Anyone else get banned from the G8X section for making fun of its looks?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

Carbon is extra.
Carbon strut pack.

The days of getting awesome stuff for bargain basement pricing is over. Now if you want CF stuff you're going to have to pony up for a CS/GTS/CSL

It seems like people want cooler stuff. Cool stuff costs money. More expensive versions with cooler stuff will be on their way for those who have the means.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by RugbyBro

Somewhat related... but what's the pool on what the "fatal flaw" of S58 is going to be? You know, the one that only the magnificent minds at independent auto shops can fix for you

I need to get in touch with a BMW foreman track friend of mine that has done work/mods on my previous M cars. He mentioned a potential one because I asked him if they fixed the hub issue. He said yes and then a but, I'll see if I can get a hold of him.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by RugbyBro

Somewhat related... but what's the pool on what the "fatal flaw" of S58 is going to be? You know, the one that only the magnificent minds at independent auto shops can fix for you

It's so locked down it will be years before flash tunes are available. Sad but true

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

The days of getting awesome stuff for bargain basement pricing is over. Now if you want CF stuff you're going to have to pony up for a CS/GTS/CSL

It seems like people want cooler stuff. Cool stuff costs money. More expensive versions with cooler stuff will be on their way for those who have the means.

Sad really.

Not only is what we love coming closer to being silent or only wooshing but the prices are only going up making it a sport only for the wealthy if you want theater with your enjoyment.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

The days of getting awesome stuff for bargain basement pricing is over. Now if you want CF stuff you're going to have to pony up for a CS/GTS/CSL

It seems like people want cooler stuff. Cool stuff costs money. More expensive versions with cooler stuff will be on their way for those who have the means.

I'm sure there will be, but if the base product has tepid enthusiasm for it, it doesn't help sales for the more expensive examples.

Edit: Just look at the CS/GTS versions of the F80/82. They didn't sell until massive discounts hit aside from the early adopters of the GTS. And this was with a massive sales hit of the regular F80/82.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

Sad really.

Not only is what we love coming closer to being silent or only wooshing but the prices are only going up making it a sport only for the wealthy if you want theater with your enjoyment.

It's sad, but reading the general forum I get the clear impression people have lots of money. If you look at all the 'I'm leaving BMW and will buy X' comments, X is a brand that is much more expensive than BMW.

It's not like people are saying they are going to buy Mustangs instead.

As people have money to buy cars 2x as expensive, naturally the M3 gets more expensive. It's the only logical move.

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by minn19

Just look at the CS/GTS versions of the F80/82. They didn't sell until massive discounts hit aside from the early adopters of the GTS. And this was with a massive sales hit of the regular F80/82.

Well if it's like me I'd like to daily mine, take it from country to country in a go with climate control and all the doodads while being able to just pull into a track on my way and burn some rubber if I feel like it.

Because that's exactly what I did last summer and when I looked a getting a CS I felt it compromised too much on the daily/livability/comfort aspect, for obvious reasons.

I assume the majority is in my category.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by minn19

I'm sure there will be, but if the base product has tepid enthusiasm for it, it doesn't help sales for the more expensive examples.

Edit: Just look at the CS/GTS versions of the F80/82. They didn't sell until massive discounts hit aside from the early adopters of the GTS. And this was with a massive sales hit of the regular F80/82.

I've been around the forums long enough to know that BMW could build a car that cures world hunger and we'd have a 150 page thread stuffed with 'for that price I'll buy a X' comments.
We don't need to enter hypotheticals all that much. The M2 CS was launched recently and went through the same cycle. The amount of hate and vitriol spewed towards that car on this forum bordered on infinite.
The reactionw followed this progression:
-before pricing was released 'it's going to be a POS'
-once pricing was released: 'it's way too expensive'
-when a mag clocked it faster than a gt4: 'it's still a POS grocery getter'
-when it won Evo COTY: 'i don't care, still a grocery getter, way too expensive'

No matter what they do, the CSL/GTS won't sell well. First, it will get reviewed against a Porsche that costs 50% more but has 'similar sporty intentions'. As logical as comparing a Focus RS against a Veyron because they're both the sportiest versions of their kind.
Then, although you can barely buy a Carrera S for the price of the CSL/GTS, everyone will say they'd rather buy a 992 3RS instead.

There is absolutely no way to win.

*: the X refers to Porsche. Then people ask me why i dislike Porsche so much

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

It's sad, but reading the general forum I get the clear impression people have lots of money. If you look at all the 'I'm leaving BMW and will buy X' comments, X is a brand that is much more expensive than BMW.

It's not like people are saying they are going to buy Mustangs instead.

As people have money to buy cars 2x as expensive, naturally the M3 gets more expensive. It's the only logical move.

I've only seen that "leaving BMW for Porsche" sentiment on forums because here Porches are incredibly expensive (both to purchase and maintain) and leasing is not usually a winning strategy because it's nowhere near how it is in the US.

Right now people are way in over their head buying M2's at age 20 with insane lease prices and insurances.

Luckily I fall outside that category and had money for it and good insurance prices and while I'd like to own a GT3RS one day as I love to drive/track them they are outside of my budget and I usually only have 1 personal vehicle in addition to work vehicles every now and then.

