2016 C&D Lightning Lap Results (M4 GTS and M2 included)

[adc]

Originally Posted by Blipit_

BMW never was the quickest, but they use to over deliver on the intangibles(aka...driver involvement, feel, emotion). In this case, it doesn't quit deliver on that either(or at least not to the level of some of the competition). The GT350R has that in spades and it is quicker.

Not sure I agree, by all accounts the GTS is a very involving car. Haven't driven it, as I'm guessing is the case for you.

I never complained about the level of involvement or emotion in my M3. I like it just fine. I just think they are a generation behind in suspension tuning right now. For how stiff the M3 feels in daily driving, on track it moves around a lot which means it could use stiffer springs. And its bouncy. To me that says the dampers are not up to snuff.

I drove a friend's GT4 and GT3 and the damping is what really blew my mind.

Oh well, I still like my M.

[Leaveit2bevo]

Originally Posted by imyopusha

So the last-gen ZL1 and Z28 ran 7:41 and 7:38 (I think) on the Ring, respectively. I can't imagine what they'll run next. Conversely, if the F80 with ZCP was equipped with Trofeo R tires, I bet it would run right with them.

You think ZCP and R compounds are worth over 10 seconds? The fan bois on this forum are out of control.

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Originally Posted by Leaveit2bevo

You think ZCP and R compounds are worth over 10 seconds? The fan bois on this forum are out of control.

My experience in the M3 at VIR, full course not grand course, has been 2-3 seconds faster with tires. But it wasn't just compound switch, they are wider too.

So maybe 3 sec over the full course, add one more for ZCP?

If that. YMMV.

[imyopusha]

Originally Posted by adc

My experience in the M3 at VIR, full course not grand course, has been 2-3 seconds faster with tires. But it wasn't just compound switch, they are wider too.

So maybe 3 sec over the full course, add one more for ZCP?

If that. YMMV.

The full VIR course is just over 3 miles. The Ring is almost 13. It's not a stretch at all to think ZCP and Trofeos could reel around ten seconds.

Originally Posted by Leaveit2bevo

You think ZCP and R compounds are worth over 10 seconds? The fan bois on this forum are out of control.

Lol. I own a ZL1. You know what they say about making assumptions, right?

[adc]

Originally Posted by imyopusha

The full VIR course is just over 3 miles. The Ring is almost 13. It's not a stretch at all to think ZCP and Trofeos could reel around ten seconds.

My mistake, I wasn't thinking of the Ring. Yes, I can easily see a 10 sec improvement for ZCP and R compounds. 7:40 should be possible.

[CirrusSR22]

Originally Posted by imyopusha

So the last-gen ZL1 and Z28 ran 7:41 and 7:38 (I think) on the Ring, respectively. I can't imagine what they'll run next. Conversely, if the F80 with ZCP was equipped with Trofeo R tires, I bet it would run right with them.

The last about 1:30 of that Z/28 Nurburgring lap was in moderate rain and the car was sliding around a lot. It can certainly go faster than the 7:38 it did.

[imyopusha]

Originally Posted by CirrusSR22

The last about 1:30 of that Z/28 Nurburgring lap was in moderate rain and the car was sliding around a lot. It can certainly go faster than the 7:38 it did.

I'd love to have seen what the ZL1 would have done with those same tires.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by adc

My mistake, I wasn't thinking of the Ring. Yes, I can easily see a 10 sec improvement for ZCP and R compounds. 7:40 should be possible.

So a CP with R-comps would be within 3~5 seconds of the GTS ?

[adc]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

So a CP with R-comps would be within 3~5 seconds of the GTS ?

No, from 7:28 to 7:40 that is 12 sec.

Clock a few sec for the added power, a few more sec for the suspension, I can see where the difference can be found.

BTW I've wondered why BMW didn't put more tire on th GTS. I love my 305's in the rear, and could how I could really take advantage if the car had more power. But the real limitation in my mind are the 285 fronts - if BMW had found a way to put a 305 square on the GTS I believe it would be a 7:20 car.

Edit: Or did you mean at VIR? if so then yes it would be 3-5 sec.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by adc

No, from 7:28 to 7:40 that is 12 sec.

Clock a few sec for the added power, a few more sec for the suspension, I can see where the difference can be found.

BTW I've wondered why BMW didn't put more tire on th GTS. I love my 305's in the rear, and could how I could really take advantage if the car had more power. But the real limitation in my mind are the 285 fronts - if BMW had found a way to put a 305 square on the GTS I believe it would be a 7:20 car.

Edit: Or did you mean at VIR? if so then yes it would be 3-5 sec.

SA/AMS did 7:52 in the regular M4. 7:52 minus 10~12 seconds is 7:40~7:42, which is only 3~5 seconds off the 7:37 SA/AMS did with the GTS.

I consider the GTS 7:28 as a "flyer" (not easily repeatable).

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

SA/AMS did 7:52 in the regular M4. 7:52 minus 10~12 seconds is 7:40~7:42, which is only 3~5 seconds off the 7:37 SA/AMS did with the GTS.

I consider the GTS 7:28 as a "flyer" (not easily repeatable).

Likewise. Statistically anomalous; an outlier.

[adc]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

SA/AMS did 7:52 in the regular M4. 7:52 minus 10~12 seconds is 7:40~7:42, which is only 3~5 seconds off the 7:37 SA/AMS did with the GTS.

I consider the GTS 7:28 as a "flyer" (not easily repeatable).

In that case, you may be right. My limited track experience with the F80 shows significant lap time improvements with 285/305 R comps. Whether that is actual innate objective improvement or just acts as a confidence booster I don't know.

We would need the same pro level driver to test back to back otherwise it will be just more bickering as we can already see.