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      10-22-2018, 10:10 PM   #23
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Before I bought my '16 M3, I wanted to test drive one. I was already 99% sure I'd buy one. I went to Leith in Raleigh, told the CA that I intended to buy an M3 with ED & would like to have a short test drive. Also told the CA that I might or might not buy from Leith but since they were the closest dealer that would be consideration. No problem, I had a test drive with a Genius. For what it's worth, I'm not young & arrived in my e36 M3.
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      10-22-2018, 10:26 PM   #24
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Add me to the list of stealership haters. BMW in south Austin tried to bull shit the paperwork and misled me until I caught it last minute. Spoke with GM there and he was the most arrogant fuck I've ever met. Bought 6 new M cars over the past 3 years and they didn't give a shit. Which is fine, but didn't expect the deceptive practices and the smug and arrogant condescending GM. Walked out and told them to go fuck themselves. Ended up buying from BMW in grapevine Texas where they were very humble and pleasant to deal with.
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      10-25-2018, 03:00 PM   #25
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Ms are for special people not anyone", to would you like to take it for a drive.
LOL, M cars are as common as they come these days
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      10-25-2018, 04:26 PM   #26
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I’ve only ever had a good experience with either car enthusiast or brand new on the job sales people. It doesn’t help that I look young and dress like a scrub when I go into dealerships.
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      11-01-2018, 09:23 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by M2 Pilot View Post
Before I bought my '16 M3, I wanted to test drive one. I was already 99% sure I'd buy one. I went to Leith in Raleigh, told the CA that I intended to buy an M3 with ED & would like to have a short test drive. Also told the CA that I might or might not buy from Leith but since they were the closest dealer that would be consideration. No problem, I had a test drive with a Genius. For what it's worth, I'm not young & arrived in my e36 M3.
I went to Leith and while the sales person was fantastic, they obfuscated the numbers way too much on the leasing quotes. So I called Southpoint and got escalated to the sales manager when I told the sales person I was ready to buy right away. We were able to work out a deal in about 20 minutes with no BS.

I'm glad you had a good experience there - I really liked the person I was working with before I left so I feel bad about that.
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      11-02-2018, 12:24 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by WoodKnuckle View Post
OK I must vent here! I am an owner of a 2016 M3 (purchased new) and I am in my early 40's. Love the car, it was my dream to own one.
Like many of you have experienced, you get the itch to upgrade. I have visited 2 dealers one to see an m3 CS and another to see an M4 CS and a M5. I got to say, I was treated like I was some punk off the street that was looking to do nothing but go for a joy ride (I did not expect a test Drive). The first dealer did not even talk to me and the second made me wait 4 min for a new cars sales person to meet me at the front desk and after he walked up he said "got a question", no introduction, I asked my question and he said the car sold and proceeded to walk away.


So you think Porsche may want my money?


Very disappointed.
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      11-02-2018, 02:44 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
Add me to the list of stealership haters. BMW in south Austin tried to bull shit the paperwork and misled me until I caught it last minute. Spoke with GM there and he was the most arrogant fuck I've ever met. Bought 6 new M cars over the past 3 years and they didn't give a shit. Which is fine, but didn't expect the deceptive practices and the smug and arrogant condescending GM. Walked out and told them to go fuck themselves. Ended up buying from BMW in grapevine Texas where they were very humble and pleasant to deal with.
There are only 1 or 2 good BMW dealers in Texas. I'm from Houston and have gone to San Antonio to buy 2 of my last 3 BMWs.
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      11-02-2018, 10:19 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
Add me to the list of stealership haters. BMW in south Austin tried to bull shit the paperwork and misled me until I caught it last minute. Spoke with GM there and he was the most arrogant fuck I've ever met. Bought 6 new M cars over the past 3 years and they didn't give a shit. Which is fine, but didn't expect the deceptive practices and the smug and arrogant condescending GM. Walked out and told them to go fuck themselves. Ended up buying from BMW in grapevine Texas where they were very humble and pleasant to deal with.
There are only 1 or 2 good BMW dealers in Texas. I'm from Houston and have gone to San Antonio to buy 2 of my last 3 BMWs.
Sewell in grapevine wasn't bad. They were pretty straightforward except for trying to sneak in a 1500 bull shit service that I repeatedly told them I didn't want.

Which one do you recommend?
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      11-03-2018, 12:04 AM   #31
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Sewell in grapevine wasn't bad. They were pretty straightforward except for trying to sneak in a 1500 bull shit service that I repeatedly told them I didn't want.

Which one do you recommend?
I have a really good person at BMW of San Antonio that I would highly recommend. -Josh Barazza. He is manager now. Good CA and Sales Manager make all the difference.
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      11-03-2018, 10:22 AM   #32
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I absolutely hate dealing with salesmen All those stupid games of going van and forth with their manager, bs fees, blah, blah. Bought my last 2 cars using only email and it was by far the easiest transaction I've had. That said, I wish all manufacturers were like Tesla and Apple. Yes, Apple because you know the price is fixed no matter where you go. No haggling and all that bs waste of a day and ruining your weekend. Tesla allows you whatever test drive you want and then you just build and pay for the car. End of story.
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      11-04-2018, 12:08 PM   #33
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OP, it could be the area?

