-SCANS- Car UK M4 VS C63 AMG

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by solstice

Not entirely true, the S55 as earlier M3s sound best at high rpms. The "problem" is that now there is no need to visit high rpms in DD driving, the S55 is such a beast in the mid-range and here it doesn't sound as exciting. It's not terrible though and an ok price to pay to enjoy the wonderful chassis with the big power. There's no way I'll trade for a C63 or RC-F due to this that's for sure . Do I miss the NA engine, yes but no FI engine is a match for it, Benz or other.

It is kind of interesting about getting the good sound out of the new car.

With the S65 it was easy to coax a nice tone at legal speeds. It was just hard to truly feel the 'power' of the car without breaking the law.

With the S55 you can get power whenever you want. But its harder to coax the sound out legally.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by tallshortguy

Hard driving is not limited to the track. The reviewer didn't even go on the track if you read the article, they did almost all backroad driving which is done quite a bit by people who like to enjoy their cars on the road. If you base your car based purely off your commute then you probably picked the wrong brand.

I didn't say the handling was bad, only that it was noted in the scans as inferior to the M3's. Please argue against points I actually make.

Lastly, you're not comparing cars in good faith here. You've clearly got an agenda as you have nothing but negative things to say about the M3 even in threads that aren't even comparing it to others. You keep bringing up active sound assist as if it's some travesty when it's barely even mentioned in the article and not a panned feature. If that's seriously your best argument as to why this is a terrible car then you need to reevaluate your entire case.

future you called.

He said that you need to put this guy on ignore to save a lot of time and headache.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by amanuuh

Yeah at the end of the day with these two cars its going to be a toss up. It will probably be close to 50/50 with the reviews on the C63 and M3 but I think the C63S will win most of the time.

Lexus messed up big time with the RC-F. So much potential. Audi probably won't bring anything out to compete with these two. The RS4 was only out for like 2 years wasn't it?

The C63 and M3 are both sitting at the top. If you can get either one of these youre lucky as hell

I am going to disagree with you there, I think the M3/M4 will win most of the battles in the USA magazines. (I can't keep track of all these UK, EU, ASIA magazines).

But I'm biased, as you can tell. Just do me a favor and don't be a fan boy

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by tallshortguy

Hard driving is not limited to the track. The reviewer didn't even go on the track if you read the article, they did almost all backroad driving which is done quite a bit by people who like to enjoy their cars on the road. If you base your car based purely off your commute then you probably picked the wrong brand.

I didn't say the handling was bad, only that it was noted as inferior to the M3's. Please argue against points I actually make.

Lastly, lol you're not comparing cars in good faith here you've clearly got an agenda as you have nothing but negative things to say about the M3 even in threads that aren't even comparing it to others. You keep bringing up active sound assist as if it's some travesty when it's barely even mentioned in the article and certainly not a panned feature. If that's seriously your best argument as to why this is a terrible car then you need to reevaluate your entire case.

Sure, hard driving is not reserved for the track but it's still the best place to do so and to feel the handling caracteristics of a car. Anyway that was just an exemple, that does'nt mean I don't enjoy my car on the road but it's not there that you often get close to the limits as you would on a circuit! And after all the C63 reviews I've seen, I feel like the way it handles seems more then good enough for what I do, and the engine probably more then makes up for its little weakeness(if we can call it that). In fact I'm not even sure the F8x outhandles the C, it seems like it's really more a question of feel then a question of performance that separate the two!

[amanuuh]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

I am going to disagree with you there, I think the M3/M4 will win most of the battles in the USA magazines. (I can't keep track of all these UK, EU, ASIA magazines).

But I'm biased, as you can tell. Just do me a favor and don't be a fan boy

Im going to stick with my statement because so far in reviews (non head to head) US editors are favoring the C63S.

I can't fanboy with Mercedes yet because I haven't owned one yet

[tallshortguy]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

Sure, hard driving is not reserved for the track but it's still the best place to do so and to feel the handling caracteristics of a car. Anyway that was just an exemple, that does'nt mean I don't enjoy my car on the road but it's not there that you often get close to the limits as you would on a circuit! And after all the C63 reviews I've seen, I feel like the way it handles seems more then good enough for what I do, and the engine probably more then makes up for its little weakeness(if we can call it that). In fact I'm not even sure the F8x outhandles the C, it seems like it's really more a question of feel then a question of performance that separate the two!

