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      09-21-2021, 07:50 AM   #1673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melanthius View Post
Keep in mind, Model S plaid puts down 1000hp with like 255 front / 295 in the rear (AWD).

Part of that is far superior traction control than what is possible with an internal combustion engine, but good to put tires in perspective. You don't need 325s on an F80...

Last time I was at the track I sat in some proper E46 M3 race cars, they were running exact same NT01 275/35/18's that I was running.
If the e46s were proper race cars they weighed around 2650, quite different than 3600
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      09-21-2021, 07:52 AM   #1674
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Originally Posted by heyyouduh View Post
gotcha. how much camber? I'm running -2.5 deg camber, mcs 600# 6" w/ helper springs, perch is about half way in the threaded portion of the strut body.
-3 front, camber set at the track

For the street I use 275/35 and -2 camber. Until recently that was my street set, 4x275/35 RE71 mounted on 10.5 wheels
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      09-21-2021, 07:58 AM   #1675
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Originally Posted by sly1types View Post
What about pirelli dh? I was thinking you said 305/645/18 would fit?

I'm getting ready to try it on 10.5" with an effective ET17 for the front then 11" et44 rear then run 305/645/18 front and rear pirelli dh scrubs
That fits fine. The 305 width Pirelli are narrow compared to a hypothetical 305 R7
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      09-21-2021, 02:00 PM   #1676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melanthius View Post
Keep in mind, Model S plaid puts down 1000hp with like 255 front / 295 in the rear (AWD).

Part of that is far superior traction control than what is possible with an internal combustion engine, but good to put tires in perspective. You don't need 325s on an F80...

Last time I was at the track I sat in some proper E46 M3 race cars, they were running exact same NT01 275/35/18's that I was running.
Since we track with DSC off though…

I thought we didn't need 325's as well, I was fine with my 305's, they were wide. However, once you convert to an ethanol track tune, it changes the game entirely.

Our cars are also much heavier than e46m3 race cars, hence the need for max tire
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      09-21-2021, 03:05 PM   #1677
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSXDC5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by melanthius View Post
Keep in mind, Model S plaid puts down 1000hp with like 255 front / 295 in the rear (AWD).

Part of that is far superior traction control than what is possible with an internal combustion engine, but good to put tires in perspective. You don't need 325s on an F80...

Last time I was at the track I sat in some proper E46 M3 race cars, they were running exact same NT01 275/35/18's that I was running.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melanthius View Post
Keep in mind, Model S plaid puts down 1000hp with like 255 front / 295 in the rear (AWD).

Part of that is far superior traction control than what is possible with an internal combustion engine, but good to put tires in perspective. You don't need 325s on an F80...

Last time I was at the track I sat in some proper E46 M3 race cars, they were running exact same NT01 275/35/18's that I was running.
Since we track with DSC off though…

I thought we didn't need 325's as well, I was fine with my 305's, they were wide. However, once you convert to an ethanol track tune, it changes the game entirely.

Our cars are also much heavier than e46m3 race cars, hence the need for max tire
The point being, On an EV where the motor can overpower traction at any moment, the traction control is not optional. If it could be disabled (it can't) completely the car would barely be driveable.

But it is superior in that torque can be dialed in or out to any level easily and within a millisecond.

So the difference is traction control slows down an ICEV but makes an EV faster. Still ridiculously impressive what it can do with 255/295 tires and 1000hp , and all that excess weight.

Putting the 2700lb race car aside, it still seems strange to me that everyone on forums tends to advise the wider the better (given what plaid can do with even more weight and much more power than an F80)

Anyone seen a good source of a direct comparison of lap times for something comparable to F80 with different tire widths being the only variable?

Seems excess rotating mass will eventually work against you.
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      09-21-2021, 06:00 PM   #1678
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melanthius View Post
The point being, On an EV where the motor can overpower traction at any moment, the traction control is not optional. If it could be disabled (it can't) completely the car would barely be driveable.

