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      02-19-2019, 01:02 PM   #1
matty088
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Ceramic coatings

Not looking to start a war but i am trying to pick out a ceramic coating.

It looks to me that everyone is installing Ceramic Pro brand. All the local detailers use this brand. To me it makes much less sense than the opti coat.

Opti is cheaper, doesnt require maintenance and forms a true bond with the paint while the ceramic pro layers sitting on top.

Why has the industry almost unanimously moved to Ceramic pro? The only guess i have is because it creates a customer with the need for maintenance? Or am i just cynical and it is the better product and that is why its won the market?

I also feel like opti, while being the first, has died off. Its almost like they were the first mover but better stuff has evolved and killed it off. Yet its not better.
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      02-19-2019, 01:44 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matty088 View Post
Not looking to start a war but i am trying to pick out a ceramic coating.

It looks to me that everyone is installing Ceramic Pro brand. All the local detailers use this brand. To me it makes much less sense than the opti coat.

Opti is cheaper, doesnt require maintenance and forms a true bond with the paint while the ceramic pro layers sitting on top.

Why has the industry almost unanimously moved to Ceramic pro? The only guess i have is because it creates a customer with the need for maintenance? Or am i just cynical and it is the better product and that is why its won the market?

I also feel like opti, while being the first, has died off. Its almost like they were the first mover but better stuff has evolved and killed it off. Yet its not better.
Mostly because of marketing. More important is the installer and who you can trust to not eff up the car and take responsibility for the work. Also PPF is superior to protecting the paint so get as much coverage as you can afford then coat the rest.
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      02-19-2019, 03:08 PM   #3
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Mass marketing by ceramic pro, and the business model is ANYONE and EVERYONE can be an installer. There are 35 installers around me, but only 1 modesta installer.

and the coating goes on top of the PPF as well, so PPF for rock chip protection, coating for easy car care
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      02-19-2019, 08:05 PM   #4
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Got a price of 2000 for five year opti pro. Thatís on all surfaces with some paint correction. Thatís stupid. Whatís this guys problem.
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      02-19-2019, 10:25 PM   #5
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All Opticoat prices are standardized I believe.
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      02-20-2019, 08:41 PM   #6
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What about CQ UK 3.0?
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      02-21-2019, 12:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matty088 View Post
Got a price of 2000 for five year opti pro. Thatís on all surfaces with some paint correction. Thatís stupid. Whatís this guys problem.
what's stupid about that? Actually that's a decent price.

There are different levels of paint correction and different levels of quality when it comes to coatings. They are all not one in the same, and the installer is not the same as the next guy.

Our 2 step correction looks better than some 3 step corrections, and definitely looks better than most other shops 2 steps...we are more expensive for a reason. The cheap 400 dollar jobs that take 5 hours looks far different than a proper 10 to 14 hours job at 1000+ Modesta BC04 looks and protects far better than a DIY CQUK bottle. but it costs $1500 for the coating alone.

To say its stupid is not right. It may be expensive for you, but it may be a drop in the bucket for someone else. Some people want the best, so they pay for it. Some people are ok with 80%, and they pay less for it, but the two are not equal.

There is a saying:
It will cost X amount to get you to 90%, if you are after that 100%, expect to pay double or triple as that is what it takes"
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      02-21-2019, 01:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric S View Post
what's stupid about that? Actually that's a decent price.

There are different levels of paint correction and different levels of quality when it comes to coatings. They are all not one in the same, and the installer is not the same as the next guy.

Our 2 step correction looks better than some 3 step corrections, and definitely looks better than most other shops 2 steps...we are more expensive for a reason. The cheap 400 dollar jobs that take 5 hours looks far different than a proper 10 to 14 hours job at 1000+ Modesta BC04 looks and protects far better than a DIY CQUK bottle. but it costs $1500 for the coating alone.

To say its stupid is not right. It may be expensive for you, but it may be a drop in the bucket for someone else. Some people want the best, so they pay for it. Some people are ok with 80%, and they pay less for it, but the two are not equal.

There is a saying:
It will cost X amount to get you to 90%, if you are after that 100%, expect to pay double or triple as that is what it takes"
$2000 isnt a lot of money in a general sense. However its a lot of money to have a coating applied to a car. Where is the value? The water sheets off and scratching is slightly less? Why not get a good paint correction, apply a good sealant and reup the sealant yourself. Save 1500. So i reiterate my stupid comment. I am sorry. there isnt value here in my mind. 2000 for what exactly? Same amount of beading and slightly more protection over a sealant? The car is a garage queen.I can get a year out of a decent sealant (Zaino, yes Zaino).

the problem is with this particular installer i think . 900 for 5yr Opti. 250 for the windows. 250 for the tires. then a bunch more to have the calipers done. Its all a la carte. Then there is paint correction. and doesnt include interior. The price is high. "stupid" high. And the fad will erode over time. Or at a minimum a new price will be found. There needs to be a reset in this market. Its like an over inflated stock price. A correction is due.

