Drag Race: M4 vs W205 C63 S, Lexus RC-F, E92 M3, W204 C63

[DanMpower]

Originally Posted by GranitM5

My car was FBO running E85 pushing close to 500whp. Not bad for N/A. Turbo is the way to go but man I miss the exhaust note since making the switch to the F90.

With over twice the displacement of the S55, 6.2L vs 3.0L, FBO and E85 I would hope it would make some decent numbers. lol.

Seriously though, the W204 C63 is a much cooler ride IMO compared to the new W205. I like the aggressive DTM look and it just seems to have much more presence on the road.

[Germanauto]

Yet the E90 will always be the driver's choice due to its tactile, engaging driving experience. The rest of these feel more like muscle cars.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by joshuastein55

I honestly don't understand the hate with the column shifter. My CLS is the first Merc I've owned and I got use to it almost immediately. It acts the same way as most modern shifters with up for reverse and down for drive, and it frees up space on the center console, and cars have had column shifters for decades. Honestly I don't know anyone with an automatic who uses the gear lever to shift anymore, with paddle shifters now being the norm in every new car. But I guess everyone has the preferences :

I personally don't like them at all. They are just a lump of plastic and look dorky, resembling the shifters of old Crown Vics and trucks.

A real shifter can be art. The design and material choices of a real shifter feel so much more special, and manually shifting with them feels much more authentic than using shift paddles.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

Drag races still matter? Odd.

Unfortunately they matter more than ever. Drag races/0-60 times make headlines and garner clicks on Youtube videos. Ever notice how, especially with EVs, all anybody seems to talk about is 0-60 times?

Yet horsepower and 0-60 is mostly useless on a daily basis because we share the road with others and have speed limits. I personally care more about handling, steering, and curb weight/weight distribution. But these aspects of a car are for much subjective and are something nobody wants to listen to or watch.

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Unfortunately they matter more than ever. Drag races/0-60 times make headlines and garner clicks on Youtube videos. Ever notice how, especially with EVs, all anybody seems to talk about is 0-60 times?

Yet horsepower and 0-60 is mostly useless on a daily basis because we share the road with others and have speed limits. I personally care more about handling, steering, and curb weight/weight distribution. But these aspects of a car are for much subjective and are something nobody wants to listen to or watch.

I feel the same. Plus, everyone knows that the German cars don't shine for straightline speed. At least i thought they did. If I want an indication of the cars speed and handling I pay attention to track times, but even that I take w a grain of salt. To me, drag races are for muscle cars. Admittedly the video was pretty cool

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I personally don't like them at all. They are just a lump of plastic and look dorky, resembling the shifters of old Crown Vics and trucks.

A real shifter can be art. The design and material choices of a real shifter feel so much more special, and manually shifting with them feels much more authentic than using shift paddles.

In today's society the only shifter that I consider art is the manual transmission, since most new shifters are electronic joysticks anyways. I actually prefer the paddles for a more authentic feeling since both are just pushing/clicking an electronic button in a sense, and while I'm sure some still use the shift lever, most likely use paddles. In my G30 5er the shifter was just a tall plastic lever so in the end I just traded the positioning from the center console to the column, and the shape of it was very awkward to use in a push/pull motion to change gears, so I don't miss it. Surprisingly even Rolls Royce still uses column shifters. I just think people harp on it too much when at the end of the day, they will likely forget about it and get use to it and use the paddles anyways. I would never consider it a dealbreaker, and think people just make it a bigger deal than it actually is, plus its still better than that of a push button, rotary or any other odd gear selector from Honda, Hyundai, Ford, Lincoln, etc.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Yet the E90 will always be the driver's choice due to its tactile, engaging driving experience. The rest of these feel more like muscle cars.

The e9x wasn't really engaging. It was heavy and the steering was numb but the chassis was fanbleedingtastic. Had weak brakes though.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

I feel the same. Plus, everyone knows that the German cars don't shine for straightline speed. At least i thought they did. If I want an indication of the cars speed and handling I pay attention to track times, but even that I take w a grain of salt. To me, drag races are for muscle cars. Admittedly the video was pretty cool

German cars don't shine for straightline? How about this German?

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

The e9x wasn't really engaging. It was heavy and the steering was numb but the chassis was fanbleedingtastic. Had weak brakes though.

Huh, the car I can truly compare in all respects and feels most like my e92 M3 from a driving experience is a 991 GT3. Steering and chassis feedback are both on point. Engines love to be revved. Brakes on the BMW are their weak point but easily upgraded.

If you don't think the e92 M3 is engaging then what in your opinion is?

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

Huh, the car I can truly compare in all respects and feels most like my e92 M3 from a driving experience is a 991 GT3. Steering and chassis feedback are both on point. Engines love to be revved. Brakes on the BMW are their weak point but easily upgraded.

If you don't think the e92 M3 is engaging then what in your opinion is?

