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      10-21-2020, 05:42 AM   #45
DuMa M3
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Any real world testing or results yet from this kit ?
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      10-21-2020, 01:15 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuMa M3 View Post
Any real world testing or results yet from this kit ?
Pumps are installed, waiting on confirmation of tuning session with Cary. Will update once info is available.
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      10-21-2020, 05:03 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom @ eas View Post
Pumps are installed, waiting on confirmation of tuning session with Cary. Will update once info is available.
any pics of the installed pumps? I wanna see where they are mounted, is it next to the turbos?
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      10-21-2020, 05:04 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluer2 View Post
any pics of the installed pumps? I wanna see where they are mounted, is it next to the turbos?
We'll post pics as soon as everything is wrapped up and finished.
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      10-21-2020, 06:17 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by papasmurf_m3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sukir View Post
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Originally Posted by papasmurf_m3 View Post
Sounds promising! Can't wait to hear more about it.

Ian from Bend Calibration is helping me tune a max effort map on E50 and so far the car loves it. I tried E60 and the pump was showing signs of pressure loss. So we went back to E50 for now. Before meth.

And yes I've head there is a work around that some tuners use to run full E85 by lowering load limits etc. But, the true limit of the fuel system is E60.
True Limit of the fuel system is E60 on stock turbos?
The hpfp starts crashing after e60.

It's not dependent on hardware it's the ethanol content and limitations of the factory fuel system.
Lies, i can show my logs. Im running pump E85 (usually measures around 75-82) and my HPFP does not show signs of crashing whatsoever.
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      10-21-2020, 09:02 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2C_OZ View Post
Lies, i can show my logs. Im running pump E85 (usually measures around 75-82) and my HPFP does not show signs of crashing whatsoever.
It all depends how much torque you're targetting...the higher the ethanol content, the lower loads you can run.

I'm fully flex from the same tuner and can run any content; but I have torque targets adjusted for the different ethanol content to ensure there isn't an issue.
If you want to make the most power, you're not going to make it on 80% ethanol unless you have additional fueling.
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      10-21-2020, 09:28 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M2C_OZ View Post
Lies, i can show my logs. Im running pump E85 (usually measures around 75-82) and my HPFP does not show signs of crashing whatsoever.
It all depends how much torque you're targetting...the higher the ethanol content, the lower loads you can run.

I'm fully flex from the same tuner and can run any content; but I have torque targets adjusted for the different ethanol content to ensure there isn't an issue.
If you want to make the most power, you're not going to make it on 80% ethanol unless you have additional fueling.
Just to clarify you're talking stock turbos?
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      10-22-2020, 01:25 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///BMW Junkie View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commanderwiggin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M2C_OZ View Post
Lies, i can show my logs. Im running pump E85 (usually measures around 75-82) and my HPFP does not show signs of crashing whatsoever.
It all depends how much torque you're targetting...the higher the ethanol content, the lower loads you can run.

I'm fully flex from the same tuner and can run any content; but I have torque targets adjusted for the different ethanol content to ensure there isn't an issue.
If you want to make the most power, you're not going to make it on 80% ethanol unless you have additional fueling.
Just to clarify you're talking stock turbos?
I'm running stock turbos; but the concept applies even more to aftermarket turbos.
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      11-09-2020, 02:38 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom @ eas View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluer2 View Post
any pics of the installed pumps? I wanna see where they are mounted, is it next to the turbos?
We'll post pics as soon as everything is wrapped up and finished.
Any updates?
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      11-09-2020, 02:44 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///BMW Junkie View Post
Any updates?
1st car is in the bag, 2nd M4 going on the dyno soon so we can compare figures.

Results when finished.
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      11-09-2020, 06:13 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom @ eas View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ///BMW Junkie View Post
Any updates?
1st car is in the bag, 2nd M4 going on the dyno soon so we can compare figures.

