Anyone else get banned from the G8X section for making fun of its looks?

[alex2364]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Is this the discount on the new M3/4 you guys are talking about on leasehackr?

9% off

https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/lease...-16/261277/334

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

The rage for the 4-door M3 seems mostly US centric. In Canada, it's the 4-doors that sit longer on lots. If you look at used inventory, the M4 are listed higher on average.

Yep. I always found it a bit funny how different the US market is on these things.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by alex2364

9% off

https://forum.leasehackr.com/t/lease...-16/261277/334

Anyone who buys a G8x is committing financial suicide, at least for the cost of that car - this is a lease only car, the used market is gonna be brutal. I live a norcal area where whenever anything new is released I see one, includes lambos, ferraris, mclarens - I haven't seen a single beaver face model not only where I am, but anywhere.

I also haven't seen any prominently displayed at any of the dealerships I routinely pass, but I'm not looking past the front line - maybe some of the other Bay Area dudes can chip in on Peter Pan, Steven Creek, Mountain View, etc, but I sure haven't seen any near me or on the roads.

I agree with Arcades: California is BMW-country and if we aren't seeing them, then BMW is gonna have a problem no matter what's happening in the rest of the country.


BMW has made a major MAJOR strategic error ... likely the product of number of errors and I'm still convinced that includes some aspirations in the Chinese market ... and the guy driving all this is Elon Musk. With the exception of Porsche, all of the brands are running scared and scrambling to get out innovative products and it's forced Herbert Deiss to bring it out into the open so he can win some political battles and get full control of VW Group.

Porsche has their EV shit dialed, even boosting their stake in Rimac to 25% to cover the hypercar market ...

All the bigs know it won't be long before guys like us are talking about anode and cathode chemistries like we talk about intake & exhaust.

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Anyone who buys a G8x is committing financial suicide, at least for the cost of that car - this is a lease only car, the used market is gonna be brutal. I live a norcal area where whenever anything new is released I see one, includes lambos, ferraris, mclarens - I haven't seen a single beaver face model not only where I am, but anywhere.

I also haven't seen any prominently displayed at any of the dealerships I routinely pass, but I'm not looking past the front line - maybe some of the other Bay Area dudes can chip in on Peter Pan, Steven Creek, Mountain View, etc, but I sure haven't seen any near me or on the roads.

I agree with Arcades: California is BMW-country and if we aren't seeing them, then BMW is gonna have a problem no matter what's happening in the rest of the country.


BMW has made a major MAJOR strategic error ... likely the product of number of errors and I'm still convinced that includes some aspirations in the Chinese market ... and the guy driving all this is Elon Musk. With the exception of Porsche, all of the brands are running scared and scrambling to get out innovative products and it's forced Herbert Deiss to bring it out into the open so he can win some political battles and get full control of VW Group.

Porsche has their EV shit dialed, even boosting their stake in Rimac to 25% to cover the hypercar market ...

All the bigs know it won't be long before guys like us are talking about anode and cathode chemistries like we talk about intake & exhaust.

I will point out something else too.

This is not solely a G8x problem.. This extends to BMW's soon to be released iX and i4 as well since both of those cars (along with what else down the pipeline we don't know about) have this front end design.

Please think about it. In a EV market where BMW is already behind. They now have to deal with Porsche, Tesla, Audi, Ford and even VW itself. All of those brands have something BMW doesn't. A well designed, sleek looking EV car that doesn't scream, "Please for the love of god look at me." I will take a Taycan over the iX any day of the week. Not to mention, Porsche has a pure EV Macan coming out in a year and a half that will also overhaul the Macan once again.

When that happens. BMW is completely screwed because now Porsche will undercut the iX with something less expensive. What's funny is, at this point I buy a i3 over the iX and i4.

[GrussGott]

Hey, speaking of who BMW thinks their core customer is now (Hopefully Sedan_Clan has been growing out his hair ...)




I wonder who Porsche believes their core customer is?

Huh. Interesting.

It's almost like Porsche wants the business of their legacy customers ....

