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      01-07-2020, 04:24 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f80er View Post
Looking at used prices for M3s is still boggling to me. Because when I look to trade mine the offers are shit compared to what dealers and some private parties are asking for. I know trade-in is always less than ideal but never before I have seen such a widespread between the two on a car that I owned.
The platform is in a weird transition point right now where production has ended, auction values are on the decline but dealers are still moving used models and inflated prices. At least for M3s.
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      01-16-2020, 01:40 PM   #68
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Just got a good deal on a '15 M4

Alpine White
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Every single option besides CCB
1 Owner, 30k miles.

Landed the deal @ $35k.
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      01-16-2020, 02:03 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allinon72 View Post
The platform is in a weird transition point right now where production has ended, auction values are on the decline but dealers are still moving used models and inflated prices. At least for M3s.
I am thinking once the G80 is revealed and orders are placed that will be the end of that. It likely only exists currently due to the out of production factor but also the official M3 nomenclature.
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      01-16-2020, 04:11 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coleb423 View Post
Just got a good deal on a '15 M4

Alpine White
Sahkir Interior
Every single option besides CCB
1 Owner, 30k miles.

Landed the deal @ $35k.
You got a good deal. That is a fair price for what you got...not a screaming deal, but fair.
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      01-16-2020, 04:12 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkal2 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by allinon72 View Post
The platform is in a weird transition point right now where production has ended, auction values are on the decline but dealers are still moving used models and inflated prices. At least for M3s.
I am thinking once the G80 is revealed and orders are placed that will be the end of that. It likely only exists currently due to the out of production factor but also the official M3 nomenclature.
You are correct. This happens with every generation of m3 sedan because the sedan stops production a year or more before the next generation appears.
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      01-16-2020, 04:22 PM   #72
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Decided to keep my M4, and put a little money in, added carbon fiiber mirror cover and spoiler (breaks up white), spacers on order and MHD Tune to be installed.

Porsches do hold value. My 2007 Carrera S had msrp of 100k, worth about 40k now, more than my 16 M4.
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      01-17-2020, 12:37 AM   #73
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They are coming out with newer 2020 m4's with touch screen. The m4 can be bought for in the 30k range. Which is what I wanted for my m3. But couldnt find that price range. Eventually bought a zcp with hud. It's so nice.
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      01-17-2020, 08:22 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by M3classic View Post
They are coming out with newer 2020 m4's with touch screen. The m4 can be bought for in the 30k range. Which is what I wanted for my m3. But couldnt find that price range. Eventually bought a zcp with hud. It's so nice.
My 2018 M3 has a touch screen. Nothing new there.
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      01-17-2020, 02:13 PM   #75
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This is something I've said before - but I think I actually mean it this time - I think i'm going to keep this car for a while. As others have mentioned, at some point I can see myself getting a second car and modding the s*** outta this thing to have as a track car or speeding ticket machine.
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      01-17-2020, 02:51 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f80er View Post
My 2018 M3 has a touch screen. Nothing new there.
My 2018 M4 does not. Guess you guys got shafted on the rear comfort access while I did on the touch screen haha
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      01-17-2020, 02:55 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
M4's will rebound in a couple years as most buyers now want 4 doors but that won't be the case when these become weekend only cars instead of daily commute cars for some. The M4's have excellent rear seats room despite being a 2 door.

DCT will also rebound because it's no longer made in the newer cars just autos now. But right now 15 m4's are tanking quite significantly and have become excellent buys

I have a 15 and what I did was go at it with the best upgrades I can find and I will enjoy it for years to come and/or it will translate to higher value on the market if anyone ever wants to buy it in the future
I think there's subzero chance DCT's will rebound.

In every single generation M car, if you want good resale value you need to go light on options and get the manual.
15 years after production the cars everyone wants are cloth seats, minimal options, manual
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      01-17-2020, 03:00 PM   #78
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I agree cloth and manual but even still in the cars lifecycle those are desirable. I remember in the e46 M days I lusted over the cloth but needed up with leather . And even SMG e46s are being converted to 6MTs to this day.

If I did get another f80 today I would want manual w/carbon structure.
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      01-17-2020, 03:10 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
I think there's subzero chance DCT's will rebound.

In every single generation M car, if you want good resale value you need to go light on options and get the manual.
15 years after production the cars everyone wants are cloth seats, minimal options, manual
This is probably true but we are relying on E46 data that involves SMG, not dct
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      01-17-2020, 03:35 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
This is probably true but we are relying on E46 data that involves SMG, not dct
I'm also interested to see how the generational differences start coming into play as less and less people learn to drive a manual.
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      01-17-2020, 03:48 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
This is probably true but we are relying on E46 data that involves SMG, not dct
E9X information is identical to E46M and the E9X had a wonderful DCT
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      01-17-2020, 03:56 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
E9X information is identical to E46M and the E9X had a wonderful DCT
False, DCT is more in demand than smg
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      01-17-2020, 04:03 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
False, DCT is more in demand than smg
I'm not sure what you mean

If right now you look for E9Xs with less than 60k miles and for less than 30k, almost every single one is DCT.

Here are the links if you don't believe me

E9X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...us=0#486275786

F8X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...&firstRecord=0


Just like in every generation M car, DCT/SMG/Auto/whatever_is_not_manual depreciates way faster

Right now if you look for cheap E46Ms they almost invariably are SMG
Right now if you look for cheap E9XMs they almost invariably are DCT
Right now if you look for cheap F8XMs they almost invariable are DCT

Do you see where this is going? Does anyone care to guess what is going to happen with the G8X?

