Anyone Considering an RS3 Sedan?

[firedown31]

Originally Posted by Kief

With options...maybe this will give us an idea of what the TTRS options will run

Not bad at all. Hoping to get down to the NY auto show next weekend to check it out in person. Though dealer markups may keep me away for now.

[evanescent03]

I've enjoyed my '16 S3 (with tune)... it's decent but doesn't feel nearly as special. the exterior is pretty decent though and the overall interior is very decent for $45k. the RS3 will be nice but I don't see myself getting one over another M3 or C63. I'm afraid the RS3 will cost more than its worth to me (low 50s seems reasonable).

[RACEM4TE]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

I've enjoyed my '16 S3 (with tune)... it's decent but doesn't feel nearly as special. the exterior is pretty decent though and the overall interior is very decent for $45k. the RS3 will be nice but I don't see myself getting one over another M3 or C63. I'm afraid the RS3 will cost more than its worth to me (low 50s seems reasonable).

54k base

[cotmfk]

Originally Posted by Kief

With options...maybe this will give us an idea of what the TTRS options will run

Wow. There is going to be so much plow in this car, they need wider front tires than rear to make it more neutral! Craziness. I'll have to drive one at some point just to see for myself.

[SilverRevlis]

Its hard for me to get past how clinical, plain and overly simple the interior is. I would lose my mind riding in that as a passenger!!!

[auf Deutsch]

Originally Posted by SilverRevlis

Its hard for me to get past how clinical, plain and overly simple the interior is. I would lose my mind riding in that as a passenger!!!

Clinical, plain, and simple describes the exterior as well.

[RACEM4TE]

"Simple" its sexy af

[firedown31]

Originally Posted by RACEM4TE

"Simple" its sexy af

Saw it in ara blue at the NY auto show. I really love it. We'll have to see how dealer demand actually is.

[evanescent03]

just saw an estimate of $60k on the RS3. no way.. I'd be m3 all day. .. if awd were a must then s5 sportback

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

just saw an estimate of $60k on the RS3. no way.. I'd be m3 all day. .. if awd were a must then s5 sportback

No need to estimate anything - pricing was posted earlier in this thread.

A similarly equipped RS5 Sportback is going to be over 80k, and you would have to wait approximately another two years from now before you can actually drive one home.

[cotmfk]

It could be $60k with dealer mark up. We all know how these dealers love doing that when something new hits the market.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by cotmfk

It could be $60k with dealer mark up. We all know how these dealers love doing that when something new hits the market.

I assumed he was talking about a vehicle with some options added. Both base MSRP and option prices are posted earlier in this thread.

This is not going to be a markup-only car. It's not a highly limited vehicle with grossly lopsided demand vs. supply. If a dealership asks you to pay over MSRP, walk away and find a different one. Also, if one is truly interested in an RS3, my advice would be to find a good Audi forum where others are discussing the car so you can find out what typical transaction prices are and where to buy.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

No need to estimate anything - pricing was posted earlier in this thread.

A similarly equipped RS5 Sportback is going to be over 80k, and you would have to wait approximately another two years from now before you can actually drive one home.

except I said S5 not RS5. I see some Canadian ordering guides but not US stuff posted earlier, so that definitely gets it close but it's still a bit of a guess at this point. low to mid 50s would definitely be more fair.

if the seating position is better than in my S3 I'd actually consider making the switch. hopefully they figured out a way to get the seat lower.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

except I said S5 not RS5.

My mistake - I suppose I must have read it wrong because I didn't expect to see that comparison made. An S5 is nice and sporty and so forth but the tradeoff in performance and driving experience vs. an M3 (or what we expect from the RS3) would make it a non-starter for many folks. Same reason an S4 has not been a viable option for most - it's positioned against a 340i or C43 (among others) and performs accordingly. For me, the value just isn't there anymore in that segment.

I see some Canadian ordering guides but not US stuff posted earlier, so that definitely gets it close but it's still a bit of a guess at this point. low to mid 50s would definitely be more fair.

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...7&postcount=70
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...4&postcount=79

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

My mistake - I suppose I must have read it wrong because I didn't expect to see that comparison made. An S5 is nice and sporty and so forth but the tradeoff in performance and driving experience vs. an M3 (or what we expect from the RS3) would make it a non-starter for many folks. Same reason an S4 has not been a viable option for most - it's positioned against a 340i or C43 (among others) and performs accordingly. For me, the value just isn't there anymore in that segment.

