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      06-30-2015, 10:09 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketBoots View Post
Thanks I may hit you up with some questions. I also have 6MT. What do you have in your car currently?



Thanks for the update. Soooo..... which one will you keep?

Also, have you noticed any more traction issues with ESS over JB4?

I had just about eliminated JB4 for myself, since I wanted mainly a 'set it and forget it' tune that offered max reliability. JB4 seemed to allow the most tinkering, Dinan the least (and is too expensive); ESS might have been just right. But then one of the forum members switched from ESS to JB4, saying ESS wasn't very linear or had some problems or something. And I also realized you can just tinker JB4 to make it very conservative. Which left me even more
I have JB4 on my car and actually feel the opposite of pigwet. I didn't like the ESS e-tronics much at all and it didn't have the SOTP feel JB4 had. I only left it on my car about 2 weeks before switching back. I tried it on multiple maps and power settings running 100 octane mix. It made decent low end tq on the dyno but fell off massively where the JB4 held steady.

I will be getting a 2016 in a couple months and I will be giving the ESS flash tune a try. Until then I'll stick w/ JB4. Not sure there is a better piggyback solution even with the 6MT not being tested as much with the OBD features.

I also agree the ESS install was more difficult and messier than JB4. Not sure why they decided to mount the hardware where the brake booster is but it's a mess.
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      06-30-2015, 01:06 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmk08 View Post
I have JB4 on my car and actually feel the opposite of pigwet. I didn't like the ESS e-tronics much at all and it didn't have the SOTP feel JB4 had. I only left it on my car about 2 weeks before switching back. I tried it on multiple maps and power settings running 100 octane mix. It made decent low end tq on the dyno but fell off massively where the JB4 held steady.

I will be getting a 2016 in a couple months and I will be giving the ESS flash tune a try. Until then I'll stick w/ JB4. Not sure there is a better piggyback solution even with the 6MT not being tested as much with the OBD features.

I also agree the ESS install was more difficult and messier than JB4. Not sure why they decided to mount the hardware where the brake booster is but it's a mess.
Both of BMS's cars are DCT but PURE TURBO has a JB4 M4 and I know BMS borrows it from time to time for development. What is the issue with your MT features? Throw a note in their //M forum I'm sure they'd love to work with you to fix it.

Mike
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      07-15-2015, 11:41 AM   #113
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Great work and good thread!
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      07-18-2015, 10:25 PM   #114
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What I've noticed after of few weeks of the ESS is that it is definitely quirky when the car is not warmed up. Push the gas too hard and the car jerks when it is cold. It seems to go away with the high torque map vs. the linear map though. Haven't explored the 3rd normal map yet. Keep in mind I'm at high elevation during the summer so things get complicated. Once it is warmed up it is great.

I did not experience this with the JB4 - mainly used map 1. The high torque ESS map feels (and sounds) like the JB4 map 1 (+4psi for all RPM) but I don't know what the ESS maps do.

I have not yet fully explored the +- settings on the ESS. On the linear stage when I set it to +3 it jerked a lot even when the car was warm. So perhaps setting it negative will smooth it out.
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      01-22-2016, 11:28 AM   #115
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I know this may be off topic, but I had just dyno'd my m4 with the dinan stage 2 and exhaust yesterday, and was extremely disappointed by the results. I will attach photos of the graph, but the first three pulls were in 4th gear, and the last one was in 5th. I atleast expected my car to be in the 450whp range. Traction control was off also, I am not sure if there is something that could be keeping the car from hitting peak #'s.
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      01-22-2016, 12:07 PM   #116
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Here is the dyno graph
Attached Images
 
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      01-22-2016, 02:35 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMetro64@aol.com
Here is the dyno graph
We're all 4 runs with the dinan upgrades? The difference between run 1 and 4 is pretty big, as if the car was still adapting. How long did you have the dinan upgrades on for before dynoing?
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      01-22-2016, 02:40 PM   #118
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I had the upgrades put on in July, and the exhaust put on a couple days ago. But the 4th run was in 5th gear, while the first three were in 4th gear
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      01-22-2016, 08:10 PM   #119
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JMetro, I posted a response to the exact same question you pasted in this thread as well. http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...6&postcount=53

Maybe open your own thread with your question as off topics are not the best method.

I will add this. Was your expectation also based on the exhaust you put on? What exhaust do you have? Also please let us know if you have a DCT or 6spd and if you changed the rims and/or tires out from the stock 19"
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      01-22-2016, 08:26 PM   #120
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it was the Dinan exhaust, stock rims/tires, just dinan stage 2 and a DCT transmission. I tried to open a new thread, but my account is too new to do so as of now.
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      01-22-2016, 08:32 PM   #121
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And thank you for the above article! I found it very informing for sure!
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      01-22-2016, 09:05 PM   #122
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I'll be posting responses in the other thread.
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      05-26-2016, 04:58 PM   #123
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Good thread, by the way
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      07-19-2016, 10:20 AM   #124
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Is there another thread (I can't seem to find one) summarizing the other tunes (e.g., GIAC) which I guess are "flash" type?

