Wheels and tires advice

[polarbearz]

Hi,

I am looking to buy a set of apex wheels. I drive my m4 at most 3 days a week and track it 8 times a year. From my research, super car 3 is the best tire for me because I live in an apartment so there's no way to store two sets of wheels. It has an OK performance and long lasting grip. Here's four possible way for wheels and tires:

1. 18x10 front and 19x11 rear with 275/35/18 and 305/35/19 because 275 is the widest option for 18 inch. This way to maximize the rear grip.

2. 18x10 square to mount four 275/35/18.

3. 18x10.5 square to mount four 275/35/18. I heard super car 3 are really wide compare to other tires. It's about 290 for a A052. So it's better to mount to 10.5 instead of 10? And 10.5 square allow me to maybe run 295 square in the future if I decide to run 100tw tires.

4. 18x10.5 front and 19x11 rear with 275/35/18 and 305/35/19 because 275 is wide so maybe 10.5 fits better than 10?

I only tracked a few times and haven't driven any other m4 yet. I am wondering which set do you guys recommend and it will be the fastest on track? I don't know if square or stagger will be faster on track?

Thank you all for the advice. I appreciate that!

[D_SheerDrivingPleasure]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

Hi,

I am looking to buy a set of apex wheels. I drive my m4 at most 3 days a week and track it 8 times a year. From my research, super car 3 is the best tire for me because I live in an apartment so there's no way to store two sets of wheels. It has an OK performance and long lasting grip. Here's four possible way for wheels and tires:

1. 18x10 front and 19x11 rear with 275/35/18 and 305/35/19 because 275 is the widest option for 18 inch. This way to maximize the rear grip.

2. 18x10 square to mount four 275/35/18.

3. 18x10.5 square to mount four 275/35/18. I heard super car 3 are really wide compare to other tires. It's about 290 for a A052. So it's better to mount to 10.5 instead of 10? And 10.5 square allow me to maybe run 295 square in the future if I decide to run 100tw tires.

4. 18x10.5 front and 19x11 rear with 275/35/18 and 305/35/19 because 275 is wide so maybe 10.5 fits better than 10?

I only tracked a few times and haven't driven any other m4 yet. I am wondering which set do you guys recommend and it will be the fastest on track? I don't know if square or stagger will be faster on track?

Thank you all for the advice. I appreciate that!

8 track days is enough to justify a square set-up so can rotate front to back and side to side. The only downside is that you will need an appropriate spacer and extended bolts or studs upfront. I recommend 10.5x18 ET36-40.

This wheel size gives you the option to run 275/35 and 295/30 with a few in between. The supercar 3r is very wide, so is the yoko A052. All 275/35 tires will be happy on a 10.5 wheel.

Consider the gently used forged square apex set that spxxx has listed. Great value. I think you are local to each other.

[NYG]

Are you choosing supercar 3 for combined street/track use?

If so, I think you should go with the tried and true 18x10, 18x11 staggered NT01 setup.

My thought process is that even though you probably see more rain than SoCal, the SC3 is NOT a good rain tire and neither is the NT01.

I still have not driven on tires that even come close to NT01 in terms of tire longevity and I've driven them in the rain before which wasn't too crazy. I wouldn't drive them in downpour or around standing water though.

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by D_SheerDrivingPleasure

8 track days is enough to justify a square set-up so can rotate front to back and side to side. The only downside is that you will need an appropriate spacer and extended bolts or studs upfront. I recommend 10.5x18 ET36-40.

This wheel size gives you the option to run 275/35 and 295/30 with a few in between. The supercar 3r is very wide, so is the yoko A052. All 275/35 tires will be happy on a 10.5 wheel.

Consider the gently used forged square apex set that spxxx has listed. Great value. I think you are local to each other.

Yeah 18x10.5 et40 is the ideal setup for running square setups on F8X's, I personally wouldn't run anything else as you'll need to rotate often with the uneven wear the front tires see on this chassis. As you noted, this just requires a 15-20mm spacer up front (you won't have any rubbing issues with 275's, I ran really wide 295 tires all around). The M4 GT4 actually ran 25mm spacers up front to fit 18x11 wheels all around...

PM me, I'll give you a good deal on those Arc-8R Forged wheels. Need to clean out the garage, I have a set of 285 Pirelli Slicks mounted but also have some spare RT660s in 285/30 & 275/35 if you're interested.

As far as tires go, the SC3r is fast but the F8X seems to eat tires faster than most chassis. I've moved to the new Nexen Sport-R tire and I'm running lap times equal/faster than the RT660 with significantly less wear and none of the greasy behavior after a few laps. They're legitimately magical tires plus the 275/35/18 is wider than the RT660 285/30/18 - it runs more like a 285/35/18 which is the perfect size for F8x/E9x IMO.

