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      09-04-2013, 10:41 PM   #23
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I will continue the tradition, hopefully ready by May to repeat my 2010 ED at the Monte Carlo Grand Prix.
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      09-04-2013, 11:05 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
Can anyone enlighten me into how do dealerships profit from allocations on ED, since you're literally buying directly of the factory?
Unless you are the owner of the dealership, you're never going to know how a dealer makes his profit, from ED sales or otherwise. That's because you don't have access to his books, methods, etc. Seems obvious enough, yet, a lot of buyers spend a lot of time obsessing over this.

As a consumer, the fundamental principal you need to keep in mind about ED pricing, or any pricing, for that matter is this: neither the dealer nor BMW is going to sell you a car for $60,000 when they know they can sell it to someone else for $65,000.
What follows from that is: if the dealer let's you buy one of the cars he owns for ED pricing, then the dealer knows that's the market price. Putting two and two together, then, if you buy a car from a dealer and go pick it up in Europe for an ED price of , say, $60,000, you can be reasonably certain you can buy that same car, in the states, for the same amount.
On the issue of buying a car at ED invoice. That car is not owned by the dealer but by BMW. And when BMW allows this pricing to happen, they are revealing to you that the car is not selling fast enough for the assembly line. Again, that means there is a strong possibility you can get the car in the states for the same amount.
Of course, the reverse is also true: if the car sells better than expected then, the price will go up regardless of what the sticker says.
That's the way I see it, anyway.
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      09-05-2013, 03:59 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
You are fundamentally wrong in 90% of the key aspects in your argument, "neither the dealer nor BMW is going to sell you a car for $60,000 when they know they can sell it to someone else for $65,000" You're so wrong as not only the price to build and sell the car is accounted here, there are others factors in a car's price that can lower what you'll pay for, seems strange to me that youre one of the few people that don't know that once you do ED your car is now USED so it'll pay less import taxes hence the car will be cheaper to you, and BMW gets the same price that they charge you, get it, so you are very wrong because BMW can sell a car at 60k and make profit and somebody else paying import taxes on a brand new car will pay 65k but at the end of the day BMW still gets 60k, This is economics 101, you don't have basic knowledge in import/customs taxes, ill keep going,

Second "if you buy a car from a dealer and go pick it up in Europe for an ED price of , say, $60,000, you can be reasonably certain you can buy that same car, in the states, for the same amount." this is wrong too on the basis of what i just explained before, but ill keep the 60k to 65k price that you used as an example, if BMW is ALREADY making a profit selling a car at 60k to the DEALERS, dealers then add to the price to get their profits lets say 65k, so obviously BMW can directly sell you a car for what they sell it to dealer and make profit and you'll be getting a lower price, ITS OBVIOUS that buying directly from the factory instead from a dealer it'll be cheaper, since dealers are intermediaries that need to make profit on the car, then you ask why doesn't everybody does ED well some people don't have the time, some don't care, and when you add the trip costs there really isn't much difference, MB also offers ED and few people choose to go that way, must people have works families etc

Third "And when BMW allows this pricing to happen, they are revealing to you that the car is not selling fast enough for the assembly line" This is plainly a very dumb assumption, when the F10 M5 was released and demand was higher than ever ED was available, ED has nothing to do with car selling well or not, to summarize this was a very opinionated wrong and full of assumptions post, hope you can read more about this topic
Can you elaborate on what determines if whether BMW or Dealer offers ED invoice pricing or not? This understanding in general would be very helpful.
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      09-05-2013, 04:46 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by GOLFFRR View Post
^^David is looking into this every day and rest assure as soon as we know either him or I will def post it up!

I plan on doing ED on my personal M4 as soon as it comes available. I believe David is going to as well. I think it would be cool if there was a huge group of buyers who picked up their M's the same day like when the f10M5 was released.
That would be Awesome!!^ a pack of us could fly over there and race our new M4's around Europe.
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      09-05-2013, 04:49 PM   #27
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Def!! I'm sure bmw would document it all!
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      09-05-2013, 05:12 PM   #28
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That would be Awesome!!^ a pack of us could fly over there and race our new M4's around Europe.
Time that around Oktoberfest, perhaps a few days prior. Pick up the cars and tour Germany for a few days. Back to Munich, drop off the car for shipment and straight to one of the beer tents. That is as ideal as one could do it imo....
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      09-05-2013, 05:51 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sal501 View Post
Can you elaborate on what determines if whether BMW or Dealer offers ED invoice pricing or not? This understanding in general would be very helpful.
Main rule: if the car comes from the dealer's allocation then selling at ED invoice is not going to happen unless dealer really wants to burn that allocation for a scant or simply no profit.
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      09-05-2013, 06:50 PM   #30
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I believe ED stands for erectile dysfunction.
I know someone was going to say this sooner or later.
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      09-06-2013, 01:57 AM   #31
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Can we hope for ZCP on LCI to be available in 2015? (2016 MY) Going with the four door this time around.