But it is superior in that torque can be dialed in or out to any level easily and within a millisecond.

So the difference is traction control slows down an ICEV but makes an EV faster. Still ridiculously impressive what it can do with 255/295 tires and 1000hp , and all that excess weight.

Putting the 2700lb race car aside, it still seems strange to me that everyone on forums tends to advise the wider the better (given what plaid can do with even more weight and much more power than an F80)

Anyone seen a good source of a direct comparison of lap times for something comparable to F80 with different tire widths being the only variable?

Seems excess rotating mass will eventually work against you.
I don't think the Plaid has any relevance in this discussion. It is not a track car, even if it can go really fast for one lap due to its massive power.

Plenty of brands make 'track specials' and in all of them you see tire and wheel width maximized. From a lowly Camaro SS 1LE all the way up.

If you go see time attack or pretty much any competition, people are maximizing their tire/wheel width combo and their cars weigh less than a F80. When they can't maximize them it's due to rules not allowing them to run anything wider.

But it can be an interesting experiment if you want to try tracking with narrow tires. The track times thread has people in the west coast so you can compare your laptimes to them.

Last edited by SYT_Shadow; 09-21-2021 at 09:10 PM..
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      09-21-2021, 07:37 PM   #1679
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EV Time Attack scene is definitely growing. I know a few people running the M3P that are starting to put down some pretty serious times (1:38's at Gingerman, 1:34's at Autobahn, 2:18's at NCM) with only a 255 (Square) width tire due to classing limitations and some minor suspension mods. I think they would do some damage if they could run more tire, the 255's build up some serious heat based off the pyro data I've seen on them due to their weight. This is also why a wider tire works really well on a stockish weight F80 vs an E46 racecar haha.
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      09-21-2021, 10:35 PM   #1680
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Wouldn’t the wider tires last significantly longer on the track compared to a narrow setup?
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      09-21-2021, 11:47 PM   #1681
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
I don't think the Plaid has any relevance in this discussion. It is not a track car, even if it can go really fast for one lap due to its massive power.

Plenty of brands make 'track specials' and in all of them you see tire and wheel width maximized. From a lowly Camaro SS 1LE all the way up.

If you go see time attack or pretty much any competition, people are maximizing their tire/wheel width combo and their cars weigh less than a F80. When they can't maximize them it's due to rules not allowing them to run anything wider.

But it can be an interesting experiment if you want to try tracking with narrow tires. The track times thread has people in the west coast so you can compare your laptimes to them.
Yeah I get all that, to me it's an interesting thought experiment though. Tesla was going all out trying to beat 'ring records, which they did... if they needed a wider tire to do it, seems like they would've done that.

Agree it is not a "track" car even if it puts down stupidly fast track times.
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      09-22-2021, 01:11 AM   #1682
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Randy Pobst was out at Laguna last time we were there August 1. He would do some stupid fast laps, but don’t think I ever saw him do 2 hot laps in a row. Various reasons including battery draw and tire temperature - That thing has to weigh over 4000 pounds w/o driver.

Against my religion to get in the passenger seat, but I did it in one of these and the Tesla was surprisingly capable. The driver was the opposite of Randy, but he did have oversized tires on aftermarket wheels.

Tesla Corsa group is picking up a following out here, but the sound is so strangely quiet…..15+ cars on track and almost silent.
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      09-22-2021, 08:18 AM   #1683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uncle ben View Post
Wouldn’t the wider tires last significantly longer on the track compared to a narrow setup?
for sure. More surface area to dissipate heat
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      09-24-2021, 12:46 AM   #1684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fanatic1 View Post
Randy Pobst was out at Laguna last time we were there August 1. He would do some stupid fast laps, but don’t think I ever saw him do 2 hot laps in a row. Various reasons including battery draw and tire temperature - That thing has to weigh over 4000 pounds w/o driver.

Against my religion to get in the passenger seat, but I did it in one of these and the Tesla was surprisingly capable. The driver was the opposite of Randy, but he did have oversized tires on aftermarket wheels.

