Another crankhub failure...

[GuyLedouche]

So what were the codes on OPs car? This situation is confusing as hell, minus the fact that OP is a total fan boy of SSR.

[Chase__M4]

Originally Posted by horsepower_and_hounds

Chase, that was not a dig towards you I am just trying to dig into my past experience. It used to be you had to remove a piggyback before you flashed or the flash would fail..... not sure if that is the case on the pass thru setting. That would be a question for BM3.

I just want to be clear that the failure is not due to their tune...... maybe due to a tune. The guys at Protuningfreaks are some of the best in the business and try to make stable strong safe tunes......

Something just seems slightly cocked that is all.....

Yeah I’m not blaming anyone here for what happened it’s just a misfortunate event. I’m fairly confident now that it was a mixture of the two tunes. Again I’m just trying to give my own story so I’m glad a lot of these guys were able to help me unravel the real issue. Bm3 is still the way to go and is what I will be running when I get the car back but I’m sorry to everyone reading this if I wasn’t clear on everything. I just found out it had the JB4 when I dropped it off for the crankhub fix. At the end of the day I am just glad it wasn’t more extensive damage and I will now have the crankhub fix. I will try to possibly get the codes and if I have anymore info as to how this happened I’ll update when I find out!

[Chase__M4]

Originally Posted by blockdoc

I know you are just kind joking. But you won't be anywhere near 700 WHP on 91 with a stage 2 tune....not without upgraded turbos and much much better fuel lol (race gas, E85 with a tune, +/- methanol)

But I am glad your engine is still fine and you have a good team (SSR) taking care of her!

I know lol, the plan is stage 2+ with e85 after I upgrade to bigger wheels! Thank you I am very happy with how the situation ended up regardless of what caused what and all.

[RElias21]

I have no issue with OP's intent to provide the forum with additional SCH information to help owners make educated decisions.

I also have no issue with his loyalty to SSR. By many accounts, they are a standup shop that does solid work.

I just think the facts are vastly incomplete, which actually renders his particular situation quite unhelpful to forum members, barring filling in the missing facts.

Some of them, however, cannot be known, when you buy a lease return with a previous tune.

(1) How many leased cars do you think get abused/beat on like crazy? But, Do you really think the previous owner put a tune on a leased car to drive it softly?
(2) What are the codes like many are asking (that can be determined)?
(3) what are the effects of stacking two tunes together (especially when you do t know about the previous tune)?

As good as OP's intent may be, this car just can't be a case study in view of at least how blind you are to the previous owner, i.e., everything in your initial post about how YOU drove it is really irrelevant.

What bugs me the most though is that you appeared to be somewhat cognizant that the car wasn't stock and made absolutely no mention of that in your initial post. That was a bit disappointing.

[Mintsopoulos]

For future purchasers of these cars, is there any way tell if there has been a flash/tune that was previously done to the vehicle? Something like this instance where there was a JB4 flash but it wasn't technically caught until SSR got their hands on it.

OP said the car seemed odd from the beginning but is there anyway he could've definitively tell it was previously toyed with?

For the guys wanting to do a BM3, myself included, how can you go about making sure you dont throw a tune on top of another one?

[Chase__M4]

Originally Posted by GuyLedouche

So what were the codes on OPs car? This situation is confusing as hell, minus the fact that OP is a total fan boy of SSR.

“Intake and exhaust camshaft angle deviation with respect to crankshaft” was a specific code given to indicate SCH. Shah just let me know. I also HAD NO IDEA about the JB4 before purchasing this car from a dealership and had no idea when I was flashing BM3 stage 1, just wanted to clear that up for everyone. I also did not have a scanner handy on the side of the freeway so again I do not have access to all the codes at this time.

[Chase__M4]

Originally Posted by Mintsopoulos

For future purchasers of these cars, is there any way tell if there has been a flash/tune that was previously done to the vehicle? Something like this instance where there was a JB4 flash but it wasn't technically caught until SSR got their hands on it.

OP said the car seemed odd from the beginning but is there anyway he could've definitively tell it was previously toyed with?

For the guys wanting to do a BM3, myself included, how can you go about making sure you dont throw a tune on top of another one?

Correction, the car seemed odd immediately after putting a stage 1 tune. However, the car did seem a little faster than I thought it would after initial purchase.

[Mintsopoulos]

Originally Posted by Chase__M4

Correction, the car seemed odd immediately after putting a stage 1 tune. However, the car did seem a little faster than I thought it would after initial purchase.

Gotcha. Well either way, my question remains the same...is there any definitive way to avoid putting a tune on top of tune.