We picked up my wife's Mini out there in the Detroit area - negotiated all with email and phone call and drove out. Not only were they not prepared, but they didn't cover one thing on the car with us - basically said "we pulled it up over there, sorry, we have a golf outing to get to and have to leave - call us if you have questions."

Never quite had an experience like that. Wait, local BMW dealer would not return my texts or calls last December as I tried to buy one of their M3s. I ended up purchasing it from St. Louis - yes, they dealer traded, trucked the car 5 hours from my house, and I then went and bought it there. Same damn car I had test driven down the street.

Maybe its me
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      11-05-2018, 12:09 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by ///M/// View Post
I absolutely hate dealing with salesmen All those stupid games of going van and forth with their manager, bs fees, blah, blah. Bought my last 2 cars using only email and it was by far the easiest transaction I've had. That said, I wish all manufacturers were like Tesla and Apple. Yes, Apple because you know the price is fixed no matter where you go. No haggling and all that bs waste of a day and ruining your weekend. Tesla allows you whatever test drive you want and then you just build and pay for the car. End of story.
There can be straightforward CA's and good sales reps, it comes down to the individual. Your experience can vary directly by the personality and who you are dealing with. So many people have negative opinions of salesmen, because that is the industry stereotype. People are taught to come in with their guard up, and that the "stealership" and salesmen are there to screw you over.

Bottom line they are a business like any other. They are there to make $$ and a profit. No different than any other business. The difference in the car industry is that it is one of the last industries where customers feel they can negotiate a deal. The negotiating and haggling dynamic comes from both sides. You want the best deal, and they want to sell for profit. A lot of CA's are also on straight commission, so got to give it to them for at least trying to make money in a competitive market, but of course you know the odds are always in the buyers favor.

Yes, if every car manufacturer was like Apple where the price is the price, it would save the haggling back and forth. Then again it would also mean that you could have a lesser experience. If they are getting paid the same regardless to what they sell and how they treat you, why would they care to make it more premium. Then there's some people that actually like the sport of it. They want to feel like they've won something and car sales is one of few remaining industries you can still negotiate on price.
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      11-05-2018, 12:46 PM   #35
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Greenwich BMW is great for service... BUT FOR SALES, biggest assholes ever
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      11-05-2018, 01:41 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmosMpower View Post
LOL, M cars are as common as they come these days
Counterpoint: An M car is the most special vehicle your dealer has to offer.
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      11-05-2018, 01:42 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by IDBGOD View Post
There can be straightforward CA's and good sales reps, it comes down to the individual. Your experience can vary directly by the personality and who you are dealing with. So many people have negative opinions of salesmen, because that is the industry stereotype. People are taught to come in with their guard up, and that the "stealership" and salesmen are there to screw you over.

Bottom line they are a business like any other. They are there to make $$ and a profit. No different than any other business. The difference in the car industry is that it is one of the last industries where customers feel they can negotiate a deal. The negotiating and haggling dynamic comes from both sides. You want the best deal, and they want to sell for profit. A lot of CA's are also on straight commission, so got to give it to them for at least trying to make money in a competitive market, but of course you know the odds are always in the buyers favor.

Yes, if every car manufacturer was like Apple where the price is the price, it would save the haggling back and forth. Then again it would also mean that you could have a lesser experience. If they are getting paid the same regardless to what they sell and how they treat you, why would they care to make it more premium. Then there's some people that actually like the sport of it. They want to feel like they've won something and car sales is one of few remaining industries you can still negotiate on price.
I have never ever felt that I got a lesser experience going to Tesla. It depends on how the company treats their employees and if they are happy/proud to work there. Apple and Tesla employees are always more than eager to help. For my 2016 M3, I bought it and did everything over email with the car delivered in Munich and then in South Carolina. Never met the salesman. Best experience ever. The common things here was that the employees at both locations worked for BMW and were not salesmen.
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      11-05-2018, 04:35 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by ///M/// View Post
I have never ever felt that I got a lesser experience going to Tesla. It depends on how the company treats their employees and if they are happy/proud to work there. Apple and Tesla employees are always more than eager to help. For my 2016 M3, I bought it and did everything over email with the car delivered in Munich and then in South Carolina. Never met the salesman. Best experience ever. The common things here was that the employees at both locations worked for BMW and were not salesmen.
Indeed. Since dealerships are more or less basically franchises it really comes down to the specific dealership and sales rep rather than the brand as a whole. BMW isn't paying the sales people, the dealerships are so the experience is going to depend on that dealership and its employees.

Doing everything over email clearly worked for you and you were happy. On the contrary, I have had fantastic experiences at various BMW dealerships that I have dealt with buying cars in person. Again...it just comes down to who you are dealing with and what kind of experience they give.

