threatened me with a $95 per day storage fee that they will be starting to add to the bill tomorrow.

What a nightmare of a situation. I have reached out to BMW Canada and only just received a reply from then that the dealership said they had informed my parents of the charge. Total BS. They didn’t even get not so much as a receipt from them for giving the keys. I remember that being standard.

I have a call scheduled with a lawyer tomorrow and I have read online that you can issue a special request whereby you pay the courts the repair bill and the dealership would be forced to release the car within 3 days.

What a horrible terrible experience from Parkview BMW.

Any recommendations as to my next course of action?

UPDATE: Car is out of its hostage taking situation. Car is fixed. Will update the post below.

[18BSMF82]

You're error was to think that the dealership would give you a goodwill repair outside of warranty based on their word from a service visit 2 years ago. Perhaps if you were still in the warranty period they'd honor it. In addition, you went back to that service department despite the fact they stripped a bolt on the cylinder head. Are you kidding? I would never let any service department touch my car had I known they stripped a bolt.

You could try your luck with small claims court and reciting the CPA but I feel this would be difficult given that you are out of country.

My suggestion, respectfully, is to pay the diag fee, get the car to a reputable indy and have the car fixed. If the car is paid off I would probably sell it given that the problem may not ever go away. I'm not well versed in this issue though so I could be wrong.

This is why I never use dealerships. Always always always go to a reputable indy for non warranty work.

[MMMM3]

Small claims court for $360?

Does a battery really cost $2,800? WTF!

[WordOnRoad]

What a nightmare! Sucks to hear you're having to deal with this.

Getting goodwill from dealers, BMW specifically, is so up in the air. Most advisors and managers act on emotions instead of doing what they know is right. Challenging an advisor or manager on technical stuff really adds fuel to the fire.

You're going about it the right way though. When I was green in my advising career (Circa 2013), I got burned a few times by not having had a signed estimate before doing customer pay work. I did recall the customer approving it verbally, but that didn't hold up with the customer or my manager and we ended up goodwilling the repair. I believe it was just TABs on an E70, so nothing near your service cost. Always try to have everything documented in your documents the same way the dealer wants everything documented.

WRT to storage fees; again, if you didn't sign the estimate to acknowledge that this $95 fee existed (generally some fine print at the bottom where you sign), they shouldn't be able to just stick you with it.

I don't completely agree that dealers are the worst etc etc etc. There are always a few good eggs littered throughout the service staff. Salespeople are quite literally the worst and there are zero good eggs. Ever. You just need to be prepared for what you know the dealer is going to tell you and have all of your ducks in a row prior to the appointment. Perhaps asking your parents to handle this wasn't the best idea, and a good friend or sibling would have been better suited. Hindsight tho.

Having worked in service for over a decade now, I cannot stress this enough - always get things in writing and be prepared to hand said documents back to the advisor or manager with the biggest shit-eating grin you can conjure up. I've been put in my place a few times by customers doing this, and I've also been able to catch customers in lies by having good documentation internally.

TLDR: You didn't sign or accept any type of estimate, so you do have a leg to stand on here.

At any rate, good luck with this. Interested in seeing how it ends.

[G35POPPEDMYCHERRY]

you simply cannot hold one's car hostage go over there demand your keys and get it back, if not involve the authorities LMFAO.

if they shall choose to take a mechanic's lien thats on them. you are too kind.

I would have had my car the second I got a whiff of them thinking they were going to pull this bullshit.

[TDotBMW]

Originally Posted by MMMM3

Small claims court for $360?

Does a battery really cost $2,800? WTF!

Small claims for the $5k repair that was supposed to be fixed under warranty and also to get my car back!

But looks like now working with a senior worker there has started to get some results. Will update and hopefully this turns out well.

Do those service advisors and assistant service managers have customer sales targets or work on commission or something?...this sort of behaviour is just dumb. All it takes is one pissed off customer to cost $$$$ in lost potential business nowadays. I am glad upper management sees that and that is why they are working the better paid jobs.