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by NYG

Are you choosing supercar 3 for combined street/track use?

If so, I think you should go with the tried and true 18x10, 18x11 staggered NT01 setup.

My thought process is that even though you probably see more rain than SoCal, the SC3 is NOT a good rain tire and neither is the NT01.

I still have not driven on tires that even come close to NT01 in terms of tire longevity and I've driven them in the rain before which wasn't too crazy. I wouldn't drive them in downpour or around standing water though.

We don't really get any more rain in NorCal than SoCal haha especially these days.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by spxxx

Yeah 18x10.5 et40 is the ideal setup for running square setups on F8X's, I personally wouldn't run anything else as you'll need to rotate often with the uneven wear the front tires see on this chassis. As you noted, this just requires a 15-20mm spacer up front (you won't have any rubbing issues with 275's, I ran really wide 295 tires all around). The M4 GT4 actually ran 25mm spacers up front to fit 18x11 wheels all around...

PM me, I'll give you a good deal on those Arc-8R Forged wheels. Need to clean out the garage, I have a set of 285 Pirelli Slicks mounted but also have some spare RT660s in 285/30 & 275/35 if you're interested.

As far as tires go, the SC3r is fast but the F8X seems to eat tires faster than most chassis. I've moved to the new Nexen Sport-R tire and I'm running lap times equal/faster than the RT660 with significantly less wear and none of the greasy behavior after a few laps. They're legitimately magical tires plus the 275/35/18 is wider than the RT660 285/30/18 - it runs more like a 285/35/18 which is the perfect size for F8x/E9x IMO.

SC3Rs have terrible longevity - even on Camaros

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by NYG

Are you choosing supercar 3 for combined street/track use?

If so, I think you should go with the tried and true 18x10, 18x11 staggered NT01 setup.

My thought process is that even though you probably see more rain than SoCal, the SC3 is NOT a good rain tire and neither is the NT01.

I still have not driven on tires that even come close to NT01 in terms of tire longevity and I've driven them in the rain before which wasn't too crazy. I wouldn't drive them in downpour or around standing water though.

I do have another car so I don't really need to drive it in the rain. How's your experience driving nt01 on the street? It lasts longer than super car 3? I am worried about nt01 to lose it's heat cycle.

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

I do have another car so I don't really need to drive it in the rain. How's your experience driving nt01 on the street? It lasts longer than super car 3? I am worried about nt01 to lose it's heat cycle.

I do need to drive the m4 about 2-3 times a week when my wife drive my other car.

[D_SheerDrivingPleasure]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

I do need to drive the m4 about 2-3 times a week when my wife drive my other car.

The NT01 doesn't heat cycle!!. It's magical in that respect and in terms of durability.

Downside is the road noise and water channeling. You will be fine, just don't plow thru puddles at 70mph trying to pass a semi.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

I do have another car so I don't really need to drive it in the rain. How's your experience driving nt01 on the street? It lasts longer than super car 3? I am worried about nt01 to lose it's heat cycle.

Way longer.

I ran them an entire season - have yet to find a tire that held up that well. The grip wasn't AMAZING towards the end of the season but still totally usable.

Some people say they cord them before they heat cycle out but my NT01s heat cycled out first, it just took a whole season for it to happen.

SC3s barely outlast Cup 2s. Not a great choice for longevity in my opinion.

Like @D_SheerDrivingPleasure said, they're noisier but completely streetable. I've driven them in rain before.

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by NYG

Way longer.

I ran them an entire season - have yet to find a tire that held up that well. The grip wasn't AMAZING towards the end of the season but still totally usable.

Some people say they cord them before they heat cycle out but my NT01s heat cycled out first, it just took a whole season for it to happen.

SC3s barely outlast Cup 2s. Not a great choice for longevity in my opinion.

Like @D_SheerDrivingPleasure said, they're noisier but completely streetable. I've driven them in rain before.

Oh that's great to hear. How many track days and street miles does it last?

[NYG]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

Oh that's great to hear. How many track days and street miles does it last?

Street miles, I have no clue.

I would say I got around 7-8 track days of really decent grip and a few more days (6ish) of acceptable grip but had to get on power later coming through the apex.

SC3s fall off hard after a weekend for everyone I know.

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by NYG

Street miles, I have no clue.

I would say I got around 7-8 track days of really decent grip and a few more days (6ish) of acceptable grip but had to get on power later coming through the apex.

SC3s fall off hard after a weekend for everyone I know.

Oh I see. And Stagger is faster than 295 square?