My CS is DCT and so is my E90 stroker. I love DCT. That doesn't change the fact that the DCT cars would be worth a lot more if they were manual. Fortunately I have a manual E92 as well.
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      01-17-2020, 04:31 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
I'm not sure what you mean

If right now you look for E9Xs with less than 60k miles and for less than 30k, almost every single one is DCT.

Here are the links if you don't believe me

E9X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...us=0#486275786

F8X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...&firstRecord=0


Just like in every generation M car, DCT/SMG/Auto/whatever_is_not_manual depreciates way faster

Right now if you look for cheap E46Ms they almost invariably are SMG
Right now if you look for cheap E9XMs they almost invariably are DCT
Right now if you look for cheap F8XMs they almost invariable are DCT

Do you see where this is going? Does anyone care to guess what is going to happen with the G8X?

My CS is DCT and so is my E90 stroker. I love DCT. That doesn't change the fact that the DCT cars would be worth a lot more if they were manual. Fortunately I have a manual E92 as well.
E46 Manual is significantly more expensive than the E46 SMG. Used price difference is about a 100% increase. But this is because a lot of people who wanted this car as a teenager couldn't get one, and manual transmissions were much more popular back then.

E92 Manual is significantly more RARE but not significantly more expensive than the E92 DCT. Manuals also have less mileage for many reasons. Used price difference is about a 33% difference. I bought and sold my E92 M3 6MT at a great time, I ended up earning ~$4000 CAD after 3 years of ownership, but the prices now are slowly dropping. By the time E9X M3's were released, manuals were already dying and only true car enthusiasts would get one.
*EDIT* Actually, looking at the prices today for the first time in a whole year, DCT price average is 31k and 6MT price average is 36k. Less than 15%.

Hard to say for F8X platform, but my guess would be that in 7 years (2008 m3 is 12 years old, 2015 m4 + 12 years is 2027(2027-2020=7), the price difference will be even less between a DCT F8X and a manual F8X, I want to say at most a 20% difference.

The whole manual thing is phasing out, a higher number of next generation used M3/M4 owners will actually prefer a DCT. These "kids" grew up in an era where DCT = faster, versus back then when manual = faster.

Electric cars are becoming very popular as well, and let's face it, this will only drop the value of all gas-powered cars.

I know one thing for sure though, avoid convertibles if you're thinking about resell value.
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Last edited by wonton1017; 01-18-2020 at 01:38 PM..
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      01-18-2020, 09:13 AM   #85
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" the cars everyone wants are cloth seats, minimal options, manual"

Simply not true. 10 people want an M3/M4, 7 want dct and 3 want manual. However, manual supply is half that of dct so manuals hold value a little bit better because of supply and demand, not because this is what "everyone" wants. Plus lightly optioned cars always go cheaper.
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      01-18-2020, 09:17 AM   #86
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My Florida based car retailer has 9 M3/M4s:

M3s:

2017 Manual 44k
2017 Manual 43k
2016 DCT 42k
2016 DCT 39k

M4s:

2017 Coupe DCT 44k
2017 Coupe DCT 42k
2017 Coupe DCT 43k
2016 Vert DCT 40k
2016 Vert DCT 40k

https://www.offleaseonly.com/
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      01-18-2020, 09:25 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aBMWfan View Post
False, DCT is more in demand than smg
I'm not sure what you mean

If right now you look for E9Xs with less than 60k miles and for less than 30k, almost every single one is DCT.

Here are the links if you don't believe me

E9X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...us=0#486275786

F8X:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...;firstRecord=0


Just like in every generation M car, DCT/SMG/Auto/whatever_is_not_manual depreciates way faster

Right now if you look for cheap E46Ms they almost invariably are SMG
Right now if you look for cheap E9XMs they almost invariably are DCT
Right now if you look for cheap F8XMs they almost invariable are DCT

Do you see where this is going? Does anyone care to guess what is going to happen with the G8X?

My CS is DCT and so is my E90 stroker. I love DCT. That doesn't change the fact that the DCT cars would be worth a lot more if they were manual. Fortunately I have a manual E92 as well.
There are some other variables here. First - the SMG was horrible and expensive to fix, which is partially why values are lower.

The F series around here, and as well as nationwide from what I've seen, the manuals are almost always lower priced because they are harder to move. I don't expect this to change over time.
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      01-18-2020, 12:55 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f80er View Post
I agree cloth and manual but even still in the cars lifecycle those are desirable. I remember in the e46 M days I lusted over the cloth but needed up with leather . And even SMG e46s are being converted to 6MTs to this day.

If I did get another f80 today I would want manual w/carbon structure.
Hmmm, sounds familiar... I couldn't agree with you more. One of the reasons I got an F80 M3 w/6MT and cloth seats....

But regarding the comments on the E46 M3 SMG vs 6MT values. I also think the thing that really hurt the SMG value vs 6MT (and why you see quite a few 6MT conversions) is the poor reliability of the SMG. The SMG pump, which is the heart of the SMG, have not fared well over the years and are still ridiculously expensive to this day. The DCT in the F8x appears to be more reliable transmission tech.....
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