Next Few Track Oriented Upgrades Suggestions?

[OG Shark]

Originally Posted by NYG

What kind of cooling? My F8x was a street car so I'm really interested to see if your race builds had similar (or more/different) focus for heat management.

I'm hoping to get an F8x again one day and turn it into a track only car. The oil/water cooling system in the car was amazing on my street car so the only two components that I know I'd want to tackle would be brakes and the DCT. Are there others I should be aware of?

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

I haven't had any cooling issues at all. The setup is pretty safe and solid. DCT has also been solid and I haven't done a thing to it. I had my car at the dealer recently for something unrelated, asked them to change the DCT fluid because I have tracked the car frequently and they said it wasn't necessary yet

Yeah heat management is definitely going to be situationally dependent as well. The oem setup does a good job already - and if not having any issues no reason to upgrade. At COTA I can push my M2C into higher than desired engine temp ranges even in stock trim and on MP4S. Same thing with the DCT - will start to get sloppy and laggy. A cool down lap would be needed to reset but then good to go from there. On slicks would have to do at least two cool downs per session. Key here is at COTA - this wouldn’t happen at my other local track - not near as hard on the car as COTA is. Also in Texas - high ambient temps. So definitely situational- just a thought of something else maybe to look at in case you are seeing some elevated temps.

All in all though - definitely a solid stock cooling system. Even getting some higher temps I was very happy with it. The paces we were running would make the stock E92 M3 and N55 M2 system surrender on the outlaps.

[MetalsMan]

Thinking I may opt for the 9660 kit! I've seen plenty of good reviews and the kit looks like a solid and well built setup. Probably the best next upgrade for track weekend performance, aside from roll cage, race seat, etc or aero mods at this point.

[bimmerboyE92]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

Hey Guys
So, have tracked my f80 plenty. Looking for some suggestions on what some of you have done with your car that you noticed made an impact at the track, ie roll bar, seats, harnesses, brake kits, suspension, etc.
Here is what I run currently:
Stock Engine, Bootmod3 Stage 2 OTS Tune, Akrapovic Down Pipes
Replaced bushings on front sway
MCS One Way Setup
TC Kline Plates
Front Adjustable Endlinks
Brake Fluid and Track Pads
Race Tires and Wheels
Schroth Quick Fit

That's pretty much it. My front brakes are pretty discolored, so was thinking brake kit, maybe some type of aero, or additional suspension upgrades

Appreciate the thoughts.

Met you at NCM once. Wife and I had her F80 there.

Thrust arm monoballs. Just get the ones that are pre-installed. No alignment needed.

https://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-4...nstalled-arms/

Also, change DCT fluid to redline DTC fluid and overfill by up to 1 quart. I just jacked up car and pumped as fast as I could and stuck the drain plug back on when refilling. Shifts "cleaner", but noticeable on track for me.

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by bimmerboyE92

Met you at NCM once. Wife and I had her F80 there.

Thrust arm monoballs. Just get the ones that are pre-installed. No alignment needed.

https://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-4...nstalled-arms/

Also, change DCT fluid to redline DTC fluid and overfill by up to 1 quart. I just jacked up car and pumped as fast as I could and stuck the drain plug back on when refilling. Shifts "cleaner", but noticeable on track for me.

Hey man,
Yep I remember - black M with the roll cage. Appreciate the insight. Will definitely look into those thrust arm monoballs. I have been wanting to further upgrade the front setup as it seems the overall design places different parts in a constant bind if that makes sense.

Appreciate the advice on the DCT also - I've been thinking with the number of laps I have put this car through, it's gotta need it. When the dealer told me it was all good, I was a little surprised

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by bimmerboyE92

Met you at NCM once. Wife and I had her F80 there.

Thrust arm monoballs. Just get the ones that are pre-installed. No alignment needed.

https://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-4...nstalled-arms/

Also, change DCT fluid to redline DTC fluid and overfill by up to 1 quart. I just jacked up car and pumped as fast as I could and stuck the drain plug back on when refilling. Shifts "cleaner", but noticeable on track for me.

You do a complete change, filter and all, or just drain and refill fluid?

[Gomeler]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

Thinking I may opt for the 9660 kit! I've seen plenty of good reviews and the kit looks like a solid and well built setup. Probably the best next upgrade for track weekend performance, aside from roll cage, race seat, etc or aero mods at this point.

Just get the 9668 or the Bimmerworld Alcon 25mm calipers. Add some airflow and you've solved your braking for the platform. I know SYT_Shadow will tell you your car will explode Fast and the Furious style with AP vs the Alcon setup, but in my opinion either kit is a huge step forward over the stock setup.