I am happy to say that my car is out of the hostage taking situation, but the issue still isn't fully resolved. Hopefully all ends well in the next few days here so I can give an update.

BTW, my phone meeting with a lawyer confirmed everything regarding the CPA and the requirements of a written work order needs to be presented. Also, says I definitely have a case with issues i had while under warranty that were not fixed. If anyone ever has a situation (here in Canada at least) where an autorepair shop or mechanic is taking your car for ransom on a bill that you are disputing, you can always pay the repair bill to the court and they will issue a form that you present to the repairer to claim your car back. A judge then decides the final outcome from the facts presented. That seems more reasonable.

[bigj505]

Customer service gets real bad when you fall out of warranty. I've experienced this at a few dealerships. Was shocking the first time it happened to me.

[N1rve]

Originally Posted by TDotDan

What a nightmare of a service experience I am having with Parkview BMW of Toronto.

Back in May, 2018 I brought in my car for service with this dealership for a buzzing/ticking noise when I open the car door and check engine light came on. For the check engine light they told me that they replaced the Valvetronic motor. For buzzing/ticking noise they said that it was normal. Little did I know that those two things were related. I had 13050 KM or so. Part of that repair experience they ended up stripping a bolt attached to the cylinder head and had to drill a hole to get it out. WOW. Needless to say I was concerned about this and the fact that I got an answer that ticking noises coming from the engine was normal. I was told by the service advisor that I have the history documented and any issues in the future would be covered. I felt comfortable with that answer at the time.

As many of you may know by now, a lot of owners have experienced this buzzing/ticking sound. There was even a PUMA service bulletin for this issue and a later update that included some new programming with the DME.

Regardless, i’ve always had this ticking noise since I can remember.

Fast forward to May, 2022. The car had never been winter driven and from the period of Jan, 2020 to present I have been out of the country. Basically since COVID hit. Even without Covid i would only be back for the summers at most. My brother was always the one who would check up on the car once in a while to see if everything is ok and keep the car loose and driving it around once in a while. The BMW CTEK Battery tender was used frequently. The car suddenly had the check engine light come on and my brother put a scan tool on it to see that it is related to the Valvetronic motor. Of course, the ticking noises are still there as they always had been because I was told it was normal.

I started to search online about this issue and looked like more and more people are having this issue and low and behold consensus online was that it was related to the Valvetronic motor. However, sometimes when the Valvetronic motor fails, it will cause the eccentric shaft to fail. That is why a PUMA bulletin update recommends that both be checked and replaced in addition to DME programming.

I made an appointment with Parkview BMW. Because I am overseas i called the service department and explained the situation that back when I was under warranty they told me this ticking noise was normal (when it’s not) and also as part of the repair would involve yet another Valvetronic motor. The car now has only 15025 KM so that’s 2 valvetronic motors within 2000 KMs. I was looking for a goodwill repair given the circumstances. They told me that they need to first check the issue before they can make a decision. So, I arranged for my parents to help drop off the car for a May 11th service appointment.

At the time I dropped off the car as luck would have it, the battery was weak and the car would not start. My parents arranged for a tow truck to come and they boosted the car and sent it off to Parkview BMW. When they arrived there my parents passed the phone to me I was insisting that this repair should have probably reviewed to be covered under goodwill. I conveyed that to the service advisor who eventually told me he would pass me to the service manager. (He actually passed me to the assistant service manager). I spoke to him and again he repeated that first they need to check the issue.

That was fine. Keep in mind that nobody told me about any diagnostic fees at the time of this. They just told me they need to check the car first. At this point if there was a fee was to be applied I would have been livid.