[electrathecat]

I've lived here on the Peninsula in NorCal (essentially in Silicon Valley) for over 20 years. It used to be all European cars around here, including every imaginable kind of Beemer (even Alpinas are pretty common around here). At one point it felt like 1/3 of cars were Beemers, but over the past 6 or 7 years (and especially accelerating the past 18 months) it now feels like that niche has largely been taken over by Teslas. We probably have over 20 Teslas within a half-mile of our house (some homes have multiple Teslas, even 3 of 'em!). In any event, despite Tesla carving out a sizable and growing niche, BMWs are still fairly plentiful. That being said, I have yet to see a new 4-Series Coupe or a new M3/M4 on the road anywhere around these posh parts. Given the sheer amount of bro poseurs, 20-something Dotcom millionaires, and Crazy Rich Asians living and working around here, it's amazing that these cars remain so invisible! I know this is purely anecdotal, but this region is one of the world capitals of frivolously spending your money on decadent, depreciating assets -- ff very few people even around here are buying them, then who will?!?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Hey, speaking of who BMW thinks their core customer is now (Hopefully Sedan_Clan has been growing out his hair ...)

[img]

View post on imgur.com

[/img]

I wonder who Porsche thinks their core customer is?

Huh. Interesting.

It's almost like they want they want the business of their legacy customers ....

Naw, I'm a muscular black dude with a shaved head. No frail tweaker physiques or tweaker hair for me.

FWIW, I saw my first G8X on the road yesterday while patrolling the streets. I've seen plenty of regular 4's. Maybe I'm more exposed since my work involves driving a car around all damn day [specifically looking at/for vehicles] for 10+ hours while most of you are presumably in an office for 8-12 hours. <shrug>

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by electrathecat

I've lived here on the Peninsula in NorCal (essentially in Silicon Valley) for over 20 years. It used to be all European cars around here, including every imaginable kind of Beemer (even Alpinas are pretty common around here). At one point it felt like 1/3 of cars were Beemers, but over the past 6 or 7 years (and especially accelerating the past 18 months) it now feels like that niche has largely been taken over by Teslas. We probably have over 20 Teslas within a half-mile of our house (some homes have multiple Teslas, even 3 of 'em!). In any event, despite Tesla carving out a sizable and growing niche, BMWs are still fairly plentiful. That being said, I have yet to see a new 4-Series Coupe or a new M3/M4 on the road anywhere around these posh parts. Given the sheer amount of bro poseurs, 20-something Dotcom millionaires, and Crazy Rich Asians living and working around here, it's amazing that these cars remain so invisible! I know this is purely anecdotal, but this region is one of the world capitals of frivolously spending your money on decadent, depreciating assets -- ff very few people even around here are buying them, then who will?!?

Whenever I come to the Bay, I see floods of Tesla's everywhere. I don't see Tesla's in the same numbers down here in So.Cal.

[electrathecat]

By the way, a few months ago my daughter and I stopped by the Peter Pan BMW Service Center for some routine maintenance on the family 535i. Peter Pan happened to have a new 4-Series beaver coupe on display right in the middle of the Service Center. As soon as we saw it, my daughter and I were simultaneously horrified at how much worse it looked in person than in any pre-release photos. As we were cracking up about how hideous it was, not one, not two, but THREE different workers there who overheard us each separately remarked how mortified they were that they had to sell/service this porker. They were genuinely embarrassed and apologetic! Just to be clear, I love these Peter Pan guys (they're a great dealership as far as dealerships go, and certainly a lot more trustworthy than the guys at Stevens Creek BMW), but I don't envy their situation of being forced to sell and support a modern-day Aztek at a time when Tesla is already eating their lunch.

[Tecnniqe]

Originally Posted by Arcades

I will point out something else too.

This is not solely a G8x problem.. This extends to BMW's soon to be released iX and i4 as well since both of those cars (along with what else down the pipeline we don't know about) have this front end design.

Please think about it. In a EV market where BMW is already behind. They now have to deal with Porsche, Tesla, Audi, Ford and even VW itself. All of those brands have something BMW doesn't. A well designed, sleek looking EV car that doesn't scream, "Please for the love of god look at me." I will take a Taycan over the iX any day of the week. Not to mention, Porsche has a pure EV Macan coming out in a year and a half that will also overhaul the Macan once again.

When that happens. BMW is completely screwed because now Porsche will undercut the iX with something less expensive. What's funny is, at this point I buy a i3 over the iX and i4.

Hongqi E-HS9 does grills better than BeaverMW

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Whenever I come to the Bay, I see floods of Tesla's everywhere. I don't see Tesla's in the same numbers down here in So.Cal.

