Bilstein B16 Damptronic - Too stiff for the street?

[ASRman]

Hi guys,

I am on the fence about ordering this damptronic coilover set for my F80 ZCP. Seems like there are mixed reviews, specifically in terms of how stiff this set up really is for daily driving. I don't mind a stiff ride and predominantly drive in sport or sport plus on my ZCP EDC stock dampers.

I am just trying to get an idea of just how stiff this set up really is by way of comparison to stock ZCP comfort sport and sport plus EDC modes. Is comfort on the Bilstein damptronic equivalent to sport on stock EDC? If so that will be more than acceptable to me however any stiffer would probably become a headache.

I appreciate that it will be nearly impossible for me to get a true idea of how stiff these coils are without actually riding in a car running this set up. Also comfort is in itself very subjective.

Has anyone tried these dampers back to back with the likes of KW V3 or KW DDC and could provide some feedback on the comparison?

Thanks

[TopJimmy]

Call Kies Motorsports and ask Bryan his advice. He ran B16 Damptronics on his ride (for a short bit).

[stevehifi]

if you're riding in sport plus most of the time you'll be fine. It also makes a difference what kind of tire you run, I run PSC2 with alot stiffer sidewalls than let's say a PS4S, so it's a lot more harsh.

Definitely not a plush ride.. those bilsteins are stiff...

[KakashiSenpai]

I've commented about this exact question in a few discussions. I'm sure with a little of digging you will find my comments along with other views.

Long story short; I've driven on stock ZCP,kw v3's, B16 EDC & KW DDC. If the KW DDC is within budget, I would buy them 5x over any other suspension I just mentioned.

B16's are still decent but I had them at the lowest setting (which is probably what made them ride so harsh) & I wasn't satisfied with the ride height & ride quality. KW DDC gave me everything I was looking for and I feel are the perfect street coil over suspension if you want something on the softer side.

If you don't care for slamming the car & don't mind having a firmer ride (maybe yours is just a weekend toy) then b16's may be for you. Like I said there is ALOT of threads already talking about this if you do your research but this was my overall take.

[jfritz27]

I'm also close to pulling the trigger on B16 Damptronic. I've become fairly serious about tracking, so my priority is optimizing handling in that scenario, though my F80 is my daily driver as well. As others have mentioned, what I've gathered in aggregate is that they are quite stiff on the street, particularly if you slam them -- and obviously running a stiff tire isn't going to help. If you're comfortable with OEM Sport+, then sounds like with just a modest drop and allowing for break-in, you might be OK.

If you're not going to track, then KW DDC is probably the way to go comfort-wise. Regarding their track performance, I've heard feedback from one vendor that at least one customer commented on how KW DDC on track is sub-optimal, with more-than-expected body roll.

[SteveChester]

I have a set of these - in Sport+ they are really stiff ( too stiff for the road ). Comfort mode is OK.

I'm still running MPSS and plan to move over to MP4S as and when.

Really improved the handling of the car though.

[hellokitty]

I have a detailed review posted. You might want to check that out.

Even on Sport Plus and Cup 2 tires, I think it's a great suspension. The damping is so much better and more comfortable over bumpy roads compared to the stock zcp setup.

The B16 kit solved every issue handling wise for me. My wife tells me the car feels like a go cart.

[spdrcrgtr]

So I just got these installed yesterday (Bilstein damptronics on my 2020 M4 Comp).

Right now they are still settling and don't have them perfectly setup or aligned (waiting for them to settle), but here are my initial comments:

NOTE: I had Eibach prokit's in it prior on stock shocks

1. I lowered it to have 1 finger gap in the front and no gap in the rear

2. The car is GLUED to the ground. I put in sway bars prior and now with the new coilovers, it's 100% on rails.

3. The car is a lot stiffer and even slightly bouncer, but I suspect the bounce could be corrected with adjustment in height and alignment since all 4 wheels have a lot of negative camber at this point.

4. I plan on tracking my car 1-5 times per year, but I mostly daily drive and canyons once in a while. If I cant adjust out the bounce I may go back to static springs. I know that it may not handle as well, but I would rather sacrifice some handling for better ride quality on the streets.

Overall the ride quality is fine and you WILL feel each crack in the road, but it's not harsh. I feel that the coilovers are fine-tuned instruments that can pick up the small details of the road, while the stock setup was more numb to it.

[irunalot]

hellokitty Did the car get a smoother when the springs settled?

I personally love a car with a very stiff ride, so I'm looking forward to mine getting installed.

The bounce should be dampened out unless the springs need to settle a bit and dampers need to be "broken in".

Are the springs on the B16Ds progressive? That can cause some bounce issues if the car is lowered to an extreme.

[spdrcrgtr]

After a few days of driving i do feel some of the bounce is going away. I hoping it goes away completely

[spdrcrgtr]

raised up the rear a bit and alot of the bounce went away; just in case anyone wants to know

[clutchdj]

Can you post pics of the whole car @ new ride height?

[irunalot]

Originally Posted by spdrcrgtr

raised up the rear a bit and alot of the bounce went away; just in case anyone wants to know

I wonder how much of that has to do with a progressive spring. They will rebound a bit quicker on rebound when they are highly compressed in a car is really low. At least they look progressive in pics, I do not have proof that they are.

Glad to hear that the bounce has diminished.

[AlterZgo]

Originally Posted by spdrcrgtr

So I just got these installed yesterday (Bilstein damptronics on my 2020 M4 Comp).

Right now they are still settling and don't have them perfectly setup or aligned (waiting for them to settle), but here are my initial comments:

NOTE: I had Eibach prokit's in it prior on stock shocks

1. I lowered it to have 1 finger gap in the front and no gap in the rear

2. The car is GLUED to the ground. I put in sway bars prior and now with the new coilovers, it's 100% on rails.

3. The car is a lot stiffer and even slightly bouncer, but I suspect the bounce could be corrected with adjustment in height and alignment since all 4 wheels have a lot of negative camber at this point.