I'm hoping that I'll be able to plan ahead this time and combine ED with a vacation back in my homeland of Switzerland
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      09-06-2013, 01:57 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fuddman View Post
Unless you are the owner of the dealership, you're never going to know how a dealer makes his profit, from ED sales or otherwise. That's because you don't have access to his books, methods, etc. Seems obvious enough, yet, a lot of buyers spend a lot of time obsessing over this.

As a consumer, the fundamental principal you need to keep in mind about ED pricing, or any pricing, for that matter is this: neither the dealer nor BMW is going to sell you a car for $60,000 when they know they can sell it to someone else for $65,000.
What follows from that is: if the dealer let's you buy one of the cars he owns for ED pricing, then the dealer knows that's the market price. Putting two and two together, then, if you buy a car from a dealer and go pick it up in Europe for an ED price of , say, $60,000, you can be reasonably certain you can buy that same car, in the states, for the same amount.
On the issue of buying a car at ED invoice. That car is not owned by the dealer but by BMW. And when BMW allows this pricing to happen, they are revealing to you that the car is not selling fast enough for the assembly line. Again, that means there is a strong possibility you can get the car in the states for the same amount.
Of course, the reverse is also true: if the car sells better than expected then, the price will go up regardless of what the sticker says.
That's the way I see it, anyway.
The fundamental point that neither BMW nor dealers are going to sell cars for less than the market will pay makes sense, but I don't think it's as black and white as is lead on here.

The biggest reason BMW offers Euro Delivery is because they think it nets them more sales than not offering it...They wouldn't do it otherwise. Profit-per-unit isn't the only way to maximize profits...selling higher volume helps too. For example, look at the board sponsors on Bimmerfest known for doing ED at the lowest margins over invoice. I'd be willing to bet the increased volume from fulfilling orders for members all over the country more than makes up for the lower profit-per-vehicle they are taking compared to other dealers. Euro delivery buyers are more likely to be enthusiasts who will come back home and tell people how great the experience was, so there's some marketing (possibly increased sales too) for BMW there.

I think most ED buyers are going to be the type that will custom order their new car anyway, not buy off a dealer lot. The dealer takes little (if any) risk on ED orders, which is incentive to offer the car at lower profit than US deliveries. On custom US delivery orders there's a chance the car ends up sitting on the lot if the buyer refuses delivery. Every day the car sits on the dealer's lot it costs them money...just because they can sell it at a higher price to someone else doesn't mean they'll profit more on the transaction if the car sits for a month.
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      09-06-2013, 07:57 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
2 almost deal breakers here I have, will Estoril Blue 2 or Laguna Seca blue be available? will ZCP be available since day one too?

Other than that itd be awesome for us to go and pick up a dozen or more M4s together
As you know nobody knows if any of those will be available. We will have to wait and see when BMW releases the specs and options. If its not a standard color you can always go through BMW indiv and get the color as well (at a fee of course). I dont see that being an issue, however I am not sure if indiv will be available right away thats something David would be able to tell you, he is the expert.

I personally would think BMW being BMW will def have some sort of LCI mid cycle such as a ZCP or something, seems to be a common trend with their history. Either way I am planning on getting one as soon as its available!
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      09-13-2013, 07:40 PM   #34
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Regardless of where it comes from or whos inventory it gets depleted from,
I just know that I'll be picking up my new M4 at the BMW Welt. Period.
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      09-13-2013, 11:48 PM   #35
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GOLFFRR, with the gap between the end of the E9X and starting up the F8X series, how will you be able to manage your allocation if ED is charged against it? There should be plenty of pent up demand including Individual colors. I ask because I am looking forward to ED for an M3.
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      09-13-2013, 11:50 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fun of it View Post
GOLFFRR, with the gap between the end of the E9X and starting up the F8X series, how will you be able to manage your allocation if ED is charged against it? There should be plenty of pent up demand including Individual colors. I ask because I am looking forward to ED for an M3.
I have to say, once BMW opens it up so that ED's on F80/F82 M3's and M4's don't come out of dealer alloc, whichever dealer's smart and set up properly (*cough* GOLFFRR, and a few others ) will make a killing on the pent up demand for such ED's.
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      09-14-2013, 10:04 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fun of it View Post
GOLFFRR, with the gap between the end of the E9X and starting up the F8X series, how will you be able to manage your allocation if ED is charged against it? There should be plenty of pent up demand including Individual colors. I ask because I am looking forward to ED for an M3.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern View Post
I have to say, once BMW opens it up so that ED's on F80/F82 M3's and M4's don't come out of dealer alloc, whichever dealer's smart and set up properly (*cough* GOLFFRR, and a few others ) will make a killing on the pent up demand for such ED's.