The bay area has Tesla early adopters going back a decade & Tesla just doesn't produce that many yet ... this is the reason why BMW is so fucked right now: an ugly iX not out until next year STARTS in the mid-$80s?

A new Taycan Cross Turismo made in Germany is $90k!



Not to mention the new EV Macan will be out by then. BMW is out of their minds with their new design & customer segmentation.

BMW believes people are gonna buy this beaver-face over a Porsche?



Geezus BMW, what's in that Alphorn?

[Mavus]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

The bay area has Tesla early adopters going back a decade & Tesla just doesn't produce that many yet ... this is the reason why BMW is so fucked right now: an ugly iX not out until next year the STARTS in the mid-$80s?

A new Taycan Cross Turismo is $90k!



Not to mention the new EV Macan will be out by then. BMW is out of their minds with their new design & customer segmentation.

also bmw has no credibility in ev market like their I6. Rimac is way more advanced hence why P went after it. Also Buffet invested in Chinese BYD I think. They are quickly falling behind. My take is there are/were many internal conflicts that led to poor strategy and lack of vision. What the hell happened to I8?

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Is this the discount on the new M3/4 you guys are talking about on leasehackr?

No this one. 9% off for order M4s and 5.6% for M3s.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...0k0/edit#gid=0

[CT_M3]

I totally agree! I made this observation a month or two back on this thread; stating that I feared for BMW, going beyond the ugly design of the new cars. (FYI, whenever I show my 12 year old daughter a pic of the new G8x, she yells “Piggy!” And giggles). And mind you, I didn’t give her my opinion prior to this.

This is a major misstep here in the making (actually, the train has already left the station). As we can all see, EV is the rage, Tesla is slipping and the VW group, Ford, GM and others are making the pivot. If BMW slips here, they will cede market share and spend even more resources playing catch up with the pack. I stated that I thought some brands might disappear meaning that some might even get assimilated or just lose relevance which will damage their brand for a long time.

This is what the late Andy Groves from Intel had written about many years ago. “An inflection point” he called it, where pivots or situations occur that require a paradigm switch in what a company does. This is one of them. Companies have to evolve or die. (Only the Paranoid Survive is the book).

“A strategic inflection point is a time in the life of business when its fundamentals are about to change. that change can mean an opportunity to rise to new heights. But it may just as likely signal the beginning of the end”- Andy Groves, Intel.

Originally Posted by GrussGott

The bay area has Tesla early adopters going back a decade & Tesla just doesn't produce that many yet ... this is the reason why BMW is so fucked right now: an ugly iX not out until next year STARTS in the mid-$80s?

A new Taycan Cross Turismo made in Germany is $90k!



Not to mention the new EV Macan will be out by then. BMW is out of their minds with their new design & customer segmentation.

BMW believes people are gonna buy this baaver-face over a Porsche?



Geezus BMW, what's in that Alphorn?

[R N M]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Listened to the Smoking Tire Podcast and they discussed the M4. Some highlighted quotes:

[Matt]Its f**king ugly, its really, a really ugly car. Its 100lbs lighter, and 2.5 inches shorter, but 2.8 inches more wheelbase and is 1.4 inches wider, and has more passenger volume than the 2006 M6. It drives as you expect it to drive, there weren't any surprises for me... The manual is pretty much the defining characteristic of this car. Without the stick, it would have been very meh.

[Zack]I was surprised at how much better it sounded outside as you were going down the canyons... The M4 has taken the place of the old M6 as the executive coupe, the M8 is just way too expensive now.

[Matt]I don't really see a real reason to get an M4, because the M2 is just as fast, functionally, the 4 might be faster on a big track, maybe, but the M2 is smaller, more nimble, and more fun, with a still usable backseat, is wayyy better looking! and has real gauages, M4 gauges take away from the specialness. The only reason to get an M4 is for the bigger backseat, but then you'd get the M3. I don't see where this car is supposed to go. If I needed a backseat I'd get the X3M.

[Zack]People usually get the two door because its more stylish, but now... its not. [Matt] Now the X3 and M2 is the best looking one. [Matt and Zach] I'd just get a C63 Coupe at that point.