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by Gomeler

Just get the 9668 or the Bimmerworld Alcon 25mm calipers. Add some airflow and you've solved your braking for the platform. I know SYT_Shadow will tell you your car will explode Fast and the Furious style with AP vs the Alcon setup, but in my opinion either kit is a huge step forward over the stock setup.

+1

You're doing yourself a major disservice with 9660. Strongly encourage the investment for the endurance pad kits mentioned above.

[bimmerboyE92]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

You do a complete change, filter and all, or just drain and refill fluid?

I did the filter on the side only. The one that does not require dropping the trans pan. This filter is the one I changed.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...er-28107842840

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by Gomeler

Just get the 9668 or the Bimmerworld Alcon 25mm calipers. Add some airflow and you've solved your braking for the platform. I know SYT_Shadow will tell you your car will explode Fast and the Furious style with AP vs the Alcon setup, but in my opinion either kit is a huge step forward over the stock setup.

LOL

Either are a massive improvement over stock, massive indeed. One is more massive than the other, but both are good for sure

I've wondered if I had sniffed too much CO from catless track cars and why I had issues with a kit that other people are happy with. Fortunately, earlier this year a AP kit guy who is faster than me came to the same tracks and then sent their data afterwards. Looking at the speed graphs all my questions were answered, as I'm putting *way* more energy into the braking system per lap than he is. One day when I have some time to burn I'll post up the data.

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by bimmerboyE92

I did the filter on the side only. The one that does not require dropping the trans pan. This filter is the one I changed.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...er-28107842840

Cool - Thanks!

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by DRLane

+1

You're doing yourself a major disservice with 9660. Strongly encourage the investment for the endurance pad kits mentioned above.

AP says the 9668 isn't totally necessary unless endurance racing - so not sure if really needed, though may be more desired if/when I resale

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

AP says the 9668 isn't totally necessary unless endurance racing - so not sure if really needed, though may be more desired if/when I resale

You're going to go through a lot more pads in the 9660 and the offering isn't as great. The 7790 pad shape in 25mm on the 9668 is the same pad as most NASCAR teams and therefore the options are endless.

The 18mm pad will also wear much faster and transmit more heat into the caliper.

The 9660 is definitely the lighter option but again you're doing yourself a disservice to ongoing consumable costs.

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by DRLane

You're going to go through a lot more pads in the 9660 and the offering isn't as great. The 7790 pad shape in 25mm on the 9668 is the same pad as most NASCAR teams and therefore the options are endless.

The 18mm pad will also wear much faster and transmit more heat into the caliper.

The 9660 is definitely the lighter option but again you're doing yourself a disservice to ongoing consumable costs.

Figured that would be the argument, and if so you've got me sold! Appreciate the advice. Just ordered the monoball thrust arms also

[bimmerboyE92]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

AP says the 9668 isn't totally necessary unless endurance racing - so not sure if really needed, though may be more desired if/when I resale

I debated this as well and ultimately went with the thicker pad option and have no regrets. The pads hardly taper and can literally be used down to the backing plates.

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by bimmerboyE92

I debated this as well and ultimately went with the thicker pad option and have no regrets. The pads hardly taper and can literally be used down to the backing plates.

Are you swapping pads for track events? My car isn't a daily, but I swap out my PFC track pads after every event due to how much noise they make. AP recommended Ferodo pads. I'd like to just leave them in the caliper even when using the car around down.

Once again - appreciate all of the feedback. Sometimes you start a thread and it gets derailed with off topic subjects or simply don't find anyone interested or with experience. This one has been helpful

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

Are you swapping pads for track events? My car isn't a daily, but I swap out my PFC track pads after every event due to how much noise they make. AP recommended Ferodo pads. I'd like to just leave them in the caliper even when using the car around down.

Once again - appreciate all of the feedback. Sometimes you start a thread and it gets derailed with off topic subjects or simply don't find anyone interested or with experience. This one has been helpful

I leave PFC11 pads in my BBKs year round, very quiet

[MetalsMan]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I leave PFC11 pads in my BBKs year round, very quiet

Good to know - maybe I go with those and forgo the Ferodos

Been very happy with the PFC products

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by MetalsMan

Good to know - maybe I go with those and forgo the Ferodos

Been very happy with the PFC products

Their pads are fantastic.