The chassis on the e92 was great and the engine was blissful. I think the steering left more to be desired and the weight of the car did show itself.

Remember, the V8 M3 kept up with the V8 R8 of the time which was a very impressive feat.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

German cars don't shine for straightline? How about this German?

This German wants to play too:

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

The chassis on the e92 was great and the engine was blissful. I think the steering left more to be desired and the weight of the car did show itself.

Remember, the V8 M3 kept up with the V8 R8 of the time which was a very impressive feat.

Totally agree the weight is a problem (as is it's brakes). I've been in a stripped out e92 that weighed in at under 3,200 it also had that carbon intake and full catless exhaust and it was extremely visceral and soo much faster than a stock M3 it felt like I was in a Cup car.

[antzcrashing]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

German cars don't shine for straightline? How about this German?

911 turbo S is 200k. A corvette C8 is 60k. Their straight-line speeds would be similar.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

911 turbo S is 200k. A corvette C8 is 60k. Their straight-line speeds would be similar.

At first you said German cars arent known for their straightline speed, which was incorrect. Now you think a C8 is a straightline competitor to the 911 Turbo S? You kidding?
A Turbo S would murder it. 991.2 does around 130 1/4 mile trap and owners have posted times a few mph higher and as high as 135.99 stock low 10's. 0-60mph on 2.5 seconds rain or shine.

[McLaren720s]

The Lexus RC-F is quite underwhelming in almost every performance aspect. It did pretty bad at VIR too by Car and Driver coming in at position #104 and even getting beaten by the new Supra (#96).

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...storical-data/

[lukej]

Originally Posted by joshuastein55

I understand that, I just find it strange that people think of it as a "deal-breaker" because it isn't the worst thing in the world and will eventually just be forgotten/gotten use to.

That’s why they make Neapolitan ice cream there’s a flavor for everybody..

It was a dealbreaker for me ,,,I got to have something to hang onto on that center column ,,,call me crazy you got a love freedom.

[lukej]

It’s funny to see how these forms evolve over one video.

I think there’s about three different topics in this one form. I’m not complaining or anything it’s just interesting...

[kss]

Originally Posted by McLaren720s

The Lexus RC-F is quite underwhelming in almost every performance aspect. It did pretty bad at VIR too by Car and Driver coming in at position #104 and even getting beaten by the new Supra (#96).

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...storical-data/

Not that I’d want it, but the Lexus IS probably the most reliable of the bunch and if someone wanted to own the car for a long time without being concerned about putting lots of mileage on it, it may be the best option.

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by edwarjejeega

Interesting... I've beaten a bone stock W204 C63 AMG P31 package off a roll in my bone stock M4 convertible that weighs 4200 lbs.. confused on how the M4 coupe lost that bad

Because the driver cannot drive it

[535i MSport]

Originally Posted by lukej

Yeah and they did away with the shifter knob in the center ,, and put it on the column ,, granny style... I looked at a C 63S pretty close before I bought my 2020 M4c ,,,I just couldn't take that shifter on the column...

You shouldn't have let that put you off, you have the paddles still if you want to shift manually.

I have a C63S and an M3 comp with MPE and although not everyone agrees, the C63S sounds so much better. As they say, 8 is great!

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

911 turbo S is 200k. A corvette C8 is 60k. Their straight-line speeds would be similar.

The C8 would have the same straight line speed as a 911 Turbo S?


Friend, that's not true at all. Maybe a Z06 which hasn't even been released yet, but not even a Z51 would keep up with a Turbo S.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by Bahn360Photo

Top speed of both of them is limited to 155. If you want to go that route then they are the same.

Getting to top speed m3 may be faster, I doubt anyone actually ran these cars 0-155, at least I haven't seen it.

Short distances 335 is quicker. Rolling eyes or not.

With f30/f80 there was never even a mention of that...because it wasn't even a drivers race. But with e90's it was. Which means that they were too close.

My personal experience, I beat m3's. I seen videos otherwise which weren't false either.

Let me say this again, I love e90/92 m3, I'm not hating on it. I'm stating reality.

1.Let us clear some things up. You keep contradicting yourself. You've gone from the 335i is faster than an M3 and the M3 isn't fast to the M3 is faster to top speed to they're both limited to 155 and the M3 is faster to that limit. Please make up your mind. Just because you beat M3's doesn't make it fact that he 335i is faster.

2. The 335i is NOT faster than an M3. Not in any situation. The ONLY way an e9x 335i wins is if the M3 is in the wrong gear or not in the power band. It's as simple as that or if the 335i is tuned.

3. Just because once instance of the 335i winning against an M3 has come about doesn't make it a 'reality'.

Lets add some numbers and keep it apples to apples.

M3:

http://accelerationtimes.com/models/bmw-m3-e92

335i RWD:

http://accelerationtimes.com/models/...upe-n55-engine