Why not get ceramic pro? Is that not quality? 950 all in. all surfaces. interior. paint correction. 3 yr coating. Multiple shops are offering this.
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      02-21-2019, 02:25 PM   #9
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^ sounds like you just dont see any value in paying for a ceramic coating (I dont either) but there are many that do. Different strokes for different folks.
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      02-21-2019, 02:31 PM   #10
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I got Opti and itís been on the car for about 16 months. It is holding up really well. The water still beads like the day I got it, and I swear the car stays cleaner longer than any car Iíve ever had. I have no experience with any other brands of ceramic coating, but Iím very pleased with the Opti-Coat and I have done nothing in terms of maintenance except wash the car.
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      02-21-2019, 02:31 PM   #11
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yeah, i always thought that the majority of the cost was in the paint correction, which is massively labor intensive. And if you're using any kind of highly skilled labor in North America...it's gonna cost a lot.

I've had six ceramic coats installed by the same guy, and the price does change somewhat if the finish needs less prep work.
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      02-21-2019, 02:45 PM   #12
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Get paint correction and PPF then do a DIY coating yourself. The hardest part about applying a coating is the prep anyway.
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      02-21-2019, 02:52 PM   #13
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Gtechniq crystal serum w/ evo is another very good ceramic option. 2k for paint correction and coating is expensive.
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      02-21-2019, 03:28 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
yeah, i always thought that the majority of the cost was in the paint correction, which is massively labor intensive. And if you're using any kind of highly skilled labor in North America...it's gonna cost a lot.

I've had six ceramic coats installed by the same guy, and the price does change somewhat if the finish needs less prep work.
Agreed. I did a DIY 2 step paint correction on my beater econo box that I didn't touch for over 10 years and I can understand why detailers charge so much. I cut many corners and it still took me over 3 hours to do. The job takes a lot of patience.
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      02-21-2019, 06:17 PM   #15
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For me it is more about the installer than the coating. Ceramic Pro has a very good marketing department behind it but they do not vet the installer as much as other companies. That does not make their product bad.

IMHO you need to be comfortable with your installer because the prep work that they do will go further in determining the end results then what product they use. I looked at Modesta but the more I talked to my installer the upcharge vs other offerings just did not scream value for me. So I went with Gtechniq over PPF.

My installer and I talked at length and he set the proper expectations and I am satisfied with the results. It has not been on my wifes 2018 M3 that long but so far so good and I am confident that if there are issues Bruce_SC will take care of it. His after installation support has been awesome. It has been so good I did some additional PPF on the rocker panels. Anything that has come up he has addressed. I can txt him and ask him questions for products to washing techniques.

So research your installer as much or more than the product you are looking at. If you choose a professional high quality installer then the products that they use will match their level of service.
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      02-21-2019, 07:06 PM   #16
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^ sounds like you just dont see any value in paying for a ceramic coating (I dont either) but there are many that do. Different strokes for different folks.
I do. But at the right price. It needs to correct. It will.
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      02-21-2019, 07:10 PM   #17
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It should be under 1000. Itís a days work. How much are materials? 200?? So 800 sounds even high for the work thatís being performed
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      02-21-2019, 07:24 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matty088 View Post
It should be under 1000. It’s a days work. How much are materials? 200?? So 800 sounds even high for the work that’s being performed
I don’t think so. I paid $1300, which is in the ball park for a full ceramic coat by a quality installer. I had it applied when new and did not get a paint correction.

Edit: for 5 year protection, if you had the car waxed 3 times a year for $100, you will have paid $1500 over the course of 5 years, but you will have enjoyed the convenience of not having to deal with getting the car waxed 15 times. Also, I think a ceramic coating is more protective than ordinary wax. Seems about right to me.
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      02-22-2019, 10:24 AM   #19
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I have the 3 year ceramic pro, done by my dealer. It's better then without, but water doesn't exactly fall off it like the youtube videos show. I suspect there are better compounds. I paid approximately 600 euros but i'm in Poland so it's probably a bit cheaper here. The product itself is dirt cheap, it's the labour...
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      02-22-2019, 10:44 AM   #20
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Until someone invents a coating where I never have to wash my car again ill save my money for now
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      02-24-2019, 07:57 PM   #21
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Has anyone used the Adam's ceramic coating and if so how do you like it?
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      02-25-2019, 10:08 AM   #22
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Has anyone used the Adam's ceramic coating and if so how do you like it?
Waiting to hear about this too
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