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...7&postcount=70
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...4&postcount=79

price comparison is where the S5 and RS3 will compete. neither is a real competitor for an M3/M4, though. the RS3 may have a similar 0-60 time but overall it's going to fall way short as far as driving dynamics and experience. it may be an *alternative* for someone looking for a zippy, cool looking, beefy sounding, sporty interior having car... but it won't be nearly as good as a track day commuter.

thanks the pricing report, I looked and even Googled it. I think I'd definitely want a stripper model if I were to get one but seating position would need to be better. if not, that's where I'd go from the s5 sportback. and the reason I am comparing the two is because the S4/S5 is a nice car that feels more special than the MSport cars despite similar price/performance. the RS3 surely will be more rare and special than the S4/S5 but as a commuter car, the same money may be spent better on the larger models for me. neither would be my track car. that being said I haven't driven either yet but I do know my S3 has really started to bother me bc I sit so darn high in it. but otherwise it's quick (tuned), has a reasonably nice interior and looks pretty sharp, so an RS3 should make a fun commuter that's a step up.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

price comparison is where the S5 and RS3 will compete. neither is a real competitor for an M3/M4, though. the RS3 may have a similar 0-60 time but overall it's going to fall way short as far as driving dynamics and experience. it may be an *alternative* for someone looking for a zippy, cool looking, beefy sounding, sporty interior having car... but it won't be nearly as good as a track day commuter.

While I agree with you that the RS3 definitely isn't an M3 competitor either, I still think it will offer much more value than any similarly priced non-M/AMG/RS vehicle one might measure it up against.

Think about an M2. That clearly isn't an M4 competitor. Yet if we want to step down in price from the M4, the choice between an M2 and 440i is very clear for an enthusiast - you'll see almost universal preference for the former. Do a poll if you are truly curious or skeptical, but I think you know what the results would show. RS3 vs. S5 is that same type of no-brainer choice for most of us. Not everyone, no, but most.

Regarding performance, what I know is that a TT RS gets plenty of favorable reviews. An RS3 is a similar setup, the two share a chassis and many components. Now, it won't be quite as close as an M3/M4 are in performance but we are not talking about two cars with completely different DNA. Furthermore, and perhaps more germane to the discussion - if the RS3 can't match the M3 driving experience, the S5 is going to be even worse. It certainly won't feel like a special car since ~350-ish hp sport sedans this size with no specific appeal to an enthusiast are a dime a dozen, all day long. You may want to say that the S5 has the better chassis configuration than the RS3 due to the RWD bias and north-south engine. However, the MLB Audis are still prone to understeering just as the MQB are. Plus, the latest MQB is reported by testers to be markedly evolved from past efforts.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

While I agree with you that the RS3 definitely isn't an M3 competitor either, I still think it will offer much more value than any similarly priced non-M/AMG/RS vehicle one might measure it up against.

Think about an M2. That clearly isn't an M4 competitor. Yet if we want to step down in price from the M4, the choice between an M2 and 440i is very clear for an enthusiast - you'll see almost universal preference for the former. Do a poll if you are truly curious or skeptical, but I think you know what the results would show. RS3 vs. S5 is that same type of no-brainer choice for most of us. Not everyone, no, but most.

Regarding performance, what I know is that a TT RS gets plenty of favorable reviews. An RS3 is a similar setup, the two share a chassis and many components. Now, it won't be quite as close as an M3/M4 are in performance but we are not talking about two cars with completely different DNA. Furthermore, and perhaps more germane to the discussion - if the RS3 can't match the M3 driving experience, the S5 is going to be even worse. It certainly won't feel like a special car since ~350-ish hp sport sedans this size with no specific appeal to an enthusiast are a dime a dozen, all day long. You may want to say that the S5 has the better chassis configuration than the RS3 due to the RWD bias and north-south engine. However, the MLB Audis are still prone to understeering just as the MQB are. Plus, the latest MQB is reported by testers to be markedly evolved from past efforts.