I am migrating to the 331 PFC compound but every time I touch the brakes in town I regret it

[MaX PL]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

LOL

Either are a massive improvement over stock, massive indeed. One is more massive than the other, but both are good for sure

I've wondered if I had sniffed too much CO from catless track cars and why I had issues with a kit that other people are happy with. Fortunately, earlier this year a AP kit guy who is faster than me came to the same tracks and then sent their data afterwards. Looking at the speed graphs all my questions were answered, as I'm putting *way* more energy into the braking system per lap than he is. One day when I have some time to burn I'll post up the data.

Didn't you switch from AP to Alcon, and now from the sound of things, you're saying AP is better?

I think I remember you saying the AP rotors wear quickly. Is that still the case from your knowledge or have they improved?
I read your comments in another thread about pairing girodiscs with the AP calipers as well so just wondering what the current situation with AP j hooks is based on your knowledge.

Thanks for any info.

[SYT_Shadow]

Originally Posted by MaX PL

Didn't you switch from AP to Alcon, and now from the sound of things, you're saying AP is better?

I think I remember you saying the AP rotors wear quickly. Is that still the case from your knowledge or have they improved?
I read your comments in another thread about pairing girodiscs with the AP calipers as well so just wondering what the current situation with AP j hooks is based on your knowledge.

Thanks for any info.

I had PFC on the E9X generation, had AP on the F8X and was not happy with the experience. I took them off after 4 events.
I'm on Alcon now, they are great.

The issues I had with the AP is pad taper unbecoming of a top tier BBK as well as poor rotor life.
They say they've improved rotor life and that may be true. I did not stick around to find out.

What I meant earlier is I meet people with APs who are happy, but they are not using the kit to its potential so their happiness doesn't mean much.
In an instance this year, a time trialer here in the forum who is faster than me and is happy with his APs came over and we exchanged data.

His car is lightened, has similar power and also aero. This means top speed is significantly lower than me, whereas minimum speed thanks to aero is significantly faster.
When you look at the speed traces it is a dramatic difference.

So my conclusion is I am not going crazy. When it comes to braking performance, people faster than me are putting significantly less energy into the brakes than I am because they are lightened and run massive aero.

To put it another way, the people happy with AP put much less heat into them and say they perform flawlessly. I put much more heat into PFC, AP and Alcon and only the APs have issues.

As alcon and ap cost the same, it's an easy choice in favor of Alcon

[bimmerboyE92]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

I had PFC on the E9X generation, had AP on the F8X and was not happy with the experience. I took them off after 4 events.
I'm on Alcon now, they are great.

The issues I had with the AP is pad taper unbecoming of a top tier BBK as well as poor rotor life.
They say they've improved rotor life and that may be true. I did not stick around to find out.

What I meant earlier is I meet people with APs who are happy, but they are not using the kit to its potential so their happiness doesn't mean much.
In an instance this year, a time trialer here in the forum who is faster than me and is happy with his APs came over and we exchanged data.

His car is lightened, has similar power and also aero. This means top speed is significantly lower than me, whereas minimum speed thanks to aero is significantly faster.
When you look at the speed traces it is a dramatic difference.

So my conclusion is I am not going crazy. When it comes to braking performance, people faster than me are putting significantly less energy into the brakes than I am because they are lightened and run massive aero.

To put it another way, the people happy with AP put much less heat into them and say they perform flawlessly. I put much more heat into PFC, AP and Alcon and only the APs have issues.

As alcon and ap cost the same, it's an easy choice in favor of Alcon

I was only getting one set of front rotors to one set of 9668 DTC-70 pads. However, the newest rotors have a different J hook pattern so we'll see if they last longer.

[biofluke]

I am on the newly redesigned set of Essex/AP Rotors.

So far, yes, they seem to last longer. But only about 50% longer. My first set of rotors (old design) lasted about 5 track days, the same as my pads (3 of those at Watkins though which is notoriously hard on brakes with the 2 long straightaways). One of my pads actually partially broke and sheered off during the last session of the day even due to the heat buildup. I didn't even notice it until I got home the next day.

I have now finished about 7 track days with the new redesign. Swapped out my pads once mid-event after 4.5 days, but the rotors are starting to look cooked again. My fingernail is starting to get stuck in the cracks, which is when they say you should swap them. So we're looking at around a 50% increased life with the redesign, roughly.

The performance of the kit has been great. However, with the cost of the Ferodo 3.12s, and the rotors, it's not a cheap kit to run. This is a front-heavy car as is, and I always knew I'd be burning through consumables... but not at this rate.

I plan on contacting bimmerworld before next season to try to figure out which Girodisc would work for these like their GT4 teams are using. I'll report back.