You're entire point was that you can't feel the understeer or body roll that I mentioned without going on track, that's clearly not true as both were noticed on the road.

Also, the article states several times by both writers that the M3 outhandles the C63. Seriously, did you actually read the whole article? Instead of avoiding another point you're clearly wrong on please at least answer this. You've said several things about the article that are clearly not in or refuted by the actual article which leads me to believe you didn't actually read through it.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by solstice

Not entirely true, the S55 as earlier M3s sound best at high rpms. The "problem" is that now there is no need to visit high rpms in DD driving, the S55 is such a beast in the mid-range and here it doesn't sound as exciting. It's not terrible though and an ok price to pay to enjoy the wonderful chassis with the big power. There's no way I'll trade for a C63 or RC-F due to this that's for sure . Do I miss the NA engine, yes but no FI engine is a match for it, Benz or other.

I understand what you are saying, but I still don't think the S55 is close to be in the same league as those very good sounding engines that you find in other cars of the same price range. Also, eventhough there's a similarity in sound between S55 and S54, the S55 is far from being the screamer the S54 was, and the S54 has never been the best sounding engine either. I don't want to rain on your parade, believe me, but I think it's a shame that BMW could'nt come up with something better then the S55, and I'm not talking about the performance, just the overhall experience!

[Vectors2final]

Originally Posted by amanuuh

Im going to stick with my statement because so far in reviews (non head to head) US editors are favoring the C63S.

I can't fanboy with Mercedes yet because I haven't owned one yet

Doesn't it say you have a CLA45 on the MB World forums?

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by tallshortguy

You're entire point was that you can't feel the understeer or body roll that I mentioned without going on track, that's clearly not true as both were noticed on the road.

Also, the article states several times by both writers that the M3 outhandles the C63. Seriously, did you actually read the whole article? Instead of avoiding another point you're clearly wrong on please at least answer this. You've said several things about the article that are clearly not in or refuted by the actual article which leads me to believe you didn't actually read through it.

Nop, my entire point was that you wont feel the understeer or body roll unless you drive the car hard, like on a track, which is only a small amount of the driving that most people do, so to me(and most people I suppose), having a better engine to play with and listen to is more important!

And yes I've read the article, but I'm not basing my opinion solely on this one, there's been many other reviews in which the C really shined handling wise. I'm just not sure the F8x really has an advantage in terms of carrying speed true corners, I was under the impression that both cars were similar in this department with the F8x having the advantage in feel, more comparos will tell us I guess!

[CanAutM3]

Both great cars and both are winners IMO. I see the C63S as the better daily driver and the M3 as the better track toy. Since I am quite the track junky, the M3(4) is the better dual purpose car for me. But I clearly see why one would prefer the C63.

I agree with the sidebar reviewer who says he would love to see the C63S engine in the M3 chassis. The question is would it be possible to get a heavier TT V8 under the hood and still get the light weight and balance of the F8X? Compromises, compromises...

[Black Gold]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Both great cars and both are winners IMO. I see the C63S as the better daily driver and the M3 as the better track toy. Since I am quite the track junky, the M3(4) is the better dual purpose car for me. But I clearly see why would prefer the C63.

I agree with the sidebar reviewer who says he would love to see the C63S engine in the M3 chassis.

Agreed

Choosing between the two is really about what type of car you are looking for since both are well executed

[Vectors2final]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Both great cars and both are winners IMO. I see the C63S as the better daily driver and the M3 as the better track toy. Since I am quite the track junky, the M3(4) is the better dual purpose car for me. But I clearly see why would prefer the C63.

I agree with the sidebar reviewer who says he would love to see the C63S engine in the M3 chassis.

How much does that engine way?


I think that would possibly ruin turn-in and make the car real nose heavy... I haven't been able to find any weight data on the M117. S55 is 425lbs, IIRC.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Vectors2final

How much does that engine way?


I think that would possibly ruin turn-in and make the car real nose heavy... I haven't been able to find any weight data on the M117. S55 is 425lbs, IIRC.