I'll bet that your issues with the bounciness and stiffness of the ride is more due to excessive lowering than anything. Raise the car up a bit, add back some suspension travel and I'm sure ride and handling will both improve.

[///M-pressed]

I'm running these and can confirm that they bounce a little, although I haven't put many miles on them.

I might raise the car a bit if the bounce doesn't go away as it can get a little annoying.

However, the car is absolutely planted and feels amazing to drive. I wouldn't say they're uncomfortable or annoying, but they can bounce a little on slightly bumpy roads.

[spdrcrgtr]

Originally Posted by AlterZgo

I'll bet that your issues with the bounciness and stiffness of the ride is more due to excessive lowering than anything. Raise the car up a bit, add back some suspension travel and I'm sure ride and handling will both improve.

Ya, added a bit back in the bank and it feels alot better. The front isnt "that" low... theres about a "1 finger" gap in the front, while no gap in the rear, but not tucked.

[AlterZgo]

Originally Posted by spdrcrgtr

Ya, added a bit back in the bank and it feels alot better. The front isnt "that" low... theres about a "1 finger" gap in the front, while no gap in the rear, but not tucked.

LOL. 1 finger gap in front may not be very low from an appearance standpoint, but it is actually very low from a suspension travel standpoint. You're basically taking away a good 1.5"+ of front suspension travel. That's going to impact ride and handling.

I have found that people often complain about poor ride quality of XYZ springs or coilovers or shocks without really taking into consideration what happens when you remove suspension travel. If the stock suspension has 3 inches of travel before it fully compresses, but you take away 2" of that travel by lowering the car 2", it can now only compress 1" before bottoming out. When you bottom out the suspension, the spring rate basically ramps up to infinity and the ride quality feels really bad. Then people will claim that a certain spring or shock or coilover has bad ride quality.

The poor ride wasn't due to overly stiff springs or super firm compression damping, but just due to the physics of the car bottoming out more from lack of suspension travel.

Some people will then turn the dampers softer hoping to fix the ride quality but doing this can exacerbate the issue b/c softer compression damping makes it even easier to bottom out the suspension. Conversely, increasing the compression damping can improve the ride quality b/c the stiffer damping prevents the car from hitting the bumpstops as much.

[spdrcrgtr]

Originally Posted by AlterZgo

LOL. 1 finger gap in front may not be very low from an appearance standpoint, but it is actually very low from a suspension travel standpoint. You're basically taking away a good 1.5"+ of front suspension travel. That's going to impact ride and handling.

I have found that people often complain about poor ride quality of XYZ springs or coilovers or shocks without really taking into consideration what happens when you remove suspension travel. If the stock suspension has 3 inches of travel before it fully compresses, but you take away 2" of that travel by lowering the car 2", it can now only compress 1" before bottoming out. When you bottom out the suspension, the spring rate basically ramps up to infinity and the ride quality feels really bad. Then people will claim that a certain spring or shock or coilover has bad ride quality.

The poor ride wasn't due to overly stiff springs or super firm compression damping, but just due to the physics of the car bottoming out more from lack of suspension travel.

Some people will then turn the dampers softer hoping to fix the ride quality but doing this can exacerbate the issue b/c softer compression damping makes it even easier to bottom out the suspension. Conversely, increasing the compression damping can improve the ride quality b/c the stiffer damping prevents the car from hitting the bump stops as much.

Hm; I hear what you're saying (side note this is not my first lowered car). In the past, when I had my car lowered on static springs, it was more harsh than stock, but had reasonable comfort. These are actually my first set of coilovers; in previous cars, I always had a basic spring/strut combo, so i thought it wouldn't have this suspension attitude on coilovers.

[jaycdynasty]

Originally Posted by KakashiSenpai

I've commented about this exact question in a few discussions. I'm sure with a little of digging you will find my comments along with other views.

Long story short; I've driven on stock ZCP,kw v3's, B16 EDC & KW DDC. If the KW DDC is within budget, I would buy them 5x over any other suspension I just mentioned.

B16's are still decent but I had them at the lowest setting (which is probably what made them ride so harsh) & I wasn't satisfied with the ride height & ride quality. KW DDC gave me everything I was looking for and I feel are the perfect street coil over suspension if you want something on the softer side.

If you don't care for slamming the car & don't mind having a firmer ride (maybe yours is just a weekend toy) then b16's may be for you. Like I said there is ALOT of threads already talking about this if you do your research but this was my overall take.

What about the V3? How is it compare with the B16? Im struggling on this too but The Kw DDC is not my option cuz of the budget.

[irunalot]

From what I am going through I suggest you get the KWs. I was told by Bilstein to raise my car 1.5 due to lack of preload on the fronts which make a thinking sound at slow speed.. So I'm raising it and removing their suspension.

What are the thoughts from others with the Bilsteins, are you lowered near this height?

I don't think this is low at all but would like to hear form others.

[BzsBimmer]

^ I posted on your other thread. Mine is lower than yours and have no noise.

Not sure why you have one issue you’d want to take it off without fully investigating the noise. I thinks it’s either install issue or possibly mfg defect

[hellokitty]

Originally Posted by irunalot

From what I am going through I suggest you get the KWs. I was told by Bilstein to raise my car 1.5 due to lack of preload on the fronts which make a thinking sound at slow speed.. So I'm raising it and removing their suspension.

What are the thoughts from others with the Bilsteins, are you lowered near this height?

I don't think this is low at all but would like to hear form others.

The clunking sound is trapped debris. I spray my wheel wells down heavily after every wash and this did the trick. No more clunks.