I've always loved them since I was young (M's), and I achieved it with what I think is the best they've done yet, visually, but I also love how it drives as well and it's smiles for miles every time I enter it, it doesn't compare to the GT3RS, hardly anything does but they're not even in the same class and I'm not even considering that car.

M4 was my "dream" since production started, and I'm glad I've achieved it with the F82 before they're gone.

Funnily enough I was considering getting a Mustang too because I love that V8 engine sound but to me that is a league behind in everything else

[minn19]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I've been around the forums long enough to know that BMW could build a car that cures world hunger and we'd have a 150 page thread stuffed with 'for that price I'll buy a ...' comments.
We don't need to enter hypotheticals all that much. The M2 CS was launched recently and went through the same cycle. The amount of hate and vitriol spewed towards that car on this forum bordered on infinite.
The reactionw followed this progression:
-before pricing was released 'it's going to be a POS'
-once pricing was released: 'it's way too expensive'
-when a mag clocked it faster than a gt4: 'it's still a POS grocery getter'
-when it won Evo COTY: 'i don't care, still a grocery getter, way too expensive'

No matter what they do, the CSL/GTS won't sell well. First, it will get reviewed against a Porsche that costs 50% more but has 'similar sporty intentions'. As logical as comparing a Focus RS against a Veyron because they're both the sportiest versions of their kind.
Then, although you can barely buy a Carrera S for the price of the CSL/GTS, everyone will say they'd rather buy a 992 3RS instead.

There is absolutely no way to win.

Somewhat agreed and BMW/people should expect this though when you start pricing stuff into Porsche territory. Most people who can afford a 105-120k M4CS are just going to keep going to a Carrera S because it is a better car that holds its value better. Or say screw it like me who was looking at a manual M2CS and went for the Cayman instead because they were priced similarly.

BMW hurts itself when they try to market themselves as good as Porsche like they did with the CS/GTS. The M3(4) claim to fame has always been the dual usability on a "budget" option to Porsche. They keep eroding that line and upping their prices while not upping their product game. Look at the M8 vs 911 for example. No wonder those are selling like shit. Who would pay 150k for an M8 that is boring as hell to drive when you could have a 911?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

I've only seen that "leaving BMW for Porsche" sentiment on forums because here Porches are incredibly expensive (both to purchase and maintain) and leasing is not usually a winning strategy because it's nowhere near how it is in the US.

Right now people are way in over their head buying M2's at age 20 with insane lease prices and insurances.

Luckily I fall outside that category and had money for it and good insurance prices and while I'd like to own a GT3RS one day as I love to drive/track them they are outside of my budget and I usually only have 1 personal vehicle in addition to work vehicles every now and then.

I've always loved them since I was young (M's), and I achieved it with what I think is the best they've done yet, visually, but I also love how it drives as well and it's smiles for miles every time I enter it, it doesn't compare to the GT3RS, hardly anything does but they're not even in the same class and I'm not even considering that car.

M4 was my "dream", and I'm glad I've achieved it with the F82 before they're gone.

Funnily enough I was considering getting a Mustang too because I love that V8 engine sound but to me that is a league behind in everything else

where are you located?

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by minn19

Somewhat agreed and BMW/people should expect this though when you start pricing stuff into Porsche territory. Most people who can afford a 105-120k M4CS are just going to keep going to a Carrera S because it is a better car that holds its value better. Or say screw it like me who was looking at a manual M2CS and went for the Cayman instead because they were priced similarly.

BMW hurts itself when they try to market themselves as good as POrsche like they did with the CS/GTS. The M3(4) claim to fame has always been the dual usability on a "budget" option to Porsche. They keep eroding that line and upping their prices while not upping product game. Look at the M8 vs 911 for example. No wonder those are selling like shit. Who would pay 150k for an M8 that is boring as heel to drive when you could have a 911?

I don't think they are 'priced like Porsche'. The GTS was 130k, but C&D just tested a base Carrera 4 that was also 130k. Both are '130k', but are completely different cars.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

It's sad, but reading the general forum I get the clear impression people have lots of money. If you look at all the 'I'm leaving BMW and will buy X' comments, X is a brand that is much more expensive than BMW.

It's not like people are saying they are going to buy Mustangs instead.

As people have money to buy cars 2x as expensive, naturally the M3 gets more expensive. It's the only logical move.

I did (GT350) and a Camaro ZL1 1LE to. A lot of others did similar versions of this, especially for the GT350.

More people swap around all brands than you think. At least from what I've seen on other forums. I'm interested in the C8 Z06 when it comes out. The no manual thing really sucks though.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by minn19

I did (GT350) and a Camaro ZL1 1LE to. A lot of others did similar versions of this, especially for the GT350.

More people swap around all brands than you think. At least from what I've seen on other forums. I'm interested in the C8 Z06 when it comes out. The no manual thing really sucks though.

C8 Z06 is interesting. I'm sure it will also be compared to the GT3 RS or at a minimum to the GT3, happily ignoring the epic price gap between them.
Then reviewers will be disappointed that despite costing 60% of the Porsche and providing the same performance, the interior quality is not up to par. Big surprise!