Tesla Corsa group is picking up a following out here, but the sound is so strangely quiet…..15+ cars on track and almost silent.
I bet the Karen's living around the track love how quiet it is.
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      09-24-2021, 07:30 AM   #1685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
I bet the Karen's living around the track love how quiet it is.
For now... but rest assured, the people who bought houses near a racetrack yet are now bothered by the noise will find new things to complain about related to the racetrack.

How many years do we have until there are protestors outside every track?

Last edited by SYT_Shadow; 09-24-2021 at 08:29 AM..
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      09-24-2021, 08:06 AM   #1686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
For now... but rest assured, the people who bought houses near a racetrack yet are now bothered by the noise will find new things to complain about related to the racetrack.

How many years do we have until there are 'climate warrior' protestors outside every track?
Some tracks... Depends upon how accommodating the locale. Never saw a white supremacist on the Chicago L, don’t think climate warriors want anything to do with the Sebring cows.

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      09-24-2021, 08:29 AM   #1687
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Some tracks... Depends upon how accommodating the locale. Never saw a white supremacist on the Chicago L, don’t think climate warriors want anything to do with the Sebring cows.

Someone showed up to work in a halloween outfit just like that one year...
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      09-24-2021, 02:14 PM   #1688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
For now... but rest assured, the people who bought houses near a racetrack yet are now bothered by the noise will find new things to complain about related to the racetrack.

How many years do we have until there are protestors outside every track?
We should introduce them to the alternative of having an organized track:



Do they really want more of these idiots?
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      09-24-2021, 02:37 PM   #1689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
We should introduce them to the alternative of having an organized track:

Do they really want more of these idiots?
Jokes aside, it's possible in my childhood I was one of these hoodlums tearing it up on public roads. Since discovering the track, I won't even do a highway pull
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      09-24-2021, 03:49 PM   #1690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmg View Post
We should introduce them to the alternative of having an organized track:

Do they really want more of these idiots?
Jokes aside, it's possible in my childhood I was one of these hoodlums tearing it up on public roads. Since discovering the track, I won't even do a highway pull
In the 90's we had many an illegal race in industrial areas and sporadic hooning. Never did we take over busy intersections and run each other over!
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      09-24-2021, 05:39 PM   #1691
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There always seems to be a Dodge 392 involved.
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      09-25-2021, 09:53 AM   #1692
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gang, I have a Solo 2 DL which I sadly only use for lap times (Race Studio is a bit intimidating). I'm trying to decide whether to switch to the new Garmin thingy or keep my Solo and pair it with the SmartyCam + OBD2.

Anyone have advice or strong feelings on this? thx
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      09-25-2021, 11:07 AM   #1693
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D_SheerDrivingPleasure View Post
gang, I have a Solo 2 DL which I sadly only use for lap times (Race Studio is a bit intimidating). I'm trying to decide whether to switch to the new Garmin thingy or keep my Solo and pair it with the SmartyCam + OBD2.

Anyone have advice or strong feelings on this? thx
Catalyst is very simple and effective. If you're going to double down on AIM pay someone to set up math channels and profiles for analyzing the data. It's worth $250.
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      09-25-2021, 11:09 AM   #1694
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D_SheerDrivingPleasure View Post
gang, I have a Solo 2 DL which I sadly only use for lap times (Race Studio is a bit intimidating). I'm trying to decide whether to switch to the new Garmin thingy or keep my Solo and pair it with the SmartyCam + OBD2.

Anyone have advice or strong feelings on this? thx
I run both for different reasons. I feel I get more 'bang for the buck' with the Garmin and that's what I usually use as a quick debrief between sessions. I use the Solo/Smarty as more the data logging, and a deeper review in the evenings.

Two different tools, but I will say that the Garmin has exceeded my expectations. From the very first time using it, I dropped 3 seconds after plateauing at my local track.
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