David has been taking names and deposits for the M3/M4 for a while now. On that list all the people who put that they want to do ED will remain in the position they are in now. "IF" ED orders do not come out of US allocations (fingers crossed) then of course we would be trying to roll as many ED orders as we can before BMW shuts it of. "IF" this happens I would HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend that you don't hesitate if you ever thought about ED bc once BMW makes dealers take ED orders out of US allocations its going to be tough to near impossible to find pricing under ED MSRP on ED orders.

I would think though however that BMW will make US dealers take all ED orders out of US allocations Lets hope thats not the case but the trend seems to lean that way.
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      09-15-2013, 03:15 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Carlos_Danger View Post
Looking back at my post i just realized im really passionate about ED, i didn't even remember making my case so clear or writing so much
The ED savings has little to do with taxes. Import tax is 2.5% and is not affected by new/used, just declared value. The savings to BMW is mainly in the dealer incentive program. EU cars don't count towards the CSI program or towards the incentive for units sold. That's a pretty significant amount. Also, BMW runs the long term numbers and customers that do one EU delivery on average will stay more loyal to the brand over their lifetime and purchase more BMW's than customers that don't do the program.
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      09-21-2013, 12:18 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLFFRR View Post
David has been taking names and deposits for the M3/M4 for a while now. On that list all the people who put that they want to do ED will remain in the position they are in now. "IF" ED orders do not come out of US allocations (fingers crossed) then of course we would be trying to roll as many ED orders as we can before BMW shuts it of. "IF" this happens I would HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend that you don't hesitate if you ever thought about ED bc once BMW makes dealers take ED orders out of US allocations its going to be tough to near impossible to find pricing under ED MSRP on ED orders.

I would think though however that BMW will make US dealers take all ED orders out of US allocations Lets hope thats not the case but the trend seems to lean that way.
GOLFFRR, how long's the M3/M4 list at Steve Thomas now? Still any chance to get an first/early shipment car? And when do you expect the first customers in the US to take delivery of the new M3/M4?

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      09-21-2013, 10:40 AM   #40
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^^I believe on the M3 we have 12 and the m4 14.

Last time I checked there are a lot of people on the list who want to do ED. Soooo if BMW throws the community a bone and us dealers a bone and lets the ED not come out of US allocations then that list will go pretty fast and we can hook up all the ED buyers with some insane deals. IF they come out of US allocations then it will all depend on how many allocations we and each dealers get. Could be 1 a month or it could be 10 who knows.

We do not officially know when US deliveries, ED deliveries, or even orders will start. BMW has not officially let us know yet. The rumors are US orders start in early 2014 (jan-feb) ED deliveries start March-April time frame and US deliveries summer to end of summer of 2014. These are all rumors though. David has been monitoring all the BMW bulletins and there has yet to be any info on the M3/M4 yet.
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      09-21-2013, 01:17 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLFFRR View Post
^^I believe on the M3 we have 12 and the m4 14.

Last time I checked there are a lot of people on the list who want to do ED. Soooo if BMW throws the community a bone and us dealers a bone and lets the ED not come out of US allocations then that list will go pretty fast and we can hook up all the ED buyers with some insane deals. IF they come out of US allocations then it will all depend on how many allocations we and each dealers get. Could be 1 a month or it could be 10 who knows.

We do not officially know when US deliveries, ED deliveries, or even orders will start. BMW has not officially let us know yet. The rumors are US orders start in early 2014 (jan-feb) ED deliveries start March-April time frame and US deliveries summer to end of summer of 2014. These are all rumors though. David has been monitoring all the BMW bulletins and there has yet to be any info on the M3/M4 yet.
Holy shit, 26 orders.

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      09-21-2013, 02:06 PM   #42
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It's a hot car! Going to be tough to get one when they first come out if you are not on a list and if you do find one you most likely will see them marked up big time
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      09-21-2013, 06:41 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by GOLFFRR
It's a hot car! Going to be tough to get one when they first come out if you are not on a list and if you do find one you most likely will see them marked up big time
I was #5 on the M4 ED list back when Checa was there, but never heard a word after she left. That is contingent on them not coming out of allocation though.
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      09-21-2013, 06:54 PM   #44
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^^I can check on the status for you no problem if you like. You will have to shoot me pm and remind your name again and I can check for you. Checa gave the list she had over to Brie when she left so you should be on there if she had taken you down.
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