[uncle ben]

Just to clarify. You want to run the “super car 3”, not the “super car 3 r”. If so my experience with the super car 3 is that they are a great street tire. Very quiet and comfortable and just as fast as my nt01 setup. The only problem is that after 3 track days, the outside shoulder of my front tires were completely worn. You might get 4 track days, but that’s it. The rear tires wear much better and I could see you getting 8 track days out of a set of rear tires.

I switched to the nt01’s because I heard they last much longer. Only time will tell as I only have 2 track days on them. Good luck and hope you enjoy the new wheels, whatever you get.

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by uncle ben

Just to clarify. You want to run the “super car 3”, not the “super car 3 r”. If so my experience with the super car 3 is that they are a great street tire. Very quiet and comfortable and just as fast as my nt01 setup. The only problem is that after 3 track days, the outside shoulder of my front tires were completely worn. You might get 4 track days, but that’s it. The rear tires wear much better and I could see you getting 8 track days out of a set of rear tires.

I switched to the nt01’s because I heard they last much longer. Only time will tell as I only have 2 track days on them. Good luck and hope you enjoy the new wheels, whatever you get.

Thanks for the information. Yes I am looking for super car 3 not super car 3 r. What's tire and wheel spec did you run on super car 3?

[NYG]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

Oh I see. And Stagger is faster than 295 square?

This I can't comment on entirely because I never ran a square setup but BMW chooses stagger to get the most out of the F8x. If you've got the car on race suspension/aero/etc then YMMV.

To my knowledge you can only fit 295 in the front on stock ride height (very high). You'll reduce the understeer bias a little bit.

[uncle ben]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

Thanks for the information. Yes I am looking for super car 3 not super car 3 r. What's tire and wheel spec did you run on super car 3?

I was using the stock wheels with 265/35/19 and 285/35/19 tires. They were slightly larger than the oem setup, but nothing rubbed or gave me issues. I still use this as my street setup, and run 275/305 NT01’s on 18x10, 18x11, apex wheels on the track.

[SYT_Shadow]

I recommend 10.5 square ET36, or ET40 like spxxx is selling. That allows you to run square 295s.

BMW puts square wheels and tires on their F82 M4 GT4 racecar, so I don't know why we should do differently.
If you want to test staggered tires, a 10.5 wheel allows 305 tires so you can still do that.

If you still want to do staggered wheels, do yourself a favor and get 10.5 front wheels along with the 11 rears.

The F8X -and E9X that came before it- are not powerful cars in the grand scheme of things. Most of the wear is on the front tires, as they must brake and turn the car and the weight distribution is slightly more front biased than 50/50.

[polarbearz]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I recommend 10.5 square ET36, or ET40 like spxxx is selling. That allows you to run square 295s.

BMW puts square wheels and tires on their F82 M4 GT4 racecar, so I don't know why we should do differently.
If you want to test staggered tires, a 10.5 wheel allows 305 tires so you can still do that.

If you still want to do staggered wheels, do yourself a favor and get 10.5 front wheels along with the 11 rears.

The F8X -and E9X that came before it- are not powerful cars in the grand scheme of things. Most of the wear is on the front tires, as they must brake and turn the car and the weight distribution is slightly more front biased than 50/50.

Thank you so much! That make sense! I saw some people run 10.5 square with et25 and it fit the rear. Should I do that? I don't want to run 20mm spacers in the front.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by zacharyz2333

Thank you so much! That make sense! I saw some people run 10.5 square with et25 and it fit the rear. Should I do that? I don't want to run 20mm spacers in the front.

ET36-40 is the sweet spot. ET36 will ask for a 12 or 15mm spacer, ET40 will want a 20.

I know it sounds a bit crazy but remember the M4 GT4 runs a 41mm!!!

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

ET36-40 is the sweet spot. ET36 will ask for a 12 or 15mm spacer, ET40 will want a 20.

I know it sounds a bit crazy but remember the M4 GT4 runs a 41mm!!!

As does the M2CSR

[markw10702]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

ET36-40 is the sweet spot. ET36 will ask for a 12 or 15mm spacer, ET40 will want a 20.

I know it sounds a bit crazy but remember the M4 GT4 runs a 41mm!!!

Actually, the M4 GT4 runs a 32mm spacer. P/N 31208431561. The factory spec GT4 wheel is 18x11 ET30 which, when used with the 32mm spacer, gives an effective offset of +2.

Bimmerworld is releasing their TA16 forged wheel in an 11x18 ET36. They recommend a 41mm spacer when running their full GTMore suspension on a standard M4 chassis. Not sure what the spacer requirements are with the GTS suspension.

https://www.bimmerworld.com/BimmerWo...e-Wheel_3.html