Results when finished.
Tom,
What's the real objective of the Spool HPFPs...can the stock Direct Injection deliver more fuel with Spool pushing?
How does the Stock LPFP pressure log look with Spool sucking compared to stock HPFPs?
-Jimmy
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      11-09-2020, 07:13 PM   #56
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I have a question and excuse my ignorance as I'm still learning the ways of BMW M's. Why can a piston be made/fitted to stock HPFP OEM housing like Autotech does for Audi's?
See below. this upgrade gave us the opportunity to run up to E50 on my S4 and sorry if the question was previously answered. If stock system can get E50/55, the piston should easily get E60/70.
https://autotech.com/mm5/merchant.mv...de=10-127-101K
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      11-10-2020, 03:24 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopJimmy View Post
Tom,
What's the real objective of the Spool HPFPs...can the stock Direct Injection deliver more fuel with Spool pushing?
How does the Stock LPFP pressure log look with Spool sucking compared to stock HPFPs?
-Jimmy
Not enough info gathered to post yet. We'll post once the other M4 is finished tuning.
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      11-20-2020, 07:39 AM   #58
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Really looking forward to seeing some real-world results with these pumps. I'm interested to find out if the stock fueling restriction is purely pump related, or if the injectors actually become the bottle neck at some point.

If these HPFP's work as well as I'm hoping, I could potentially see using them over PI when tuning for E85 on aftermarket turbos.
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      11-21-2020, 02:43 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ6 View Post
Really looking forward to seeing some real-world results with these pumps. I'm interested to find out if the stock fueling restriction is purely pump related, or if the injectors actually become the bottle neck at some point.

If these HPFP's work as well as I'm hoping, I could potentially see using them over PI when tuning for E85 on aftermarket turbos.
I think the Injectors will be a bottle neck. Here in germany a lot of people use the BMW F10 M5 Injectors without any pump modification with very good results.Of course they also run 102 ROZ fuel.

Some coding for the M5 injectors is of course requiered.
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      11-21-2020, 07:41 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erik-f80 View Post
I think the Injectors will be a bottle neck. Here in germany a lot of people use the BMW F10 M5 Injectors without any pump modification with very good results.Of course they also run 102 ROZ fuel.

Some coding for the M5 injectors is of course requiered.
Do you know what increased % the M5 injectors flow above ours?

I'm also thinking that the larger injectors might benefit from an aftermarket HPFP with higher flow capacity... but
Since HPFP injector rail PSI is same as OEM the bottleneck is still the injector opening. The flash map might be able to open the big injectors longer, but a limit is eventually reached. Have you seen setups with big injectors plus pumps on your side of the pond?
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      11-21-2020, 07:48 AM   #61
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What i still dont understand is, if injectors are a limiting factor what is an upgraded HPFP gonna do to help supply more fuel ???

Yes M5 injectors flow more but they have to be the Euro5 version not 6.
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      11-21-2020, 09:28 AM   #62
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Quote:
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Do you know what increased % the M5 injectors flow above ours?
10% over the OEM S55 injector.
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      11-21-2020, 10:25 AM   #63
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So I'm thinking that the upgraded HPFPs and M5 injectors are for situations where PI is maxed out and you can afford $5-10K for 10% more DI (parts, shop install and tune).

Just having upgraded HPFPs won't make bigger injectors flow more, but bigger injectors might also push stock pumps to their limit too often.

The only way to really know the benefit is by incremental changes with good testing and logging.
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      11-21-2020, 11:25 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2C_OZ View Post
What i still dont understand is, if injectors are a limiting factor what is an upgraded HPFP gonna do to help supply more fuel ???

Yes M5 injectors flow more but they have to be the Euro5 version not 6.
can you elaborate on that? Europe has different M5 injectors than the US M5 injectors? What is the difference between Euro5 and 6?
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      11-21-2020, 11:37 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluer2 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by M2C_OZ View Post
What i still dont understand is, if injectors are a limiting factor what is an upgraded HPFP gonna do to help supply more fuel ???

Yes M5 injectors flow more but they have to be the Euro5 version not 6.
can you elaborate on that? Europe has different M5 injectors than the US M5 injectors? What is the difference between Euro5 and 6?
Not Necessarily Europe, Euro5 is an older version of M5 injectors which flows more than Euro6 (these Euro designations are related to fuel Economy and emmisions).
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      11-21-2020, 11:59 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopJimmy View Post
So I'm thinking that the upgraded HPFPs and M5 injectors are for situations where PI is maxed out and you can afford $5-10K for 10% more DI (parts, shop install and tune).

Just having upgraded HPFPs won't make bigger injectors flow more, but bigger injectors might also push stock pumps to their limit too often.

The only way to really know the benefit is by incremental changes with good testing and logging.
I've seen a lot of posts on the M5 forums about injectors failing and getting stuck open. You can't even run more than E30 on F10 M5's so these people are experiencing failure on pump gas. It seems to be a common issue so I'd be hesitant to run them on an M3/4 because they might not handle E85 well at all
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