[SSR Performance]

Originally Posted by blockdoc

I know you are just kind joking. But you won't be anywhere near 700 WHP on 91 with a stage 2 tune....not without upgraded turbos and much much better fuel lol (race gas, E85 with a tune, +/- methanol)

But I am glad your engine is still fine and you have a good team (SSR) taking care of her!

Agreed! And thank you brother!! Appreciate the support. We will be getting her back on the road in no time.

Originally Posted by GuyLedouche

So what were the codes on OPs car? This situation is confusing as hell, minus the fact that OP is a total fan boy of SSR.

OP went ahead and chimed in on this a couple posts above. I will never post a customer vehicle's fault codes on a public forum for everyone to see. If Chase is comfortable talking about it then he will.

Originally Posted by RElias21

I have no issue with OP's intent to provide the forum with additional SCH information to help owners make educated decisions.

I also have no issue with his loyalty to SSR. By many accounts, they are a standup shop that does solid work.

I just think the facts are vastly incomplete, which actually renders his particular situation quite unhelpful to forum members, barring filling in the missing facts.

Some of them, however, cannot be known, when you buy a lease return with a previous tune.

(1) How many leased cars do you think get abused/beat on like crazy? But, Do you really think the previous owner put a tune on a leased car to drive it softly?
(2) What are the codes like many are asking (that can be determined)?
(3) what are the effects of stacking two tunes together (especially when you do t know about the previous tune)?

As good as OP's intent may be, this car just can't be a case study in view of at least how blind you are to the previous owner, i.e., everything in your initial post about how YOU drove it is really irrelevant.

What bugs me the most though is that you appeared to be somewhat cognizant that the car wasn't stock and made absolutely no mention of that in your initial post. That was a bit disappointing.

Thank you sir!!! This is the only post I am seeing on this whole thread of back and forth that seems to be trying to come to a logical / helpful conclusion.

1) The car must've been driven and not babied. Pretty sure that is safe to assume.

2) OP (Chase) went ahead and posted it above. Most commonly seen codes for a spun crank hub. Almost every single car that comes in with spun hub will have these codes.

3) The effect in this case would be increased boost / increased power above the level of just a stage 1 flash (WHICH IN THIS CASE WAS NOT THE CASE AND I WILL EXPLAIN WHY IN MY NEXT POST)

Originally Posted by Mintsopoulos

Gotcha. Well either way, my question remains the same...is there any definitive way to avoid putting a tune on top of tune.

JB4 will ALWAYS take over unless the tuner is set to map 0 or completely disabled for that matter. Therefore, the flash would not even go through in the first place. I'm going to make another post below to go into further detail on this matter below.

Shah @ SSR Performance

[Fuel-It!]

Originally Posted by SSR Performance

JB4 will ALWAYS take over unless the tuner is set to map 0 or completely disabled for that matter. Therefore, the flash would not even go through in the first place. I'm going to make another post below to go into further detail on this matter below.

Shah @ SSR Performance

That isn't correct. With a JB4 if you unplug it from the OBDII port you can load any flash you want regardless of JB4 map or settings. So you'd want to ensure you have the right setting in the JB4 for factory or aftermarket flash, to avoid over-doing things.

[SSR Performance]

Originally Posted by Fuel-It!

That isn't correct. With a JB4 if you unplug it from the OBDII port you can load any flash you want regardless of JB4 map or settings. So you'd want to ensure you have the right setting in the JB4 for factory or aftermarket flash, to avoid over-doing things.

I haven't tested this recently myself, however that is completely the opposite of what I was told when I spoke to one of the head developers of Bootmod3 just less than 30 minutes ago. Let me see if I can get some further clarification on this from them.

Not saying that you are wrong by any means but I won't be able to confirm the contrary until I test it myself.

I do recall in the past that I have had multiple flashes fail due to JB4 not being in Map 0 when attempting to flash Bootmod3 maps. Considering that OBD was disconnected since ENET was plugged straight into OBD I would assume things may have changed recently if what you are saying is in fact the case?

Shah @ SSR Performance

[Mintsopoulos]

Originally Posted by Fuel-It!

That isn't correct. With a JB4 if you unplug it from the OBDII port you can load any flash you want regardless of JB4 map or settings. So you'd want to ensure you have the right setting in the JB4 for factory or aftermarket flash, to avoid over-doing things.

Well actually I just thought to myself...if you have a car with JB4 and you go ahead and flash a BM3, wouldnt the BM3 Completely override all the tables that were set with the JB4...therefore making it impossible to put a tune on a tune?