[Matt]Powerband is better, no more 2500rpm burnouts. Very wide powerband, I think first is a bit short (driving around city use). God bless BMW for the manual, but its just a bit in the middle. 8 is huge and numb, 2 has agility and feel, this is somewhere in the middle.

[Matt]Now that the M4 is gone, I'm not, "oooh I wanna drive it," its just kind of like, alright. Our M4 was getting close to $100k. [Zach and Matt] I couldn't look at it everyday, its just really ugly. I was driving this car, and I could see people visually disgusted with the looks, they gave it a "ah, ew," its the new "oh Jesus they ruined it." Oh but black hides it is everyone's excuse, and with a euro plate is probably the best you can do.

[Zach]Frank Stephenson said it best, "I don't understand how it got this way." I just don't get it. [Matt] How good would it have to drive to look fine? [Zach] I don't think it can do that. I'd put a lot of weight into how a car looks. Its important to me. [Matt] The Civic Type-R is the only car that drives well enough for me to like the looks.

[Zach] The M4 is not good at doing everything. The steering feel is very meh, [Matt] BMW has really affirmed my love for the Type-R, especially when it comes to the steering. [Zach] I missed the Telluride more when I returned it, and I'm not even someone who needs a three row.

They then go to talk about the X6M press car they have and take viewer questions. They mentioned that they didn't test and auto M3, but have driven it in the M5 and X3M and X6M and find it nice, but not a DCT. Overall, it sounds like they weren't very impressed with the M4 other than its offering of a manual transmission, and they can't get past the design no matter how good. Video should drop sometime next week after Monday most likely.

*Edit* Reupload as I forgot to add more quotes.

Ye just watched this on YouTube.
He REALLY doesn’t like the styling lol. Finally someone not afraid to speak the truth. He said he could see other people’s negative reactions to the front when he was driving around town - go to 39min mark in vid - hilarious!

His overall take on the driving experience is Meh - he did like the manual.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by R N M

Ye just watched this on YouTube.
He REALLY doesn’t like the styling lol. Finally someone not afraid to speak the truth. He said he could see other people’s negative reactions to the front when he was driving around town - go to 39min mark in vid - hilarious!

His overall take on the driving experience is Meh - he did like the manual.

For anyone who clicks on this you have to rewind but yeah wow. Drops an F bomb about how ugly it is 10s into the chat.

[FormulaMMM]

Originally Posted by R N M

He said he could see other people’s negative reactions to the front when he was driving around town - go to 39min mark in vid - hilarious!

Yeah. Mayday, mayday, BMW.

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

The bay area has Tesla early adopters going back a decade & Tesla just doesn't produce that many yet ... this is the reason why BMW is so fucked right now: an ugly iX [COLOR="Blue"]not out until next year[/COLOR] STARTS in the mid-$80s?

A new Taycan Cross Turismo made in Germany is $90k!

[img]

View post on imgur.com

[/img]

Not to mention the new EV Macan will be out by then. BMW is out of their minds with their new design & customer segmentation.

BMW believes people are gonna buy this baaver-face over a Porsche?

[img]

View post on imgur.com

[/img]

Geezus BMW, what's in that Alphorn?

[img]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._in_Wallis.jpg[/img]

The base Porsche Taycan MSRP undercuts the BMW iX also at 79k.

[Fugly M3]

I saw a Taycan Cross Turismo just yesterday on the road...awesome looking car!

[White340]

I'm seeing more and more you tubers saying they've bought the car (joe, autotopnl, SnewJ etc). I wonder if Bmw just gave them the car to use for 2 years. I really don't believe that they all bought the car with their own money given how polarized the design is... what are the chances they all just happen to love the design..

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by White340

I'm seeing more and more you tubers saying they've bought the car (joe, autotopnl, SnewJ etc). I wonder if Bmw just gave them the car to use for 2 years. I really don't believe that they all bought the car with their own money given how polarized the design is... what are the chances they all just happen to love the design..

Well Joe will buy anything with a BMW badge on it, AutoTopNL is buying it purely for the S58 and its tuning abilities, and I have no idea who the other guy is. To be honest its smart on their part, will likely get them a bunch of views for a period of time.

[RugbyBro]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Whenever I come to the Bay, I see floods of Tesla's everywhere. I don't see Tesla's in the same numbers down here in So.Cal.

Lots of Tesla cultists up here