I would need to drive the RS3 to really have an opinion here ... but I do have a hard time believing the RS3 will be a similar driving experience as the TTRS. I could definitely be wrong though.

compared to the S5, the RS3 is surely the more enthusiast oriented build, but again, I feel like the S cars do feel/look a bit more special than the MSport cars as there is more to set the S cars apart from their plain vanilla siblings. (namely exhausts & seats along with the interior/exterior trim, brakes, wheels, etc). the S5 isn't a hard core enthusiast car or a track car, but as a commuter, it's likely much nicer inside than the RS3 and roomier. it's also pretty quick and will be fast with a tune while being more of a sleeper. the reason I'd get the S5 over the RS3 is getting more for the price in the dept of a commuter than the RS3 while still retaining some fun and style (compared to most sedans).

if I could get one of each, I would! and again, I really need to drive them both to really know if the RS3 lives up to the hype.

[DS_BMW]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

that being said I haven't driven either yet but I do know my S3 has really started to bother me bc I sit so darn high in it. but otherwise it's quick (tuned), has a reasonably nice interior and looks pretty sharp, so an RS3 should make a fun commuter that's a step up.

I thought the same thing when I drove the S3. Seating position is to high. Now it had standard seats. Do the manual sport seats sit lower?

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

I would need to drive the RS3 to really have an opinion here ... but I do have a hard time believing the RS3 will be a similar driving experience as the TTRS. I could definitely be wrong though.

Fair. From my perspective, if they've gone and messed with the chassis any more than necessary to accommodate whatever nuanced preference customers who prefer the sedan form factor might lean toward (if that is even a thing or is necessary), then they've really screwed the pooch big time. An RS3 Sportback is a known quantity, and that quantity = beast, and that's with the old engine, even. I think this new iteration, including the addition of the sedan sibling are going to be home runs.

compared to the S5, the RS3 is surely the more enthusiast oriented build, but again, I feel like the S cars do feel/look a bit more special than the MSport cars as there is more to set the S cars apart from their plain vanilla siblings. (namely exhausts & seats along with the interior/exterior trim, brakes, wheels, etc).

I think this is the primary area where we differ. Using an example closer to home for me, even if BMW literally transplanted the interior from the M4 into the 440i and only barely nudged the price up, I'm still taking the M2 home every single day. I want the car to give me performance/$ first, everything else is of secondary or lesser importance.

if I could get one of each, I would! and again, I really need to drive them both to really know if the RS3 lives up to the hype.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

Fair. From my perspective, if they've gone and messed with the chassis any more than necessary to accommodate whatever nuanced preference customers who prefer the sedan form factor might lean toward (if that is even a thing or is necessary), then they've really screwed the pooch big time. An RS3 Sportback is a known quantity, and that quantity = beast, and that's with the old engine, even. I think this new iteration, including the addition of the sedan sibling are going to be home runs.

I think this is the primary area where we differ. Using an example closer to home for me, even if BMW literally transplanted the interior from the M4 into the 440i and only barely nudged the price up, I'm still taking the M2 home every single day. I want the car to give me performance/$ first, everything else is of secondary or lesser importance.

for a fun car that i would just commute with and do track days in, the M2 would be my pick over an S, Msport, etc also. however, I need a larger-than-M2 car to move the kids around in and to sip my coffee in on my way to work. I got a camaro SS 1LE for when I need the "driving experience" which is immense. I tried really hard to find a car that did it ALL (car seats and commute and track days). m3 was the closest I could get. RS3 is probably okay in that regard but it'll lack the RWD fun I enjoy at the track. there's no perfect car and that's why I split it up into the 1LE and S3. both serve their purpose well but each falls short in other areas. add in a Yukon Denali for longer trips and hauling and it's a near-perfect balance for our family.

I think for a lot of people who don't plan on tracking their cars the RS3, M3 and c63 are a bit much since so much of that performance is inaccessible to a responsible, law-abiding driver. however, of course, if the money is there, no reason not to

[Dethsupp0rt]

Originally Posted by DS_BMW

I thought the same thing when I drove the S3. Seating position is to high. Now it had standard seats. Do the manual sport seats sit lower?

Yes, the manual S sport seats are lower.

[Spike Spiegel]

Originally Posted by mkoesel

No need to estimate anything - pricing was posted earlier in this thread.

A similarly equipped RS5 Sportback is going to be over 80k, and you would have to wait approximately another two years from now before you can actually drive one home.

Have to wonder if their is going to be an RS5 sportback (i've been looking, can't find confirmation except for Car and Driver, but with no source?) . I'd love to see one, as would some fellow Audi goers. I don't think the RS5 coupe starts selling till late this year. If they are going to make a sportback, wonder when it would be announced and if the US gets it.