They confirm the problem to be a failing valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. Not sure exactly how they came to this conclusion. I suppose they hooked up the scan tool. No way they took apart everything to look at the valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. They also said they checked my battery and recommended a new battery. Of course they did. They checked it was low charged and came to this conclusion. Total work order was $4990 for the valvetronic motor and eccentric shaft. Another $360 for the DME coding and $2800+ for a new battery. Yikes. On top of that they said because my car is out of warranty they couldn’t help me. Offered an insulting 10% discount.

Was now considering my options with speaking to BMW Canada again and also considering small claims courts. One thing for sure was I was not going to do the repair there. They turned their back on me despite having this documented in the history and promising me that in the future if i had any issues they can revisit it.

I declined their service and prepared to move forward. This is where it gets more interesting. They tell me that I owe them $360 for a diagnostic fee for the coder they hooked up to get the engine fault codes and to check the level of the battery for me. Wow, those both can be probably done in 20
minutes or sooner. I was very surprised they they wanted to charge me that fee considering the circumstances and what I thought was for them to see if the issue was the same (and a simple scan would show it was). Perhaps because I chose not to have the service there they wanted to get something out of it. Never once did anyone mention a diagnostic fee. Nothing was sent to myself or my parents. In fact, no work order was even given to anyone. Nothing was signed. I informed them but they said they told my parents. Total lie!

In Ontario we have a Consumers Protection Act for situations like this and it states that all estimates must be given in writing and authorization must be given by the consumer can only be met if this is provided. This was not done.

Now to add insult to injury the sneaky assistant service manager has threatened me with a $95 per day storage fee that they will be starting to add to the bill tomorrow.

What a nightmare of a situation. I have reached out to BMW Canada and only just received a reply from then that the dealership said they had informed my parents of the charge. Total BS. They didn’t even get not so much as a receipt from them for giving the keys. I remember that being standard.

I have a call scheduled with a lawyer tomorrow and I have read online that you can issue a special request whereby you pay the courts the repair bill and the dealership would be forced to release the car within 3 days.

What a horrible terrible experience from Parkview BMW.

Any recommendations as to my next course of action?

Pay the $360 Diagnostic and tow your car out of there if you need to. If something was going to be a "good will" repair, it will be noted in your work order. Most of the time, 99% of the time, if you're out of warranty you are on the hook for the Diagnostic fee if you don't let them do the repair. It will be listed on your work order. I have always seen this written on the fine print.

My experience with goodwill repairs has always been:

1) Bring my car to the dealer
2) Sign the WO noting that I would be on the hook for the Diagnostic fee.
3) They find out what the issue is, give me a quote. Ask for a goodwill repair, they will reach out to the Manufacture.
4) They will give you a final price either with discounted labor or completely free.

Read your work order before you lawyer up.

[TDotBMW]

Originally Posted by N1rve

Pay the $360 Diagnostic and tow your car out of there if you need to. If something was going to be a "good will" repair, it will be noted in your work order. Most of the time, 99% of the time, if you're out of warranty you are on the hook for the Diagnostic fee if you don't let them do the repair. It will be listed on your work order. I have always seen this written on the fine print.

My experience with goodwill repairs has always been:

1) Bring my car to the dealer
2) Sign the WO noting that I would be on the hook for the Diagnostic fee.
3) They find out what the issue is, give me a quote. Ask for a goodwill repair, they will reach out to the Manufacture.
4) They will give you a final price either with discounted labor or completely free.

Read your work order before you lawyer up.

I think you missed the part where I said there was no work order. At least not one given to us nor did we sign anything.

[MMMM3]

What about the $2,800 battery?

[TJ@AUTOcouture]

Originally Posted by N1rve

Pay the $360 Diagnostic and tow your car out of there if you need to. If something was going to be a "good will" repair, it will be noted in your work order. Most of the time, 99% of the time, if you're out of warranty you are on the hook for the Diagnostic fee if you don't let them do the repair. It will be listed on your work order. I have always seen this written on the fine print.