If you don't like the haggling you did it right going through email. Just come right out of the gate to the sales manager and say you are shopping and what is their price. You either take that deal or you take it and buy somewhere else. Makes it pretty easy and stress free if you fear the personal experience of buying in person prior to any agreement.
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      11-05-2018, 08:49 PM   #39
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Indeed. Since dealerships are more or less basically franchises it really comes down to the specific dealership and sales rep rather than the brand as a whole. BMW isn't paying the sales people, the dealerships are so the experience is going to depend on that dealership and its employees.

Doing everything over email clearly worked for you and you were happy. On the contrary, I have had fantastic experiences at various BMW dealerships that I have dealt with buying cars in person. Again...it just comes down to who you are dealing with and what kind of experience they give.

If you don't like the haggling you did it right going through email. Just come right out of the gate to the sales manager and say you are shopping and what is their price. You either take that deal or you take it and buy somewhere else. Makes it pretty easy and stress free if you fear the personal experience of buying in person prior to any agreement.
I agree with what you are saying but that's not the point I was making. Whatever you stated makes sense as they are a franchise and not BMW. My point was to do away with franchises and be like Tesla. Then you have a much much higher likelihood of having a good experience. With dealerships having a good experience is more an exception than the norm.

And talking of Sales Managers I have often found them to be the bigger arrogant asshole. Even when you want to pay asking price, the slime balls try to rip you off in the misc fees and paperwork. Their reputation is well deserved.

Cheers.
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      11-06-2018, 09:07 AM   #40
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Counterpoint: An M car is the most special vehicle your dealer has to offer.
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      11-06-2018, 09:48 AM   #41
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      11-07-2018, 03:12 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by ///M/// View Post
I agree with what you are saying but that's not the point I was making. Whatever you stated makes sense as they are a franchise and not BMW. My point was to do away with franchises and be like Tesla. Then you have a much much higher likelihood of having a good experience. With dealerships having a good experience is more an exception than the norm.

And talking of Sales Managers I have often found them to be the bigger arrogant asshole. Even when you want to pay asking price, the slime balls try to rip you off in the misc fees and paperwork. Their reputation is well deserved.

Cheers.
Unfortunately I don't ever really see the auto industry as a whole adapting to the Apple and Tesla's philosophy. So the best you can do is find a dealer and a sales rep you like and stay clear of those that you don't. Or just go buy a Tesla.

You always read about dealer horror stories online, and you say that a good experience is more than an exception than the norm. I personally disagree with your statement but if that is what your life experiences have taught you and that is your opinion then I respect that.

Sales managers, again all comes down to the person you are dealing with once again. People are people.

The misc fees are basically dealer fee, state taxes, and new tag/transfer. Pretty standard really at any dealership. Those are all things you can find out up front as well before you even step foot into a dealership if you so choose.
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      11-07-2018, 05:03 PM   #43
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Unfortunately I don't ever really see the auto industry as a whole adapting to the Apple and Tesla's philosophy. So the best you can do is find a dealer and a sales rep you like and stay clear of those that you don't. Or just go buy a Tesla.

You always read about dealer horror stories online, and you say that a good experience is more than an exception than the norm. I personally disagree with your statement but if that is what your life experiences have taught you and that is your opinion then I respect that.

Sales managers, again all comes down to the person you are dealing with once again. People are people.

The misc fees are basically dealer fee, state taxes, and new tag/transfer. Pretty standard really at any dealership. Those are all things you can find out up front as well before you even step foot into a dealership if you so choose.
Appreciate the comments. One last point I’d like to clarify. I understand what fees consist of. It’s dealers who screw customers on the fees is what I am talking about. To the everyday novice buyer, they will give the impression that they are giving a good deal and talk only about the price of the car only to throw in ridiculous amounts of dealer fees. This is separate from tax, tag and title. I have seen dealer fees (admin, fedex, paperwork, etc.) range from $160 to $1000.
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      11-09-2018, 03:58 PM   #44
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Appreciate the comments. One last point I’d like to clarify. I understand what fees consist of. It’s dealers who screw customers on the fees is what I am talking about. To the everyday novice buyer, they will give the impression that they are giving a good deal and talk only about the price of the car only to throw in ridiculous amounts of dealer fees. This is separate from tax, tag and title. I have seen dealer fees (admin, fedex, paperwork, etc.) range from $160 to $1000.
The dealer fee is entirely profit absolutely. But every dealer charges some kind of dealer fee. It's company policy at many places and even though most people don't want to pay it...bottom line every dealership will typically have some sort of dealer fee or dealer service fee that is assessed in addition to standard taxes/tag, and title.

My dealership for instance charges a $797 dealer fee. They are neither the lowest nor highest out of the other BMW dealerships in my area. The dealer fee is also something the salesperson typically doesn't see a dime of so negotiating and haggling over that is just coming directly out of your CA's commission if he has to adjust the price to compensate.

I also know for a fact that even dealership employees in some cases also have to pay the dealer fee so it's not just the customer.

We can disagree with it and the practice all we want (I also agree it's bs) but the bottom line is if you own the dealership you can charge whatever dealer fee/misc. fees you want. You don't have to buy there or they can choose to move $$ around to make you happy and keep the deal. Again, all of these fees can be accounted for up front also before you even step in or waste your time going into a dealership.
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