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      04-23-2020, 08:55 PM   #1
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BMW Broker here, Ask Me Anything about car leases/purchases!

Hi, I'm Dan!

My user ID for the business is new, but I'm a longtime lurker/member as well on here. Like most of you on the forums, I do a ton of research on every car I purchase and value real feedback from real owners.

In a very short time, I've built up a network of 15 BMW dealers, and I do the lion's share of all BMW deals on a popular leasing forum website. I myself sell 80+ BMWs per month, and I've learned a lot about what works and what doesn't work.

There is a lot of misinformation on this forum that is either anecdotal or a true unicorn deal when all the stars lined up on one particular car buying day.

I hope to clear the air and pull back the curtain on some of the shady ways car dealers try to make money off unsuspecting buyers.

To start:

----5-6% is invoice for BMWs depending on where you live. Dealers do not lose money if they sell you a car under invoice.

----12% is triple-net-zero for dealers just to move a unit. They are losing money on your deal with the hopes of hitting a BMW bonus tier. For some high volume dealers, they must sell over 200 cars that month to get a $500- $1000 bonus on every car sold that month.

-----Flagship money is a hidden incentive to move certain models. It's specific to the production date of the car sometimes. For example, an 2020 M8 built in 2019 has $10,000 flagship compared to a $2000 for a 2020 M8 built in 2020!
Be sure to ask the forum or dealer if there is any flagship money you should be aware of!

For non-M cars, your goal should be 10-12% off before incentives/rebates AND a base money factor.

Dealers can easily make the discount look better if they mark up the money factor.

ASK AWAY! I'll do my absolute best not to self-promote and keep it educational and fun!

Last edited by Next Level Auto Brokers; 11-12-2020 at 02:20 PM..
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      04-23-2020, 09:42 PM   #2
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Not sure if you have any experience with this, but if I'm interested in a new car on the other side of the country and would need it shipped for delivery, how do I make sure there's no cosmetic damage like scratches, dents, etc., before signing for it other than taking their word for it? Would I have any recourse if it gets delivered less than mint?
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      04-23-2020, 10:13 PM   #3
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Most reliable shipping companies do a walk around the car before loading it on the truck notating any scratch or damage on their condition report. They may even take close-up pictures of key areas like hood, windshield, bumpers that are most at risk of damage during transport. The dealer will also have a condition report that they can have the trucker sign before loading it. I would also ask for extensive pictures from the dealer as well.


Do a thorough walk around the car when the trucker takes it off the truck. If you don't get on a clear day or if you get it at night, meet the trucker at a well lit location and look it over.

Don't just sign for it even though you are super excited to jump in your new car and power slide it out of your driveway!

If you see any issues not on the condition report, either refuse delivery or tell the driver to notate it so you can file a claim for it.

If it's a nice enough car, ship it in an enclosed container to minimize the risk of damage.

If it's a lease, maybe buy the excess wear and tear coverage so if there is damage, you are covered.

It's a little nerve racking, but 99/100 these cross country transports end up fine.
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      04-23-2020, 11:12 PM   #4
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So on a '20 M4 with mid/late '19 build still in dealer inventory, the flagship money could be significant? Great thread btw, thanks
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      04-23-2020, 11:25 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTM09 View Post
So on a '20 M4 with mid/late '19 build still in dealer inventory, the flagship money could be significant? Great thread btw, thanks

Thanks!

no sorry, it's specific to M8s not M4s
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      04-23-2020, 11:44 PM   #6
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The CS has pretty large hidden money tho right ?
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      04-24-2020, 12:43 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTM09 View Post
The CS has pretty large hidden money tho right ?
$8k in flagship this month!
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      04-24-2020, 01:44 AM   #8
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Wow thanks for sharing your knowledge with us!!

What percentage should we aim for loaner cars with less than 5k miles.
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      04-24-2020, 02:56 AM   #9
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      04-24-2020, 06:03 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRtoE92 View Post
Wow thanks for sharing your knowledge with us!!

What percentage should we aim for loaner cars with less than 5k miles.
As a general rule, a loaner dealer discount before any rebate should be greater than 15% off.