[minn19]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I don't think they are 'priced like Porsche'. The GTS was 130k, but C&D just tested a base Carrera 4 that was also 130k. Both are '130k', but are completely different cars.

M4 CS were 105-120 MSRP. If you can afford that you can afford a 130k Carrera S that is a much better car without the weird option deletes etc. They couldn't sell them until they discounted them below M3/4 comps and then there were the unbelievable lease bargains. That probably being one of many reasons.

A GTS needs a lot of set up to get dialed in. Many don't want to do that so they buy a 911 that out of the box has better/easier attainable performance without all of the setup. And they don't deprecate a ton like the CS/GTS did.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

C8 Z06 is interesting. I'm sure it will also be compared to the GT3 RS or at a minimum to the GT3, happily ignoring the epic price gap between them.
Then reviewers will be disappointed that despite costing 60% of the Porsche and providing the same performance, the interior quality is not up to par. Big surprise!

The price gap always comes up in the mags and forums, especially C6G and M6G.

[White340]

Originally Posted by M3_WC

There would be no restricted airflow. In the middle of the giant factory grills there is black solid bar(essentially creating two separate grills top and bottom like it has always been). You will never have full openings due to crash impact bar. The big grills are a failed styling exercise, nothing more. They are not for increased airflow, they just look like big openings but actually are separated.

I was only joking in that any modification is a way to avoid warranty claims. 👍🏼

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by deeldoo

Does my theory seem legit?

That grill is saving BMW sales, so BMW built the car and realized holy fucking smokes this car looks awful, no way it will sell, unless, unless, we smokescreen it and so they did.

Insert massive grill, everyone averts attention to massive grill, says yuck massive grill. Forgets the rest of the car and says if the grill wasn't so huge maybe i would get one.

Out comes BMW and sponsors small shops to create retrofit bumpers for free, i assume this is a cheap alternative

BMW sells the mistake they made and profits.

As i said this is the prevailing theory on the grill, it was sent there to divert attention, and the bumper solutions are coming out fast so people are very hopeful they can just slap on a 2k bumper and have a sweet M4.

Little do they know, bumper or not, they are focusing on the wrong part of the car.

I know plenty of people who go "if the grill wasn't so big i would get one it looks good otherwise".

Like uh no it doesn't, but there you go, it's all people care about.

The giant tall grills is only on the M3/M4 because they are using it to introduce the design language of which will be on all of BMW’s future EV’s. The EV’s have the big grills to accommodate all the sensors for self driving and what not. They used their iconic car to push the design language mainstream prior to major EV lineup launch. They don’t want people to second guess going EV just because only the EV vehicles have giant tall grills.

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by Tecnniqe

I've only seen that "leaving BMW for Porsche" sentiment on forums because here Porches are incredibly expensive (both to purchase and maintain) and leasing is not usually a winning strategy because it's nowhere near how it is in the US.

Right now people are way in over their head buying M2's at age 20 with insane lease prices and insurances.

Luckily I fall outside that category and had money for it and good insurance prices and while I'd like to own a GT3RS one day as I love to drive/track them they are outside of my budget and I usually only have 1 personal vehicle in addition to work vehicles every now and then.

I've always loved them since I was young (M's), and I achieved it with what I think is the best they've done yet, visually, but I also love how it drives as well and it's smiles for miles every time I enter it, it doesn't compare to the GT3RS, hardly anything does but they're not even in the same class and I'm not even considering that car.

M4 was my "dream" since production started, and I'm glad I've achieved it with the F82 before they're gone.

Funnily enough I was considering getting a Mustang too because I love that V8 engine sound but to me that is a league behind in everything else

I know I am fairly lucky to be able to afford a lot of things without having to worry about it, that's why I am very grateful for my parents because of it. It is also why I don't take it very lightly if I am forced to sell.

However, even with cars in the upper 60k range like our Ms, AMG, RS etc, these cars are still outside the price range for a lot of people. At the end of the day, this is only semantics for us basically.

The strong point for M cars in the past have been they are a very strong bargain for their price and they still are. You should see the bitching on Rennlist because of the fact that a F80/F82/F87 can be as fast as their GT3/GT3RS is a huge sticking point for a lot of them. You should look at the side where the M2CS and the GT4 are head to head on almost every review. A lot of posters there don't like it. Despite my annoyance with the G8x, if I gotten one for free, I wouldn't complain about it. BMW still does their tuning for the ZF8 better than most other companies who has it (other than Porsche). You should drive the ZF8 equipped Audi to see what I mean.

[jpy1980]

You guys see this review before it gets taken off?

[Darth One]

This BMW vs Porsche war infects every thread on this site, it seems. Neither side has a monopoly on trolling, butthurt or insecurity.

It's always amused me as a fan and longtime owner of both brands.

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by Darth One

This BMW vs Porsche war infects every thread on this site, it seems. Neither side has a monopoly on trolling, butthurt or insecurity.

It's always amused me as a fan and longtime owner of both brands.

because it is ThE InTeRneT