Unless there are certain tables that do not get touched in each tune for example...fuel trims get touched in jb4 but not bm3, you would be dealing with a new tune on top of modified jb4 fuel trims (Just a random table i came up with, not saying this is factual) Which could potentially be disastrous.

[SSR Performance]

Originally Posted by Mintsopoulos

Well actually I just thought to myself...if you have a car with JB4 and you go ahead and flash a BM3, wouldnt the BM3 Completely override all the tables that were set with the JB4...therefore making it impossible to put a tune on a tune?

Unless there are certain tables that do not get touched in each tune for example...fuel trims get touched in jb4 but not bm3, you would be dealing with a new tune on top of modified jb4 fuel trims (Just a random table i came up with, not saying this is factual) Which could potentially be disastrous.

No, because the JB4 changes values between the sensors in real time. Based on my understanding it will disregard any adjustments by a flash tune considering that it is just supposed to adjust those values by a set amount.

JB4 does not change or adjust any tables on the DME itself, unlike a flash tune.

Shah @ SSR Performance

[Mintsopoulos]

Originally Posted by SSR Performance

No, because the JB4 changes values between the sensors in real time. Based on my understanding it will disregard any adjustments by a flash tune considering that it is just supposed to adjust those values by a set amount.

JB4 does not change or adjust any tables on the DME itself, unlike a flash tune.

Shah @ SSR Performance

Gotcha. So then say youre car had a JB4 prior to you purchasing that vehicle but it was never put back to factory or "0", how could you go about doing so?

[GuyLedouche]

Originally Posted by Mintsopoulos

Gotcha. So then say youre car had a JB4 prior to you purchasing that vehicle but it was never put back to factory or "0", how could you go about doing so?

Jb is a piggyback. You just unplug it and it's gone.

[SSR Performance]

Originally Posted by GuyLedouche

Jb is a piggyback. You just unplug it and it's gone.

What he said.

You just remove the unit completely and it's gone. Its a physical piece of hardware with wiring that can be fully removed.

Shah @ SSR Performance

[Mintsopoulos]

Originally Posted by SSR Performance

What he said.

You just remove the unit completely and it's gone. Its a physical piece of hardware with wiring that can be fully removed.

Shah @ SSR Performance

I guess i was confused by chase stating that you guys found that it had a jb4 from the previous the owner but I guess if you dont check the you wouldnt see it...?

I just assumed the previous owner had removed it and there were some "tuning" changes that were still lingering even after removal.

[SSR Performance]

Originally Posted by Mintsopoulos

I guess i was confused by chase stating that you guys found that it had a jb4 from the previous the owner but I guess if you dont check the you wouldnt see it...?

I just assumed the previous owner had removed it and there were some "tuning" changes that were still lingering even after removal.

Nope. It physically was left installed on the vehicle. Which, to the untrained eye, can easily go undetected very easily.

Shah @ SSR Performance

[SickGTR]

If they are really doing the shit they say before giving a car the CPO title, they should know. It's not about seeing the tune or anything like that. My good friend is a master tech for BMW ( travels all around the country ) All they do when investigating any type of major issue is check the log of the car and see what PSI you are hitting. So if stock is 18 and your banging 24, you are fucked. All these tunes that say undetectable means nothing. Those days are gone. The dealer can find out soooo much info when they dig in.

[LATTES]

How Interesting t is, dealer told me BMW doesn't like CPO a M car cause it's expensive. And now CPO couldn't give people a peace of mind. Seems a good way to sale for more money, damn

[Fuel-It!]

Originally Posted by SSR Performance

No, because the JB4 changes values between the sensors in real time. Based on my understanding it will disregard any adjustments by a flash tune considering that it is just supposed to adjust those values by a set amount.

JB4 does not change or adjust any tables on the DME itself, unlike a flash tune.

Shah @ SSR Performance

The JB4 uses CANbus to read the factory boost target and depending on the JB4 settings either ignores that flash boost target and runs it's own boost target, or adds on a additive factor to the factory target.

[Sherhart]

Originally Posted by SickGTR

If they are really doing the shit they say before giving a car the CPO title, they should know. It's not about seeing the tune or anything like that. My good friend is a master tech for BMW ( travels all around the country ) All they do when investigating any type of major issue is check the log of the car and see what PSI you are hitting. So if stock is 18 and your banging 24, you are fucked. All these tunes that say undetectable means nothing. Those days are gone. The dealer can find out soooo much info when they dig in.

This is true for tunes, but not JB4 since it intercepts the boost signal and tricks the car into thinking it is seeing stock boost levels. Not sure which one you're referring to here since both are on the car.

Jim