My experience with goodwill repairs has always been:

1) Bring my car to the dealer
2) Sign the WO noting that I would be on the hook for the Diagnostic fee.
3) They find out what the issue is, give me a quote. Ask for a goodwill repair, they will reach out to the Manufacture.
4) They will give you a final price either with discounted labor or completely free.

Read your work order before you lawyer up.

Actually, with goodwill repairs they do not need to reach out the manufacturer. It is up to the service manager and the warranty administrator if they want to approve it. There is a chart with a sliding scale based on age of the car and mileage that BMW will cover up to 100% or as little as 10% of the repair. To me it sounds like this BMW dealer is trying to offer a 10% discount on their own dime rather than use their allotted goodwill funds from BMW. With how low the mileage is on that car and the age it should qualify for 70% goodwill reimbursement to the dealer from BMW. And goodwill percentages are based off of warranty rates which means the labor rates and parts prices are lower so realistically its likely closer to an 80-85% discount off normal retail rates. When I was at a BMW dealer I had a really good relationship with my managers and the warranty administrator and always went the extra mile to get this type of stuff repaired when I felt the customer deserved it, such as a situation like this.

To the OP, I am sorry the dealer is making this such a frustrating situation, I wish I could help! The $2800 battery really has me thrown off though. I would be curious to see the estimate breakdown.

[MMMM3]

I am seeing the BMW price for the battery at 1100-1400-

How can a battery cost so much?

[G35POPPEDMYCHERRY]

Originally Posted by MMMM3

I am seeing the BMW price for the battery at 1100-1400-

How can a battery cost so much?

theres a sucker born every minute, we are going to take em for all they got!

[N1rve]

Originally Posted by TDotDan

I think you missed the part where I said there was no work order. At least not one given to us nor did we sign anything.

Probably, was a giant wall of text lol.

In that case, I am surprised they would even touch your car.

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by MMMM3

I am seeing the BMW price for the battery at 1100-1400-

How can a battery cost so much?

It's a very lightweight (1/2 that of lead-acid) lithium-ion battery, and BMWNA MSRP is currently $1861.57. getbmwparts has it for $1498.57.

[CS328Ci]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

It's a very lightweight (1/2 that of lead-acid) lithium-ion battery, and BMWNA MSRP is currently $1861.57. getbmwparts has it for $1498.57.

OP is in Canada, your website is for US customers.

Can't purchase from getbmwparts as they do not do international shipping

It is legit that they charge around $2000 in Canada for a OEM battery

[F82///M]

Bmw Canada online parts currently has a battery for CAD 2400 +tax, it has been around 2100 for a long time so it looks like inflation is doing its thing. Those extra $400 could be price of installed battery, registration and probably an hour of technician time.

Not sure why everyone is surprised about diagnostic fee, those are to be expected. Yes they didn't disclose it to OP but they had verbal approval to check the car and someone has to pay for it. The only way to avoid diag fee is to tell them to replace exact part and customer pays for the part and labor.
Even when vehicle is under warranty service advisor would always mention if it's something not covered under warranty I would have to pay diagnostic fee.

[rosemont83]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

It's a very lightweight (1/2 that of lead-acid) lithium-ion battery, and BMWNA MSRP is currently $1861.57. getbmwparts has it for $1498.57.

Hopefully by the time I need a battery it's $1000 lol

[MMMM3]

My advisor said to keep the car on a tender as much as possible because that extends the life....

Has anyone wired up a "extension" that is accessible from the grill so that the hood does not need to be opened up to connect to the battery posts?

[Nick7700]

Originally Posted by MMMM3

My advisor said to keep the car on a tender as much as possible because that extends the life....

Has anyone wired up a "extension" that is accessible from the grill so that the hood does not need to be opened up to connect to the battery posts?

Yes. It's very easy and not to difficult.

[MMMM3]

Do you have any pics of the grill with the adapter poking out?

[Nick7700]

Originally Posted by MMMM3

Do you have any pics of the grill with the adapter poking out?

Here you go.