You replied while I was still editing my post

The S55 is barely lighter (if at all) than the S65. I wonder how much the M117 weighs with all the ancillaries and turbo plumbing.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Both great cars and both are winners IMO. I see the C63S as the better daily driver and the M3 as the better track toy. Since I am quite the track junky, the M3(4) is the better dual purpose car for me. But I clearly see why one would prefer the C63.

I agree with the sidebar reviewer who says he would love to see the C63S engine in the M3 chassis. The question is would it be possible to get a heavier TT V8 under the hood and still get the light weight and balance of the F8X? Compromises, compromises...

I don't see the point of a v8 besides bragging... Really, it's nice and loud.

What does it do for overall handling and the feel of the car?

I mean, should we be mocking that Porsche 911's are all 6 cylinders?

I don't want a GT car, I want a sports car.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

I don't see the point of a v8 besides bragging... Really, it's nice and loud.

What does it do for overall handling and the feel of the car?

I mean, should we be mocking that Porsche 911's are all 6 cylinders?

I don't want a GT car, I want a sports car.

The sound mostly and the extra power. However, I would take a V8 that revs a little higher than the M117 in the C63S...

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by amanuuh

Im going to stick with my statement because so far in reviews (non head to head) US editors are favoring the C63S.

I can't fanboy with Mercedes yet because I haven't owned one yet

Well i guess if we all listened to reviewers we'd all be driving Audis.

S6
RS7
since they have beaten M5's, E63's, M6's, CLS63's etc.

[CaryTheLabelGuy]

Guys, the S55 is one of the best engines out there. PERIOD. Who really gives a shit about what it sounds like?

I happen to think the S55 sounds amazing, BTW. I've not heard a single person say they weren't impressed by how this engine sounds, in person.

I prefer smaller turbo charged engines anyday over large, heavy and inefficient V8s. My small little Mitsubishi 4G63 2.0L turbo from my Evo VIII made 620awhp on the stock block(bottom end). Fully built, they're capable of 1000+ awhp. Why do I need a heavy/less efficient V8 to achieve these numbers? Sound alone?

There is a real reason the smart manufacturers are going with smaller, Forced Induction powerplants. More power, more efficiency, lighter weight.

Get over it.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

I prefer smaller turbo charged engines anyday over large, heavy and inefficient V8s. My small little Mitsubishi 4G63 2.0L turbo from my Evo VIII made 620awhp on the stock block(bottom end). Fully built, they're capable of 1000+ awhp. Why do I need a heavy/less efficient V8 to achieve these numbers? Sound alone?

Lag!

[amanuuh]

Originally Posted by Vectors2final

Doesn't it say you have a CLA45 on the MB World forums?

Brothers car. He isn't on the forums. He's not a fan of modding cars lol I'm 24 I can't afford two cars like that

[amanuuh]

Originally Posted by dkhm3

Well i guess if we all listened to reviewers we'd all be driving Audis.

S6
RS7
since they have beaten M5's, E63's, M6's, CLS63's etc.

No matter how much I try to like Audi i can't. The only car I would enjoy is the R8(who wouldn't want that car) other than that I'm not really a fan. I wanted a A4 back in the day but after I get into BMW I got over it.

[dkhm3]

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

Guys, the S55 is one of the best engines out there. PERIOD. Who really gives a shit about what it sounds like?

I happen to think the S55 sounds amazing, BTW. I've not heard a single person say they weren't impressed by how this engine sounds, in person.

I prefer smaller turbo charged engines anyday over large, heavy and inefficient V8s. My small little Mitsubishi 4G63 2.0L turbo from my Evo VIII made 620awhp on the stock block(bottom end). Fully built, they're capable of 1000+ awhp. Why do I need a heavy/less efficient V8 to achieve these numbers? Sound alone?

There is a real reason the smart manufacturers are going with smaller, Forced Induction powerplants. More power, more efficiency, lighter weight.

Get over it.

I have to tell you this engine loves to rev, and pulls all the way to 7.6k redline.

I have no qualms with this engine except, yeah, it does not sound like the 6.2 amg I had. But really, I would be disappointed in the sound even if I was driving a GT3. The v8 sounds great, that's it.

[Vectors2final]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

You replied while I was still editing my post

The S55 is barely lighter (if at all) than the S65. I wonder how much the M117 weighs with all the ancillaries and turbo plumbing.

S65 is 445lbs.

I can't find anything on the M117.

Your edit is what I was getting at...