16-17% off great deal
18-20% off amazing deal
20+% off unicorn deal
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      04-24-2020, 10:21 AM   #11
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Next Level Auto Brokers any current flagship and/or covid monies on M5C?
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      04-24-2020, 10:39 AM   #12
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Sub'd. (for future me when time to go G80 shopping )
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      04-24-2020, 10:41 AM   #13
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What's a good % off MSRP on a CS?
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      04-24-2020, 11:20 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Next Level Auto Brokers View Post
As a general rule, a loaner dealer discount before any rebate should be greater than 15% off.

16-17% off great deal
18-20% off amazing deal
20+% off unicorn deal
Iím guessing a car with around 1000 mi would be considered demo / loaner status? Car doesnít show on bmwusa search so Iím thinking it was punched already.
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      04-24-2020, 01:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kief View Post
Next Level Auto Brokers any current flagship and/or covid monies on M5C?
No flagship on the m5 or m5c. There never has been for the F90
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      04-24-2020, 01:09 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW335iOn18s View Post
What's a good % off MSRP on a CS?
18% should be your target
before lease cash and loyalty WITH .00118 MF
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      04-24-2020, 01:13 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTM09 View Post
Iím guessing a car with around 1000 mi would be considered demo / loaner status? Car doesnít show on bmwusa search so Iím thinking it was punched already.
You should look for cars just under 5000 miles for loaners for the best discount as the dealer can "write-down" the cost of these loaners more.

If the loaner has less than 3000 miles, then the cost of the car to the dealer is still high and discount won't be great.

Demos are priced like new cars so these typically are never a good deal. There is no write down.

When shopping around for both, see if you can detect a pattern in the used car section. Loaners will sometimes have a letter "L" in the stock numbers. Those are the cars you should be targeting.

Over 5000 miles, the deals are bad because the car loses the lease cash once it goes over 5000 miles
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      04-24-2020, 01:35 PM   #18
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really interesting, welcome to the forum!
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      04-24-2020, 03:15 PM   #19
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You said for non-M cars the goal should be 12% off before rebates. What should the goal be for M-cars (F82) before rebates? Fair, good, Unicorn?
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      04-24-2020, 04:41 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galvatron261 View Post
You said for non-M cars the goal should be 12% off before rebates. What should the goal be for M-cars (F82) before rebates? Fair, good, Unicorn?
9-10% good deal
11-12% excellent deal
13-15% unicorn but possible
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      04-24-2020, 04:55 PM   #21
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This came up a few times because of people shopping for 24 month leases:

ONLY the 36 month lease makes sense on all BMW leases.

BMW wised up this month April and what used to be a 6% bump in residual for 24 months from 36 months is now 4%.
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      04-24-2020, 06:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Next Level Auto Brokers View Post
Hi, I'm Dan!

My user ID for the business is new, but I'm a longtime lurker/member as well on here. Like most of you on the forums, I do a ton of research on every car I purchase and value real feedback from real owners.

In a very short time, I've built up a network of 15 BMW dealers, and I do the lion's share of all BMW deals on a popular leasing forum website. I myself sell 50+ BMWs per month, and I've learned a lot about what works and what doesn't work.

There is a lot of misinformation on this forum that is either anecdotal or a true unicorn deal when all the stars lined up on one particular car buying day.

I hope to clear the air and pull back the curtain on some of the shady ways car dealers try to make money off unsuspecting buyers.

To start:

----5-6% is invoice for BMWs depending on where you live. Dealers do not lose money if they sell you a car under invoice.

----12% is triple-net-zero for dealers just to move a unit. They are losing money on your deal with the hopes of hitting a BMW bonus tier. For some high volume dealers, they must sell over 200 cars that month to get a $500- $1000 bonus on every car sold that month.

-----Flagship money is a hidden incentive to move certain models. It's specific to the production date of the car sometimes. For example, an 2020 M8 built in 2019 has $10,000 flagship compared to a $2000 for a 2020 M8 built in 2020!
Be sure to ask the forum or dealer if there is any flagship money you should be aware of!

For non-M cars, your goal should be 12% off before incentives/rebates AND a base money factor.

Dealers can easily make the discount look better if they mark up the money factor.

[SIZE="4"]ASK AWAY! I'll do my absolute best not to self-promote and keep it educational and fun!
[/SIZE]
This is freaking amazing! Thanks for the info!
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