Thanks.
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      07-19-2016, 11:48 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingChicane
Is there another thread (I can't seem to find one) summarizing the other tunes (e.g., GIAC) which I guess are "flash" type?

Thanks.
The flash table would have less info on it since nobody truly knows what the different companies touch in terms of "files" in the ecu.

All we would really get is hp, tq, and price for the different stages each one offers.
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      07-20-2016, 06:02 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingChicane
Is there another thread (I can't seem to find one) summarizing the other tunes (e.g., GIAC) which I guess are "flash" type?

Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MThree_driver
The flash table would have less info on it since nobody truly knows what the different companies touch in terms of "files" in the ecu.

All we would really get is hp, tq, and price for the different stages each one offers.

We inquired previously about being added to this thread as well: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...une+Comparison

As MThree_driver mentioned, the basic data that can be shared is , HP / TQ / Price, but we can also share Boost Levels / Performance and Acoustic Features / availability of Program Switching or Optional Stage Power Levels / Installation Process / Notable Dealers and Locations for Customer Service / etc...

While many of the actual calibration strategies may be proprietary, there's enough categories that can be addressed to identify discerning differences between brands.
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      10-21-2017, 08:41 AM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raysspl View Post
Anyone got feedback on standalone ECUs?

Any updates on standalone ecs?
Why are these better?
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      06-25-2018, 05:09 PM   #128
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by parabmw View Post
Any updates on standalone ecs?
Why are these better?
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      10-04-2018, 01:13 PM   #129
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Do you guys feel that the OEM tires on the M3/M4 isn't wide enough to get a good grip at launch? I feel like I must upgrade the tires to 10.5 width, otherwise upgrading the ECU with the added HP will mean nothing if you don't have traction.
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      05-17-2019, 09:13 PM   #130
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JB4 OTW!!!!!
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      06-21-2019, 11:56 AM   #131
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Jb4 for sale

Is anyone interested in a JB4 with bluetooth connect kit? It was installed for about 4-5k miles. Willing to ship, 550 OBO
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      05-25-2020, 04:50 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pigwet View Post
*TABLE*

Help complete the table!
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

*SUMMARY*

Tunes that only access MAP/TMAP sensors (BMS Stage 1, BMS JB4 set to MAP 1)
--the simplest approach
--without access to RPM, it can only supply a constant increase in added boost for all RPM, in this case +4psi
--the car will get cranky at some added boost level (greater than +4psi or so = +40-50 whp) and the HP gains are limited by this

Another group that accesses MAP/TMAP/CAMSHAFT (Vivid, Turner, Tuning Tech, Active Autowerkes)
--access to RPM through CAMSHAFT gives ability to adjust boost with RPM

Another group that accesses MAP/TMAP/CAMSHAFT/MAF (DTE/ESS/ & maybe Velos)
--access to RPM through CAMSHAFT gives ability to adjust boost with RPM
--the MAF gives them the ability to avoid some potential codes a higher boost levels
--the MAF also reportedly gives the ability to improve shifting smoothness

One tune that accesses MAP/TMAP/Fuel Mass/Wastegate and CANbus (BMS JB4)
--this gives access to all of the above and much more
--enables ability to do fancy things like switch maps from steering wheel and open exhaust valves
--enables data logging capabilities
--enables much higher power tunes/mods including methanol and larger turbos
--includes a code reader & clearer
--the 1st map is very simple additive +4psi map and does not require connecting to CANbus (called STAGE 1)
--the 2nd and 3rd maps are still additive maps but +psi varies with RPM, requiring connecting to CANbus (called STAGE 2)
--the 4th map is for diagnostics
--the higher maps are riskier absolute (not additive) maps meant for higher octane fuels, larger turbos, etc. (called STAGE 3)
--the higher maps may require connection to wastegate and fuel mass sensors

And finally the DINAN
--rather than plugging into individual sensors, it plugs directly into the MDE/ECU which is below and in front of the intercooler
--only 14 or so wires are intercepted, so not all wires going into ECU are addressed as stated in their videos
--not clear how this approach differs from BMS, but it is more difficult to install and only a qualified installer/dealer can do it
--comes w/o firmware loaded, adding time to installation

From what I gather, the BMS JB4 offers everything the DINAN may someday offer for the F80/F82 - but currently the JB4 offers significantly more tuning and data logging options than any other tune.



*ORIGINAL*

I'm trying to better understand piggybacks and the different signals they adjust. For example, Dinan speaks a lot about adjusting the waste gate and sluggishness during gear shifts whereas others do not. ESS uses the MAF whereas others do not.

In particular, I'm interested in the ability of these tunes to work as designed at high altitudes. There appears to be a difference between MAF & MAP based versus MAP only tunes according to discussions here: http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=224799

I'm compiling a summary table and would appreciate it if you can check for accuracy in each product & column. If a column should be added, please suggest it. As always, please reference your input with a link to the manufacturers website, manufacturers thread, or manufacturers instructions/image/PDF etc.

Thanks!

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Wow, thanks for taking the time to post this! Very helpful indeed.
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